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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 9:30AM
#121
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Date Joined:
Dec 12, 2005
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The thing is, you don't have to. There's this...myth that you have to program MapTool to play D&D (or anything) but it's simply not true.
I also said "I also don't want to go out and get Joe or Frank's custom this or custom that and try to figure out how to make it work and then play a game that needs Frank's mods, but won't work with Joe's or whatever." and that's what I encountered the first time trying MapTool. I couldn't just get MapTool as-is and log into a game session. It took some doing to get all the community mods/scripts and get it working right just to play. And if I stop using MapTool for a month or so I will bet that I'll be out hunting for the latest mods/scripts just to play a game again.
My LFR Modules: Spoiler:
Show
EAST1-3 Unbidden (H3)
EAST2-3 Nightmares (P1)
NETH3-1 Secrets and Shadows (Paragon Tier) (Author)
ELTU3-6 True Blue (Heroic Tier) (Author)
EPIC3-3 The Tangled Skein of Destiny (Co-Author)
ABER4-3 A Little Rebellion (Paragon Tier) (Author)
WATE4-1 Paying the Piper (Heroic Tier) (Co-Author)
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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 9:55AM
#122
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The thing is, you don't have to. There's this...myth that you have to program MapTool to play D&D (or anything) but it's simply not true.
I also said "I also don't want to go out and get Joe or Frank's custom this or custom that and try to figure out how to make it work and then play a game that needs Frank's mods, but won't work with Joe's or whatever." and that's what I encountered the first time trying MapTool. I couldn't just get MapTool as-is and log into a game session. It took some doing to get all the community mods/scripts and get it working right just to play. And if I stop using MapTool for a month or so I will bet that I'll be out hunting for the latest mods/scripts just to play a game again.
I think you misunderstood me: what I'm saying is yes you could absolutely get MapTool as-is and sign into a game. That's what I did for my group. That's how we started playing online: I made a map, threw some tokens on it, told them to download MapTool and log in to the game I was hosting. Gaming...done.
Obviously somebody has to make a map and/or gather tokens, and host the game, but beyond that, no frameworks, mods, or even macros. After a while of that, I found that I wanted to learn how to automate it, but strictly speaking, there's no more need for automation with MT than there is for the VT.
Roll dice in chat, move tokens on the map, kill orcs, drink Dew.
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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 10:02AM
#123
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Date Joined:
Dec 12, 2005
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wanted[/i] to learn how to automate it, but strictly speaking, there's no more need for automation with MT than there is for the VT.
Roll dice in chat, move tokens on the map, kill orcs, drink Dew.
Well, I played my first MapTool game a few weeks ago and it wasn't that easy. It was a bit of a pain to get what was needed and very messy if you ask me. I want slick, smooth integration and practically no learning curve. I will say that after I was actually in the game that MapTool had some impressive features, but the interface was ugly and very clunky.
My LFR Modules: Spoiler:
Show
EAST1-3 Unbidden (H3)
EAST2-3 Nightmares (P1)
NETH3-1 Secrets and Shadows (Paragon Tier) (Author)
ELTU3-6 True Blue (Heroic Tier) (Author)
EPIC3-3 The Tangled Skein of Destiny (Co-Author)
ABER4-3 A Little Rebellion (Paragon Tier) (Author)
WATE4-1 Paying the Piper (Heroic Tier) (Co-Author)
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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 10:28AM
#124
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wanted[/i] to learn how to automate it, but strictly speaking, there's no more need for automation with MT than there is for the VT.
Roll dice in chat, move tokens on the map, kill orcs, drink Dew.
Well, I played my first MapTool game a few weeks ago and it wasn't that easy. It was a bit of a pain to get what was needed and very messy if you ask me. I want slick, smooth integration and practically no learning curve. I will say that after I was actually in the game that MapTool had some impressive features, but the interface was ugly and very clunky.
That's what the VT needs to be, in my opinion.
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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 10:48AM
#125
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Well, I played my first MapTool game a few weeks ago and it wasn't that easy. It was a bit of a pain to get what was needed and very messy if you ask me. I want slick, smooth integration and practically no learning curve. I will say that after I was actually in the game that MapTool had some impressive features, but the interface was ugly and very clunky.
Yeah, these are things I definitely don't dispute - the interface and how that relates to and enables ease of use in MT is not where it should (or could) be. The VT, on the other hand, is farther ahead on that front.
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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 10:53AM
#126
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Well, I played my first MapTool game a few weeks ago and it wasn't that easy. It was a bit of a pain to get what was needed and very messy if you ask me. I want slick, smooth integration and practically no learning curve. I will say that after I was actually in the game that MapTool had some impressive features, but the interface was ugly and very clunky.
