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Sep 22, 2010 -- 5:39PM, Plaguescarred wrote:

Movements that will Trigger an OA are:

Crawl
Run
Walk
Climb
Fly
Swim
Jump

Movement that will not Trigger an OA are:

Shift
Teleport
Forced Movement (Pull,Push,Slide)
Fall

Anything else i missed ?

Skipping
Dancing
Cartwheeling
Catapulting
Oozing
Sumersaulting
Hopping
Twirling
Cavorting
Handspringing
Lipskidding
Breakdancing
Krumping
....

I think that's it

Sep 22, 2010 -- 11:36AM, ChaosMage wrote:

Sep 22, 2010 -- 11:26AM, Papagiorgio wrote:

Shifting prevents OA from moving. The OA from polearm gamble isn't triggered/provoked/etc. from moving. It's triggered when an enemy enters an adjacent square. The attack would only need to be melee 1, because the creature is already adjacent to the character when the attack is made. It's not in the process of moving adjacent to you, it's already there. So shifting would provoke from PG, and it would not save the 1st level rogue from feeling the wrath of the prismatic wall. All my opinion btw. As a DM polearm gamble wouldn't concern me.

You have some false premises there.  First, the up to date text in shifting (as it relates to OAs) is "No Opportunity Actions Triggered: Unless the description of an effect says otherwise, shifting doesnt trigger opportunity actions, such as opportunity attacks."  So shifting avoiding OAs isn't somehow limited to "moving;" it can't trigger them at all.
Second, RC defines entering a square as moving into a square.  There's no difference between entering a square and moving.
Third, though I'm not sure how it relates to the discussion at hand, OAs are immediate interrupts; they resolve before their trigger does.  This means that the character isn't adjacent when PG's OA goes off, so you'd need reach to hit him.  (As a side note, this is necessary for OAs based on movement to work at all- if someone triggered an OA by leaving and adjacent square and entering one out of your reach, you wouldn't be able to attack him if your OA happened after his move was resolved).  This is explicitly spelled out in the PHB FAQ:

24. Where is the target of your attack when you make an opportunity attack because of Polearm Gamble?

An opportunity attack interrupts the action that triggers it, so when you make the opportunity attack,  the target is in the square it's leaving, assuming that square is within  your melee reach.

I don't have the RC, so I don't know the exact wording for shift in that book. What I do know is that the purpose of shifting is to avoid incurring OA that you would normally provoke for moving. The PHB errata is quite clear about that. That is the only purpose it serves. The trigger for PG is not IMO movement. Movement is required to fulfill the trigger, but the trigger itself is not movement. You can agree or disagree with this as you see fit, but the idea that a character can simply shift through a prismatic wall and completely avoid it's effects is silly. The triggers for PG and PW are similar, so IMO shifting would still trigger PG. The feat needs some clarification, and it needs to be brought up to speed with the essentials. The RC also should errata shifting to indicate that it only protects one from OA that movement would normally incur. The PHB errata does this already.

Sep 23, 2010 -- 11:17AM, Severion1 wrote:

Sep 23, 2010 -- 10:34AM, Papagiorgio wrote:

I don't have the RC, so I don't know the exact wording for shift in that book. What I do know is that the purpose of shifting is to avoid incurring OA that you would normally provoke for moving. The PHB errata is quite clear about that. That is the only purpose it serves. The trigger for PG is not IMO movement. Movement is required to fulfill the trigger, but the trigger itself is not movement. You can agree or disagree with this as you see fit, but the idea that a character can simply shift through a prismatic wall and completely avoid it's effects is silly. The triggers for PG and PW are similar, so IMO shifting would still trigger PG. The feat needs some clarification, and it needs to be brought up to speed with the essentials. The RC also should errata shifting to indicate that it only protects one from OA that movement would normally incur. The PHB errata does this already.

That's an argument over an extremely fine distinction.  I agree it would help everyone involved if they added some clarification to Polearm Gamble.  But to be truthful, you can't Enter without Moving.  And Shifting is specifically exempted as a trigger unless explicitly excepted.  The standard for this appears to be supplimental language in a rule describing the excepting case.  And given that you're talking about so fine a point, I still don't think we can reasonably consider the term Enters to even approach that standard.

Btw, if you can tell me how you can shift and enter a square without moving, I'll give you a cookie .

So should people be allowed to shift through a prismatic wall? Obviously not. The move itself isn't what provokes the attack, touching the wall does. Again moving is required to fulfill the trigger, but not the actual trigger itself. That's just how I see it. I think we are putting too much weight behind the RC description of Shift. They had to errata it in the PHB because people believed that if they shifted they couldn't provoke opportunity attacks from anything they did the rest of the round. There will be something similar for the RC if it doesn't already specify that shifting only applies to OAs from movement.
I never said you can enter a square without moving, you can btw, but that's not what I'm implying.

Sep 23, 2010 -- 12:12PM, Papagiorgio wrote:

So should people be allowed to  shift through a prismatic wall? Obviously not. The move itself isn't  what provokes the attack, touching the wall does. Again moving is  required to fulfill the trigger, but not the actual trigger itself.  That's just how I see it. I think we are putting too much weight behind  the RC description of Shift. They had to errata it in the PHB because  people believed that if they shifted they couldn't provoke opportunity  attacks from anything they did the rest of the round. There will be  something similar for the RC if it doesn't already specify that shifting  only applies to OAs from movement.
I never said you can enter a square without moving, you can btw, but that's not what I'm implying.

You can't Enter without Moving.  And you can't Move without Entering - at least in the larger sense of 'entering a new state'.  Entering is a byproduct of Moving and as such, when they state you trigger Polearm Gamble when you Enter an adjacent square, Moving is an essential component of that action.  As such, the Shifting rule applies.

I agree - Prismatic Wall should trigger on a shift.  And I imagine we'll see erratta on that.  They're tightening the rules around movement and that's one that deserves attention.