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Switch to Forum Live View The Big Bang: A Guide to Novas
2 years ago  ::  Jan 30, 2011 - 5:13PM #101
jonathan_sicari
Date Joined: Sep 1, 2008
Posts: 3,357
So I keep looking at Disciple of Strength and thinking it has a use somewhere. It only seems useful for a heroic tier nova with its flat 5 damage on your next weapon damage roll before EoNT. Dwarves seem the optimal race with thier minor second wind. Generally right about there is where my thought process derails.
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2 years ago  ::  Jan 30, 2011 - 5:19PM #102
erachima
Date Joined: Sep 4, 2010
Posts: 7,676
Use it with Invigorating Stride. (And it'll still be useless.)
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2 years ago  ::  Jan 30, 2011 - 9:26PM #103
jonathan_sicari
Date Joined: Sep 1, 2008
Posts: 3,357
I'm fond of Bravo (which I see in the Multiclass feats section) but what about Cutthroat's Scrutiny? Requires Bluff to be trained, the MC feat, and Cutthroat expert; for a minor action target grants CA until EoNT and your character gains 19-20 Crits on target until EoNT.
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2 years ago  ::  Jan 31, 2011 - 9:02AM #104
MC-DrowBane
Date Joined: Aug 10, 2010
Posts: 1,260
I'll look into Cutthroat expert, not to keen on Disciple of Strength being that it's only 5 damage.  Thanks for your interest!
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2 years ago  ::  Jan 31, 2011 - 11:49AM #105
jonathan_sicari
Date Joined: Sep 1, 2008
Posts: 3,357

Jan 31, 2011 -- 9:02AM, MC-DrowBane wrote:

I'll look into Cutthroat expert, not to keen on Disciple of Strength being that it's only 5 damage.  Thanks for your interest!


I quite understand about Disciple of Strength (It is way niche) but I figure if Headman's Chop is good, something could be leveraged (of course HC is repeatable).

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2 years ago  ::  Jan 31, 2011 - 12:32PM #106
MC-DrowBane
Date Joined: Aug 10, 2010
Posts: 1,260

Jan 31, 2011 -- 11:49AM, jonathan_sicari wrote:

Jan 31, 2011 -- 9:02AM, MC-DrowBane wrote:

I'll look into Cutthroat expert, not to keen on Disciple of Strength being that it's only 5 damage.  Thanks for your interest!


I quite understand about Disciple of Strength (It is way niche) but I figure if Headman's Chop is good, something could be leveraged (of course HC is repeatable).




Exactly, Headman's Chop can net 85 extra damage in the right nova circumstance (and more) when your dealing with 15-20 attacks per round.  I just don't see wasting a feat on 5 damage a round.

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2 years ago  ::  Jan 31, 2011 - 12:47PM #107
erachima
Date Joined: Sep 4, 2010
Posts: 7,676
Disciple of Strength is a trap feat. By the time you can Second Wind often enough for it to matter, 5 damage has become too inconsequential for it to help you.
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2 years ago  ::  Feb 01, 2011 - 1:06AM #108
jonathan_sicari
Date Joined: Sep 1, 2008
Posts: 3,357
Because I'm a headstrong kind of guy and I hate math (so naturally I spent time I should have been sleeping working on this over some Beef Teriyaki) I built a level 6 Dwarf STR scout with Dwarven Weapon Training, Axe Expertise, Headman's Chop and Disciple of Strength on a Aspect of the Charging Ram build (equipped with viscous battleaxe +2, viscous handaxe +2, veteran's hide armor +1, bracers of mighty striking). Then I replaced Disciple of Strength with my beloved Bravo.

Disciple of Strength Encounter nova with AP: 55.8 DPR

Bravo Encounter nova with AP and possible followup round: 65.46 DPR.

No contest.
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2 years ago  ::  Feb 08, 2011 - 7:45AM #109
SongNSilence
Date Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 1,274
Hi MC-DrowBane, i updated the build, now its RAW (i think), and did some damage calculations (102 attacks, about 36 of them critical hits, splittable between several targets if necessary, for a total of 6833 damage)

Nov 14, 2010 -- 4:39PM, SongNSilence wrote:


"Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion!!!"


-- "Wait, what ?"


Update: Cleaned the build up (limit free actions to 1/turn, minor action commands to 1/turn), and added damage calculations.

102 attacks in two rounds, for a total of 6833 damage.

This damage can be split up on any number of targets (as opposed to many single target novas) - so you can actually deal that damage (if the encounter has enough creatures in the 150sq area you can cover...

Some words on playability:
The build is a good single class bard and fully operational outside his daily nova. Most builds are spent after the nova (no dailies/enc eft), but the bard still has 3daily, 3 encounter and 5 utility power uses at his dispsosal.

One can get the feats necessary for the nova during one level up, so no unnecessary feats and items before one can use them. The bard has 5 feats left for better defenses/bardic abilites. Or, you could use some of those feats to improve damage even more - every 1 extra points of damage would increase total damage by 95.625.

E.g., if you use plaguing bloodhunt + necrotic reagent, you would deal 24 damage per hit vs. bloodied -> assuming the target(s) are bloodied half of the time, add 12 damage per hit, or 1147.5 total. Shouldn't be too hard to get more than 10000 damage.

Evan the Tentacle Bard, 102 attacks Show


Bard
Any race with Charisma bonus (assumption below: Cha 28 Con 22 @30)
MC Cleric, MC Druid
Divine Oracle
Eternal Seeker (Fatesinger:Fate's Clarity)

feats:
Combat Virtuoso, MC Cleric, Multiclass Mastery(MC Druid, Druid Daily), Primal Summoning Expertise, Arcane Familiar(hand), Arcane implement proficiency(heavy blade), lasting frost, wintertouched, devastating critical, silvery glow, focused expertise, Majestic fervor, +5 feats for defenses/bard

items:
cold fury kopesh+shard, 2xlegendary weapon, gloves of ice, iron armbands of power, ring of giants, war ring, magic armor, magic neck, 3xCharm of abundant action, violet solitaire, low level Symbol of Victory, Ring of Free Time

Powers:
at-will: Staggering Note, Vicious Mockery
encouunter: Prophecy of Doom, +3
daily: Writhing Henge, Hammer of Fate, +2
util: Raise the Stakes, Haste, Rune, Good Omens, +4

Daily Nova
turn1:
minor: clockwork cowl (+2 standard actions, no attacks)
std(clockwork): divine oracle
minor(clockwork): raise the stakes (crit range 17-20)
minor(move): majestic word (roll each attack twice, due to Fate's Clarity)

standard: summon+attack x 6   (first attack crits)
crit: gain standard action (legendary weapon), gain AP (symbol), gain AP (violet solitarie)
standard(legendary): command summon x6
minor(ring): command summon x6
AP(standard): command summon x6
free: get charm1
AP(standard): command summon x6
free: get charm2
AP(standard): command summon x6
free: get charm3
AP(standard): command summon x6

turn2:
free: draw legendary2
minor: command summon x6
move(minor): haste (+1 std action)
minor(ring): rune (+1 std action) 
standard(ring): command summon x6
standard(haste): command summon x6
standard(rune): command summon x6 
standard: command summon x6
standard(ED): command summon x6
standard(ED): command summon x6
standard(ED): command summon x6
standard(ED): command summon x6
stanadard(legendary): command summon x6

Damage Calcs:
17* 6 = 102 attacks vs ref

damage normal: 2d8+6(enh)+5(wis)+6(item)+5(shard)+5(cold vuln)+4(gloves)+4(feat)+6(con) = 2d8+41 (50)
damage crit: 14+35+12+1d10+6d10+1d10 (105)

to hit: 15+9(cha)+6(enh)+2(CA)+1(word)+3(exp) = 36 vs Ref 42, roll twice take better, crit 17-20

0.9375*(105)+101*(0.36*(105)+0.5775*(50)) = 6833 damage
Spoiler: Show




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2 years ago  ::  Feb 08, 2011 - 10:21AM #110
MC-DrowBane
Date Joined: Aug 10, 2010
Posts: 1,260
hehe ok I'll check er out.  I remember laughing over this a while back
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