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Dec 17, 2012 -- 3:05PM, Mand12 wrote:

"100% sure" and "12.5% sure" are two very different things.

Probably more than 12.5%, actually, since it's likely some of the other squares are occupied.  And it's also relatively easy to CHECK the possibles, especially for a large creature.  Oh no, the Wizard might OA you for walking into his space!

I'm just saying, if you damage him for starting his turn adjacent to you, he *will* know he started his turn adjacent to you.  If you damage him for moving into your aura, he *will* know he entered your aura. 

It's important to remember that, while these things don't inherently break Hidden, they *do* give the enemy information that it can use to educate its guesses.

Need clarification please.
Rogue - cunning sneak.
Combat starts - hide using the plethora of ways.
Assuming highest initiative.
All enemies go, so now I know their initiatives.
Round 2
Move or double move toward the highest initiative monster and end move adjacent to him hidden.
When he goes, he provokes an OA. I whack him, and then I have opportunity sidestep and risky shift and something else to increase shift squares. I then shift as a free action 2 or more squares toward the next initiative monster to get adjacent.
Since I keep the hidden state until the end of the OA whacking...

Do I then become visible right before I start my shifting?
So now all my enemies see where I am. I shift as a free action, and hide adjacent to my next enemy. But since he saw me hide in that square, he knows I am there. Is this correct?

Is there anyway of doing an off-turn attack like this, and re-hide so the enemies do not know where I am? The only thing I can think of is changing the shifts to teleports and then splitting the teleport into 2 halves. Would that allow me to do this? Can I hide after the first half of the teleport? It states it is all the same action 

Planestrider boots
When you use a power to teleport, you can instead teleport twice as the same action

Or, if I get 2 free action shifts, use 1 free action shift to hide, and then use the other free action shift to move into position already hidden. Would that work?

Dec 18, 2012 -- 2:37PM, DSMReference wrote:

. Or you could be a Thief, take the Thief PP, and at 16 just be Hidden. Forever. With no possibility of being broken. Silly brokenly worded feature

Do you mean the Master Thief, and "    Shadow Striker (16th level): If you are hidden when you make an attack against an enemy, you remain hidden after the attack if you have any cover or concealment."

Yeah, no, that's misleadingly worded, but not perma-Hidden.  You lost Hidden because you attacked, retained the benefits until the end of the action, and only then do you check if you're Concealed.  You're not - you lost Hidden.  If you have Concealment from a non-Hidden source, that works.

Also, even then, it's not unbreakable.  You still have to obey all the other rules, and (for example) a monster walking into you will break Hidden.

Dec 18, 2012 -- 4:50PM, DSMReference wrote:

And concealment is hard to get... how, exactly?

Not "hard", just "required, beyond and above Hidden".

Dec 18, 2012 -- 4:50PM, DSMReference wrote:

Also: Pixie. The feature allows you to be Hidden forever and from everything with a relatively minimal investment.

And, no, you're still

A) exposing your location and vulnerable to "I walk into it" shenanigans"
B) leaving the rest of your party to suffer your attacks while you're preserving non-needed Surges.

It's strong (to make up for the lack of Dailies), but still not broken or unworkable.

Dec 18, 2012 -- 5:36PM, DSMReference wrote:

You can be walked into and not break Hidden when you're Tiny.

Wrong.