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3 years ago ::
Apr 02, 2010 - 2:36PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2008
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A long time ago there was a thread discussing strategies and builds when either you couldn't rely on getting specific items, or you were in a non-magic world. Obviously the game breaks if you don't have the boost to-hit offered by magic weapons, and thus we will assume candidates simply have access to a vanilla +X armor, weapon, neck slot item and that's it, no boons. You get these items at level 1(+1), 6(+2), 11(+3), 16(+4), 21(+5), and 26(+6), so we'll do DPR analysis at level 1(+1), 6(+2), 12(+3), 16(+4), 24(+5), and 30(+6). Either post candidates here or on the DPR king candidates. I'll keep the DPR king candidates thread as up to date as possible. I think the ranger and avenger will do the best in this arena. Key
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0 Magic enhancement/feat/feature meant for weapon but used on implement (jagged dagger for sorcerer, cunning glaive, disruptive net, sorcerer daggermaster, wizard + polearm momentum)
1 Lasting frost + frost weapon
2 Typed damage confers keyword to power (shocking flame adds lightning keyword to melee attacks)
3 Student of ciaphon PP
4 Windrise ports background
5 off-hand weapon properties w/o off-hand attack( Vanguard,Thundergod, subtle...)
6 Twin strike / Throw and Stab
7 White lotus master riposte
8 Hybrid class
9 (free)
~ Non-RPGA legal material (dragonmarks(mark of Storm...))
+ Versatile master
% Bloodiron
= (free)
? (free)
@ Dragon material in general
^ (Feycharger) Fey Charge + Eladrin Swordmage Advance [+White Lotus Riposte]
& (free)
* (free)
- (free)
# (free)
This legend is not to discourage you from using the following items but to help others find builds that are allowed at their table. Please don't disuss legality of these items. I'm simply trying to find a way to remain unbaised allowing for as many candidates in as possible. This list is not for non-DPR related elements(orb of imposition...).
Template entry
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DPR followed by name of build, and author.
Please put in parenthesis the cheese you use. If you want to separate non-critical cheese please seperate with semicolon( . