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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 4:28AM
#31
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Did they not, 5 weeks before the launch of 4E announce that the ddi tools would not be ready at launch. And was this news not on the front page of the website, for a whole week?
IIRC, the news was made in the fourms and in the news feed section about that time. But it was not on the main page of the site for a week. Then because of the nature of fourms and the news feed, the info got buried over the next 4-5 weeks before 4th ed hit. Making the info very hard to find for new players and players looking to come back to play online with old gaming friends. WOTC did not put a link to the info that the tools were not ready until they offically said something in the fourms about 2 months after 4th ed was out. The whole thing looked like a bait a switch from WOTC to get people to buy the books when WOTC had no intention of puttting out the promised tools. I am not saying that what it was. But this was handled very poorly by WOTC.
I didn't think you would be honest. Your facts are wrong and you know it. But again, no one takes you seriously.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 7:39AM
#32
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Could we please refrain from personal attacks and arguing about the past actions in specifics? This thread does have some good points about how the consumers feel about the product.
Suffice it to say that my confidence is low, based on my past experiences with DDI and its handling. This is just how I feel about it.
Now that I see I am not getting what I expected to get out of the product since I subscribed for 1 year, it is time for me to let my subscription lapse until the product is more in line with what I am looking for.
There is no anger, and no accusations at all. All I can say is that the bulk of the articles have not been useful or interesting to me. The support for the Shadow Power source, that I specifically subscibed in order to receive, has been light and not lived up to my expectations. There is far too much lag between an article's publishing date and its entrance into the compendium and CB. Many glossary items are missing entirely as are Skill Powers, Backgrounds, etc.
Should DDI grow into a more robust suite with more reliable quality in the tools, I would most likely come back and check it out again.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 8:23AM
#33
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Could we please refrain from personal attacks and arguing about the past actions in specifics? This thread does have some good points about how the consumers feel about the product.
Suffice it to say that my confidence is low, based on my past experiences with DDI and its handling. This is just how I feel about it.
Now that I see I am not getting what I expected to get out of the product since I subscribed for 1 year, it is time for me to let my subscription lapse until the product is more in line with what I am looking for.
There is no anger, and no accusations at all. All I can say is that the bulk of the articles have not been useful or interesting to me. The support for the Shadow Power source, that I specifically subscibed in order to receive, has been light and not lived up to my expectations. There is far too much lag between an article's publishing date and its entrance into the compendium and CB. Many glossary items are missing entirely as are Skill Powers, Backgrounds, etc.
Should DDI grow into a more robust suite with more reliable quality in the tools, I would most likely come back and check it out again.
If someone has an issue with WoTC, they need to be honest about those issues. WoTC can't address a problem if the problem is a lie. They can't respond to an unhappy customer that isn't being honest.
It does everyone a diservice when someone lies to make a point.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 8:52AM
#34
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Could we please refrain from personal attacks and arguing about the past actions in specifics? This thread does have some good points about how the consumers feel about the product.
Suffice it to say that my confidence is low, based on my past experiences with DDI and its handling. This is just how I feel about it.
Now that I see I am not getting what I expected to get out of the product since I subscribed for 1 year, it is time for me to let my subscription lapse until the product is more in line with what I am looking for.
There is no anger, and no accusations at all. All I can say is that the bulk of the articles have not been useful or interesting to me. The support for the Shadow Power source, that I specifically subscibed in order to receive, has been light and not lived up to my expectations. There is far too much lag between an article's publishing date and its entrance into the compendium and CB. Many glossary items are missing entirely as are Skill Powers, Backgrounds, etc.
Should DDI grow into a more robust suite with more reliable quality in the tools, I would most likely come back and check it out again.
Well said.
I posted in another thread that my sub just lapsed today. I just can't justify renewing right now, even though I really want the MM3 updates in the Monster Builder. I won't pay for a new subscription for just one digital update to the tool. I know, I could just buy a month, grab the update, and run, but I don't really want to do that.
First off, it gives the product another subscriber for at least one more month. I make a much bigger statement by saying that even MM3 isn't enough to entice me again. Second, I kind of feel like I'm stealing it by doing a hit-and-run for one month.
I'd rather not get started on the Assassin being in a print product. I already talked about that in my blog.
As for the VTT, I don't even think about it anymore. It's dead. There are other tools to use out there for the same purpose, and they're free. If WotC chooses to make one, it's just a "nice to have" at this point. I'm more concerned with the empty buttons in the Adventure Tools screen now.
If someone has an issue with WoTC, they need to be honest about those issues. WoTC can't address a problem if the problem is a lie. They can't respond to an unhappy customer that isn't being honest.
It does everyone a diservice when someone lies to make a point.
You seem to be implying that Gargoyle is lying about something. Rather than being vague, why don't you state what you mean? Personally, I see no lies in there, especially considering that person mirrors me so closely (except that my sub actually has lapsed as of today.)
Perhaps you mean the items listed as being absent from the Compendium? Honestly, I have no idea what is or isn't in the Compendium. The few times I've used it, I've found what I was looking for. My use is not very comprehensive though.
Long Live the Lance! Give us 4e DL!
