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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:15PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Jul 10, 2010
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u mad?I'm not. Class looks awesome.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:16PM
#2
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I wouldn't say mad, but I'm definitely not happy with the return of one of the things I was most pleased to see given the boot when 4e was released.
I'll be houseruling that away.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:21PM
#3
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Yeah, I'm gonna pass on alignment restrictions.
Some people out there (like Danline and Goldomark) like alignment restriction. I'd hazard a guess they are in the minority. A very small minority.
Essentials zigged, when I wanted to continue zagging.
Roll dice, not cars.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:25PM
#4
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I share Salla's sentiment. I'm just thankful that it's easy to hourserule this restriction away.
Why Mechanics-Alignment Integration is Bad
Show
so why even play a fighter if you can play the paladin the exact same way behaviorally and get added power to boot. "Paladin" is about accepting better game-enhancing mechanics at the price of more rigid in game behavior.
Really? So it goes something like this?
Fighter: "I want to be a paladin."
NPC: "Really?"
Fighter: "Yes."
NPC: "Very well." Starts reading from a holy book while still in-character "Do you accept having to choose and stick to the lawful good alignment, eventhough neither of us actually knows that it exists or what it is?"
Fighter: "I do."
NPC: "Do you reject good game balance because you accidentally rolled a high Charisma?"
Fighter: "What?"
NPC: "I don't know what it means either."
Fighter: "Oh. Umm, ok I do."
NPC: "In the name of all that is metagamey and broken, accept these better game enhancing mechanics."
Fighter: "These what?"
NPC: "Just get out there and try to fulfill a million different people's notion of good while not violating and part of any of them."
So the system is designed such that every single hit needs to be described to avoid confusion? Here's a scenario. The players are nudists, everybody in the world are nudists, it's not weird, it's totally normal in this land. They are naked and they fight drakes taking damage throughout, but healing up with surges. Later they meet the guy who raised the drakes.
Part 1: I didn't describe any of the hits. What does he see?
Part 2: Lets say I described the drakes as biting the players, yet they healed up. What does he see?
D20 Modern Toon PC Race.
Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:29PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Sep 22, 2006
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Considering they took out the whole mechanical falling part out, I could care less. It honestly doesn't matter, since nothing happens (mechanically) if the Sacadin decides to be CE 5 min into the session.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:31PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Jun 27, 2004
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Considering they took out the whole mechanical falling part out, I could care less. It honestly doesn't matter, since nothing happens (mechanically) if the Sacadin decides to be CE 5 min into the session.
Right, this. As far as I'm concerned, it's not a problem - it's just bloody pointless. Which I guess is better than "No, you play your character like this, or you don't play him at all," but still, I'd rather they not waste the space.
Feedback Disclaimer
Show
Yes, I am expressing my opinions (even complaints - le gasp!) about the current iteration of the play-test that we actually have in front of us.
No, I'm not going to wait for you to tell me when it's okay to start expressing my concerns (unless you are WotC).
(And no, my comments on this forum are not of the same tone or quality as my actual survey feedback.)
A Psion for Next (Playable Draft)A Barbarian for Next (Brainstorming Still)My 4e Projects
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:32PM
#7
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Considering they took out the whole mechanical falling part out, I could care less. It honestly doesn't matter, since nothing happens (mechanically) if the Sacadin decides to be CE 5 min into the session.
That's very true. It's also one of the bright spots about this as it makes the alignment restriction easier to houserule out.
Why Mechanics-Alignment Integration is Bad
Show
so why even play a fighter if you can play the paladin the exact same way behaviorally and get added power to boot. "Paladin" is about accepting better game-enhancing mechanics at the price of more rigid in game behavior.
Really? So it goes something like this?
Fighter: "I want to be a paladin."
NPC: "Really?"
Fighter: "Yes."
NPC: "Very well." Starts reading from a holy book while still in-character "Do you accept having to choose and stick to the lawful good alignment, eventhough neither of us actually knows that it exists or what it is?"
Fighter: "I do."
NPC: "Do you reject good game balance because you accidentally rolled a high Charisma?"
Fighter: "What?"
NPC: "I don't know what it means either."
Fighter: "Oh. Umm, ok I do."
NPC: "In the name of all that is metagamey and broken, accept these better game enhancing mechanics."
Fighter: "These what?"
NPC: "Just get out there and try to fulfill a million different people's notion of good while not violating and part of any of them."
So the system is designed such that every single hit needs to be described to avoid confusion? Here's a scenario. The players are nudists, everybody in the world are nudists, it's not weird, it's totally normal in this land. They are naked and they fight drakes taking damage throughout, but healing up with surges. Later they meet the guy who raised the drakes.
Part 1: I didn't describe any of the hits. What does he see?
Part 2: Lets say I described the drakes as biting the players, yet they healed up. What does he see?
D20 Modern Toon PC Race.
Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:32PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2003
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u mad?
I'm not. Class looks awesome.
Oh, I think it's a wonderful idea right up there with race based level limits and save or die spells, and rerolling a new character (and none of this namby pamby 4d6 drop the lowest....we go OLD SKOOL with 3d6 in the order that you roll them).
Yes, it's finally time that Mearls and Co are getting DnD back to a true "man's game".
.....
RALF! This reflects a huge part of what's wrong with the new Essentials Push. The bad old ideas were bad and discarded for a reason and alignment restrictions on explicit character classes were right near the top of the list.
-Polaris
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:37PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2010
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I wouldn't mind alignment-ish restrictions if done well. But, as alignments in 4e are simply awful (e.g. Lawful Good = Super Good), any restrictions flowing from them are similarly awful.
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3 years ago ::
Oct 22, 2010 - 2:45PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Jan 29, 2010
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I really wouldn't want to play an alignment-restricted paladin. On a separate note, I really wouldn't want to play a paladin, period, and I really don't care if anyone else at the game table plays one, AR or not.
So it's all good.
"Censorship is telling a man he can’t have a steak just because a baby can’t chew it.”
~Mark Twain
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