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3 years ago ::
Nov 19, 2010 - 9:04PM
#151
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2008
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The real question on this is - Why did we need a new CB again?
This looks worse and worse the more you dig into it.
My take on the situation is this:
When D&D 4e was introduced a company was hired to build a VTT including character builder and everything (see YouTube for demo videos). As the launch lingered closer so did not the completion of the VTT or CB. Finally Wizards of the Coast had to cut the deal and take over the development. To at least get something shipping they had to work with whatever code they had (probably ugly-ass, undocumented, spaghetti code) and whatever knowledge they had available in-house.
After that they managed to slowly improve what they had released, probably well aware that a full rewrite was looming on the horizon. And once Essentials and Dark Sun (with some odd rules) were released they probably decided that if any time was a good time to start over, now was that time.
That says nothing about how well the rewrite went and how well the communication up to this point has been handled though…
The funny this is the only thing they seemed to start over is the view(gui). It's much of the same underlying code as before, albet crosswired wrong :p
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 2:25AM
#152
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Date Joined:
May 24, 2010
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Again, I fail to see this 'basic' functionality that everyone claims is missing. I can choose a class. Check. I can choose a race. Check. I can assign my campaign setting and backround. Check. I can set my ability scores in new ways, as well as the old. Check. I can assign skills? Check. How about powers? Feats? Special stuff for cross class and hybrid? All of those check. I can buy equipment and equip it. While kind of clunky compared to the old system, that gets a check. I can save the character and print it out. Check. Tell me again..because I am honestly lost and curious...where is the basic functionality that is lost on this builder?
I agree that the basic functionality of it is there. The only problem I see with it at all is the lack of houseruling. You can't add additional feats or custom items or etc etc etc.
You know what..... that's fine. The way I see it the character builder should simply be the starting point. All it needs are the basics. You can then print it out and manually insert all of the houseruled items.
Something I'm seeing a lot in these posts, not just this thread/forum but others as well, is about the whole "piracy" issue that this new CB is supposed to stop. How?
If the DM has a subscription and was giving his/her account info to the players to update the old builder, then what's stopping them from simply letting them log on through the website? You can log on multiple computers simultaneously. I did it with all three of my computers and had my girlfriend log on at the same time as well just to see if it could be done. Basically I'm just wondering why WotC felt the need to try and fix something that wasn't really broken in the first place. To me it seems like a waste of time.
However, I love the fact that the new builder is PC and Mac accessible, and I love the use of the cloud. To be honest I was expecting this thing to suck big fat hairy Donkey Kong balls. I was pleasantly surprised with how well it turned out. The only suggestion I would make is to have an option to download the character sheet into either a .xps or .pdf (my personal preference) to your computer so that you can have your own copy to mess with at-will.
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 3:12AM
#153
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Date Joined:
Jun 20, 2009
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The funny this is the only thing they seemed to start over is the view(gui). It's much of the same underlying code as before, albet crosswired wrong :p
Even funnier, Dark Sun Themes are programmed into the CB (just disabled) and Essentials characters are actually EASIER to code (no additional coding required, just data). compare to the moster effort that PHB3 entailed, and you'll see how innane that theory is.
No, the whole "It was easier to start over than do DS+Essentials" is flat-out and provably wrong. Even before it was proven wrong, it was dumb as hell.
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 5:22AM
#154
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Date Joined:
Feb 10, 2009
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Why did they need a new CB anyway ? I never got that part, do you know ?
To protect their content. That is the only reason.
Which only adds to the amusement, since their data is still completely unprotected; it's all in the silverlight application itself, which is downloaded to your local machine. The server just implements the rules (badly, apparently).
Neither Wizards nor DDI subscribers gained anything in this exchange except for SOME of the essentials and Dark Sun updates we were supposed to get over a month ago.
DDI auto-renew cancelled 11/17 due to lack of usable software tools (aside from the compendium)
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 7:47AM
#155
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Date Joined:
Aug 17, 2007
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What is it you don't believe? We know for sure that the company responsible for the 2008 fiasco had to hand over everything to WotC, we know that WotC wanted to make CB a web based application already then but that the available skill set was a road block. What is speculation on my part is the state of the code when it was handed to WotC and Essentials/DS rules (judging by the cBC files they had at least tried to fit it into cBC).
Why, because it seems (I cannot verify right now, working on it though) that some people have that conent in the old CB. I don't know how much of it until I try it myself though.
WOTC Podcast:
"The web is a shortcut"
"Piracy was a big thing"
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 8:09AM
#156
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Definitely some potential here. I'm able to get a lot of data here in via cbloader, but trying to use the whole block of rules causes issues. Absolutely promising, though.
This conversation will probably have to move elsewhere. I doubt WotC will like it.
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 8:48AM
#157
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Which only adds to the amusement, since their data is still completely unprotected; it's all in the silverlight application itself, which is downloaded to your local machine. The server just implements the rules (badly, apparently).
If that is really what is going on, then that is completely bass-ackwards.
Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept.
Default module =/= Core mechanic.
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 9:32AM
#158
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I can confirm that copying the Theme data (and Theme powers data) from the Silverlight's app's XML and patching it in via the cbloader results in a working theme in the old CB. The old CB doesn't have an interface for choosing the theme, but you can get one by either editing your .dnd4e file manually, or exporting a character with a theme from the web CB.
The themes appear to work mostly correctly. The one caveat that I see is that they don't grant the free level 1 theme power, but that is easily corrected by adding a single line to each Theme entry. Other than that, the theme powers are available options at each appropriate level, they calculate the math correctly, and their level scaling works.
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 10:21AM
#159
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Which only adds to the amusement, since their data is still completely unprotected; it's all in the silverlight application itself, which is downloaded to your local machine. The server just implements the rules (badly, apparently).
If that is really what is going on, then that is completely bass-ackwards.
It is what's going on - Silverlight contains all the data, but none of the rules about how it interacts (the data files for the two are essentially the same, with the new CB's files scrubbed of rules interaction elements).
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3 years ago ::
Nov 20, 2010 - 10:38AM
#160
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It is what's going on - Silverlight contains all the data, but none of the rules about how it interacts (the data files for the two are essentially the same, with the new CB's files scrubbed of rules interaction elements).
That's just bad design if they are trying to be protective of their data. Amazing.
Beyond that, considering that the data is within the app, there is no excuse for it to be so horribly sluggish. The stuff being sent to and from the server is thus excessive and unnecessary.
If they are just going to leave everything wide open like this anyhow, just give us the ability to download and use the database legally, as DDI subscribers, to produce open source utilities. We just can't distribute it. It takes a DDI account to download the database and it must be incorporated with our program. Both the database and the program would be keyed to that DDI subscriber and only works together.
Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept.
Default module =/= Core mechanic.
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