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 9:15AM
#35
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Date Joined:
Aug 27, 2009
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Did they not, 5 weeks before the launch of 4E announce that the ddi tools would not be ready at launch. And was this news not on the front page of the website, for a whole week?
IIRC, the news was made in the fourms and in the news feed section about that time. But it was not on the main page of the site for a week. Then because of the nature of fourms and the news feed, the info got buried over the next 4-5 weeks before 4th ed hit. Making the info very hard to find for new players and players looking to come back to play online with old gaming friends. WOTC did not put a link to the info that the tools were not ready until they offically said something in the fourms about 2 months after 4th ed was out. The whole thing looked like a bait a switch from WOTC to get people to buy the books when WOTC had no intention of puttting out the promised tools. I am not saying that what it was. But this was handled very poorly by WOTC.
This is what I encountered as well. KM is right on this one.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 9:41AM
#36
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This is what I encountered as well. KM is right on this one.
This is not what I encountered. Maybe some people are more proficient with knowing where to look for the announcements when they are provided. Wizards was very forthright with providing us information when they had it to provide. I know that I had knowledge of DDI not being ready and the VTT table was likely going vapor prior to release, as it was the sole reason why I did not buy 4E when it launched.
Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept.
Default module =/= Core mechanic.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 9:58AM
#37
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Date Joined:
Sep 24, 2002
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the person that has never played DnD before or is coming back to DnD because of these tools that WOTC said would be ready could not find the info easy on the DnD site. WOTC did a poor job of making the info clear. If you never been to the DnD sute befor you would not have known where to look. At the time i was pretty active here and I almost missed the info. WOTC should have put the info on the page that was the link they told people in the ads in the core books.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 10:30AM
#38
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the person that has never played DnD before or is coming back to DnD because of these tools that WOTC said would be ready could not find the info easy on the DnD site. WOTC did a poor job of making the info clear. If you never been to the DnD sute befor you would not have known where to look. At the time i was pretty active here and I almost missed the info. WOTC should have put the info on the page that was the link they told people in the ads in the core books.
I'm not sure that is a fair argument to make.
Not only is it not fair, but it is completely presumptuous. But there is nothing quite like coming to the boards every day or two, dropping a fresh steamy load, and wallowing in it... for two years straight.
Besides, there is such a thing as forgiveness. But some people choose to hold a grudge.
Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept.
Default module =/= Core mechanic.
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 10:34AM
#39
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Date Joined:
Aug 24, 2005
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the person that has never played DnD before or is coming back to DnD because of these tools that WOTC said would be ready could not find the info easy on the DnD site. WOTC did a poor job of making the info clear. If you never been to the DnD sute befor you would not have known where to look. At the time i was pretty active here and I almost missed the info. WOTC should have put the info on the page that was the link they told people in the ads in the core books.
WotC screwed up the information management. They have offered reduced subscription prices. They have expanded demo timeframes. They offered a week of free access last year. Most importantly, they have appologized for it. And they have made efforts to try and make it up to their customers.
I understand that you aren't satisfied with that. Fair enough. No one can force you to change your mind. But would you be kind enough to offer some suggestions about what could reasonably be done to correct the situation at this point?
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3 years ago ::
Jul 01, 2010 - 11:38AM
#40
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KM is not right about them not putting anything on the front page. Or when they released information He's trying to make it seem like they hide it and that's simply not true.
5 weeks before the launch of 4E they said the digital tools would be delayed and not part of the launch, and that they would be bringing the tools out one at a time over several months.
Back then, the front page wasn't the best design, but the main feature was always the last product they had put out. Under that were 4 standard boxes that always linked to the same feature. One was news, and this was were the announcement of the delay in the digital side of 4e was to be found.
Back then, each Monday that news feature would be updated with a new article. When you clicked on the link, it took you to the page with the full news article, and an archieve above it, listing past aricles in order of date, with a link to them.
It was also linked to the ampersand article for that MONTH, which was always accessable through the front page.
The post in the forums got buried under everyone having to make their own thread about it.
Nothing was buried, nothing was hidden. As people have said, how they learned about the delay was just as I have said. Which means his verison of the facts don't match up to what people actually experienced, and the whole tone and anger in his posts pretty much shows his bias.
No one is denying that WoTC could have done a better job. If that's his only concern, fine, but it's two years later, and they have gotten way better. So there is no point in going on is there? Lesson learned.
WoTC or any company can only put out info, the cant force people to read it. They can't make people understand it. They set up a system on how to put that info out there, and stuck to that system for everything so that it would be easy for anyone looking for info to be able to come and go to the news and find just that News.
KM seems to think that WoTC should have changed the whole front page to say, "NO VTT".
So far, he's claiming thousands of people being duped into buying DnD with a bait and switch. Not possible. Anyone that bought the book, solely on the back page (Which was sent to the printer 6 months before launch, when they thought the digital side was going to happen), and went to find there wasn't anything to subscribe to, could easily return the book to the store they bought it from. They got to the store in the first place, getting back is possible to.
But so far there seems to be a lack of these thousands of people that were duped. A few have claimed they only got into 4E for this and when questioned about keeping the book or not, they clammed up.
WoTC was slow to update some of the pages, but that's life in a corporation. What would seem to take a few minutes to use takes days at any company.
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