Without a doubt, MapTools is currently a superior tool for the advanced internet gamer. It has more to offer in almost every area you asked about.
The one place the WotC Table shines is in simplicity and ease of use. For people new to table-tops, its easy to just jump in and play.
Compare MS Paint to Photoshop. Photoshop is far superior. But if all you want to do is draw a scribble, MS Paint is the way to go.
If all you want to do is Play D&D, the WotC table will probably be the tool of choice within a year.
So, the WoTC VT is for scribblers? Not a good analogy, really.
Seriously, why can't it be both? In fact, it should be both. As a seasoned gamer, what I need are tools that make my game run faster and smoother and easier. Tools they have been saying were coming, but looks like won't really come, outside of those needed to run this simpler VT.
Don't forget it's still in beta, and there is a list of feature requests, and open dialogue on how people intend to use the table if all those features were there. I think that with time, like all the other tables out there that it will shine.
Without a doubt, MapTools is currently a superior tool for the advanced internet gamer. It has more to offer in almost every area you asked about.
The one place the WotC Table shines is in simplicity and ease of use. For people new to table-tops, its easy to just jump in and play.
Compare MS Paint to Photoshop. Photoshop is far superior. But if all you want to do is draw a scribble, MS Paint is the way to go.
If all you want to do is Play D&D, the WotC table will probably be the tool of choice within a year.
So, the WoTC VT is for scribblers? Not a good analogy, really.
Seriously, why can't it be both? In fact, it should be both. As a seasoned gamer, what I need are tools that make my game run faster and smoother and easier. Tools they have been saying were coming, but looks like won't really come, outside of those needed to run this simpler VT.
Don't forget it's still in beta, and there is a list of feature requests, and open dialogue on how people intend to use the table if all those features were there. I think that with time, like all the other tables out there that it will shine.
Joe
I know, but some very good questions have been asked about what they plan, but they haven't said.
It's old. Say one thing, can't do it, switch tracks, then switch tracks again. I mean really.
Without a doubt, MapTools is currently a superior tool for the advanced internet gamer. It has more to offer in almost every area you asked about.
The one place the WotC Table shines is in simplicity and ease of use. For people new to table-tops, its easy to just jump in and play.
Compare MS Paint to Photoshop. Photoshop is far superior. But if all you want to do is draw a scribble, MS Paint is the way to go.
If all you want to do is Play D&D, the WotC table will probably be the tool of choice within a year.
So, the WoTC VT is for scribblers? Not a good analogy, really.
Seriously, why can't it be both? In fact, it should be both. As a seasoned gamer, what I need are tools that make my game run faster and smoother and easier. Tools they have been saying were coming, but looks like won't really come, outside of those needed to run this simpler VT.
Honestly, (and here, I really only have my impressions of WOTC_Josh to go on) I think they aim to eventually make it superior to map tools. However, Maptools has had a lot longer to get to where it is, and a lot more work done on the consumer end to make it work well. I expect that at full launch, it will still be a bit feature poor compared to maptools, however I really think that a lot of the things it is missing now will be added in.
I know they are looking for feedback on the tools and how they can improve them, much of which will be implemented. However, it is still fairly early in the developement cycle(I get the impression some of the beta code is still being written, let alone implementing feedback).
My prediction right now is that at launch the VT will be something like Photoshop Elements, while thMaptools, etc., are more like the professional Photoshop. i.e. that it will have simplified and user freindly versions of most of what maptools et al have, but that maptools will still be capable of more high end and crunch heavy customisation.
Seriously, why can't it be both? In fact, it should be both. As a seasoned gamer, what I need are tools that make my game run faster and smoother and easier. Tools they have been saying were coming, but looks like won't really come, outside of those needed to run this simpler VT.
I don't know how viable it really would be to try and have 'both'. From what I've seen, Maptools remains better for my purposes, because I've gotten to the point where I enjoy having long elaborate macros that check for crits, add in bonus damage if I've got Bless Weapon up, etc. I doubt I'd have that functionality with the WotC VT - at least, certainly not early on, and certainly not the ability to program it in myself.
But at the same time, I remember when our group started with Maptools, and how long it took for us to really start to master it. A VT that people can pop right into and quickly have the tools they need? That is valuable. And I think has more potential in the long run to add the extra options - if not the ability to code things in ourselves, then the possibility of having those extra dynamics built into the game, especially if integration with other tools are added.
Even if I prefer Maptools for my own group, I don't think WotC is making a mistake in starting off with a simpler, cleaner platform. And I think has the potential, in the long run, to have a better tool for all purposes... at least, for those playing 4E.
Without a doubt, MapTools is currently a superior tool for the advanced internet gamer. It has more to offer in almost every area you asked about.
The one place the WotC Table shines is in simplicity and ease of use. For people new to table-tops, its easy to just jump in and play.
Compare MS Paint to Photoshop. Photoshop is far superior. But if all you want to do is draw a scribble, MS Paint is the way to go.
If all you want to do is Play D&D, the WotC table will probably be the tool of choice within a year.
So, the WoTC VT is for scribblers? Not a good analogy, really.
Seriously, why can't it be both? In fact, it should be both. As a seasoned gamer, what I need are tools that make my game run faster and smoother and easier. Tools they have been saying were coming, but looks like won't really come, outside of those needed to run this simpler VT.
*shrugs* I don't really care whether the analogy is 'good', as long as my point is clear.
The VT Developers are limited by the resources available to them. They are going to apply those resources towards getting a functional product that serves the minimum needs at first, and will add more features as the product matures.
But at the same time, I remember when our group started with Maptools, and how long it took for us to really start to master it. A VT that people can pop right into and quickly have the tools they need? That is valuable. And I think has more potential in the long run to add the extra options - if not the ability to code things in ourselves, then the possibility of having those extra dynamics built into the game, especially if integration with other tools are added.
Even if I prefer Maptools for my own group, I don't think WotC is making a mistake in starting off with a simpler, cleaner platform. And I think has the potential, in the long run, to have a better tool for all purposes... at least, for those playing 4E.
I distinctly remember the thought process that went through my head when I considered running a 4e game online using Maptool. That thought process was 'Ummm how the hell am I going to learn this well enough to run a decent game at the same time as learning the new 4e rules?' (not to mention the map making learning curve as well)
I wasn't expecting anything more from a free product (with a dedicated but small community) and I know that if you have the skill and time to put into it Maptool is a great system, but for a non programmer like me the idea of scripting this and that was intimidating. This all happened about 2 years ago before the frameworks for 4e were around.
I think the VT will be great for people just wanting to play 4e (or other systems that are similar and/or use a grid for combat like 3.5). I think that they need to get some more things in there for launch (all the status conditions for one!) and keep building on it and it will be a great product for the community.
To be fair to MapTool, it's possible to play quite simply without any scripting, and the learning curve is really pretty short if you do that - it doesn't take that long to learn how to create a map, put tokens on it, and share it. Dice rolling is done in chat, and it comes with a set of conditions built in, and so forth - you never need to script anything.
However, what it lacks is an intuitive setup for simple scripts, like the VT's setting up of powers. Creating a macro in MapTool and creating a power in the VT are the same thing. If you're writing a power, MapTool wants you to create a macro button called "Blazing Sword of Fire"
Blazing Sword of Fire: [1d20] vs. AC. Damage [1d10+9] fire damage.
where the VT presents a nice interface to do the same.
I'm not disputing the ease of the VT or the fact that MapTool isn't dead simple to operate, but MapTool isn't "script it or you can't do anything"; you can run with it pretty quickly. It's only if you want to go deep that the curve gets steep.
I'd ask a question to the people is currently betatesting the VTT.
In your opinion, why VTT would be (or not, of course) better than the rptools, that's a shareware?
Could you import images from pictures to create maps? Could you customize macros? Is it as flexible as rptools (from DM point of view)?
I'd really know something more, cause i'm using succesfully rptools and before migrating to vtt i'd understand if it's worth of it.
Thak u very much for your feedback.
Bye
Nemblin --- Happy (for now) DDI subscriber
As a user of Maptools, and a beta subscriber, I would say the VT has the potential to be a good replacement for Maptools if you are playing 4e.
Let me list some of the advantages and potential advantages of the VT
1. Ease of use. Even in its current beta format, the VT is real easy to pickup and start using right from the get go.
2. VoIP as part of the program. While I don't have any direct experience in this situation, I have read that there have been issues of trying to run a campaign server and VoIP programs from the same machine. I am not sure if this has gotten any better recently or not.
3. Speaking of servers, the availability to do a pick up or one off session is very good. Since D&D has it's own audience, this would allow myself and others to do a quick game at a time convenient for us, but not always convenient for our respective groups.
4. Potential for interaction of other D&Di Tools, and published adventure support. WotC would be seriously missing out by not incorporating this ability. The ability for me, as a DM, to pick an adventure out of Dungeon, for example, load it up on the VT and run it for my friends in the same amount of time (or less) than it takes for them to make up their characters would be AWESOME.
5. Full campaign & combat Tracking capability. If the VT can fully track a combat/skill challenge session for me, I'm sold. This includes PC's and monster actions, status effects, Line of sight/effect, etc.
On the flip side, here are some advantages that Maptools has, and will probably keep based on the speculation that the VT will only support 4e.
1. Maptools is free.
2. Maptools is not setting specific, so it doesn't matter if you play 1e, Pathfinder, Star Wars RPG, you can use this program in almost, if not all, of your gaming endeavors.
3. Maptools does not require an internet connection in order to run a game. If you play face to face, one PC with 2 monitors is all you really need with this program.
4. Customization. Maptools allows one to make their games as interactive as they want, from the absolute basic (a map and tokens) to the fully interactive. Granted you may have to program some of your own or make a request for a feature, but that is up to you.
5. The community is awesome. The support that a person receives if they have problems, and the resources that people create on their own time to support this project is second to none.
In the end, I think that if WotC focussed the capabilities of the VT to support 4e, while supplementing it with the other tools, it could become a very powerful and useful tool.
Until then, I will keep using Maptools and enjoying what I have in front of me.
Without a doubt, MapTools is currently a superior tool for the advanced internet gamer. It has more to offer in almost every area you asked about.
The one place the WotC Table shines is in simplicity and ease of use. For people new to table-tops, its easy to just jump in and play.
Compare MS Paint to Photoshop. Photoshop is far superior. But if all you want to do is draw a scribble, MS Paint is the way to go.
If all you want to do is Play D&D, the WotC table will probably be the tool of choice within a year.
So, the WoTC VT is for scribblers? Not a good analogy, really.
Seriously, why can't it be both? In fact, it should be both. As a seasoned gamer, what I need are tools that make my game run faster and smoother and easier. Tools they have been saying were coming, but looks like won't really come, outside of those needed to run this simpler VT.
*shrugs* I don't really care whether the analogy is 'good', as long as my point is clear.
The VT Developers are limited by the resources available to them. They are going to apply those resources towards getting a functional product that serves the minimum needs at first, and will add more features as the product matures.
Well, if you want to say that WoTC's VT is on the level of an free with OS software meant for playing around with, compared to a professional piece of software that is a helpful tool, that can be used by novices and gurus alike, and has a learning curve that's easy, then maybe your analogy is good.
As for limited resources. I accept that for how many products they can work on, and how fast they can get products out.
It's not an excuse for the quality of the tool, and it's lack of usefulness to the user.