Yeah, these are things I definitely don't dispute - the interface and how that relates to and enables ease of use in MT is not where it should (or could) be. The VT, on the other hand, is farther ahead on that front.
Now, if we can just get the two to go on a date, and hope MapTools is trampy, then who knows what the offspring might be!
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3 years ago ::
Dec 10, 2010 - 12:44PM
#127
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Date Joined:
Apr 29, 2008
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Well, I played my first MapTool game a few weeks ago and it wasn't that easy. It was a bit of a pain to get what was needed and very messy if you ask me. I want slick, smooth integration and practically no learning curve. I will say that after I was actually in the game that MapTool had some impressive features, but the interface was ugly and very clunky.
Yeah, these are things I definitely don't dispute - the interface and how that relates to and enables ease of use in MT is not where it should (or could) be. The VT, on the other hand, is farther ahead on that front.
Now, if we can just get the two to go on a date, and hope MapTools is trampy, then who knows what the offspring might be!
So one question I have is what could make the MT interface better? I can see that the dockable windows might seem ugly to many... is that the thing that people don't like and think is ugly?
While I agree the Screenshots and videos I have seen of VT make it pretty, it appears to lack customization of the interface as in "I want the chat window this high", I want the init window over there. While MT's ugly interface makes that possible. For me, function over form more important than form over function. Others may feel differently.
As Mock noted, there MT and VT seem to be on fairly level ground at this point as to what is "needed" to play D&D 4E specifically.
VT has a much cleaner interface, but that comes at the cost of customization
VT has voice support built it. This is important for some, not so much for me... I can take it or leave it, but mostly I only play FtF(for which VT online only "may" be a limiting factor!)
VT has a lobby for pick up games. While I don't do pick up games, this is a big win for VT IMO.
Disclaimer: I have contributed a large number of bug fixes and functionality improvements to MT in the past 6-9 months, including the just released Individual FOW views per token feature. For me, the ability to modify the source code will keep me with MapTool no matter what features VT gets. Of course, others don't have this luxury. On the flip side, I have put in many features in MapTool's main code that I have not or never will use at the request of user because...well it was easy for me to do.
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3 years ago ::
Dec 11, 2010 - 10:36AM
#128
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Date Joined:
Nov 16, 2007
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Now, if we can just get the two to go on a date, and hope MapTools is trampy, then who knows what the offspring might be!
MapTools would never put out. This is unfortunate because, from what I've heard here on the forums, WotC's VT is easy.
(I feel so ashamed of myself right now.)
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3 years ago ::
Dec 11, 2010 - 12:49PM
#129
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Now, if we can just get the two to go on a date, and hope MapTools is trampy, then who knows what the offspring might be!
MapTools would never put out. This is unfortunate because, from what I've heard here on the forums, WotC's VT is easy.
(I feel so ashamed of myself right now.)
Snrk. And MT plays hard to get. Heh. That's so bad, it's kinda good.
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3 years ago ::
Dec 12, 2010 - 7:23AM
#130
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Date Joined:
Jun 10, 2008
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Just read most of the this thread and took a look at maptools.
Disclaimer: I have not used maptools nor am I in the beta for VT.
It seems the VT and Maptools are really for different demographics of players.
VT is best suited for the single player who wants to hop into a random DMs dungeon and kill some monsters for the week.
Maptools seems better suited for the gaming group that meets in person and wants some assistance to speed up their game.
I just dont see VT working out very well for a gaming group (wotc's stated standard group 5 players and 1 gm) paying $36-$60 a month, every month, to play D&D.
Additionally there are so many more aspects to an RPG that the VT probably isnt going to handle. NPC interaction, skill challenges, shopping in town, long term story arcs. I'm not sure if maptools can cover these so it may have to be done at the table outside of software but that is a detriment to paying for VT vs maptools being free.
What if you wanted to do an adventure that is in a setting that isnt in VT? You have to wait and hope those tiles will come out eventually.
I admit the VT is in beta so its hard to say what it can or cannot do or will end up doing and that works against the VT. If a gaming group plays other rule systems then Maptools has the obvious advantage. Will VT even work for other editions of D&D? I've read it can be but is that just being a mapping tool or being a full VT handling all the math and number crunching of the ruleset? When 5ed comes out how long will it take before the VT works for it? If I am going to put in the time and money into something I want to have some assurance that there is longevity to it. Heaven forbid when 5ed comes out they have to redo the entire online tools once again because of something they didnt foresee today.
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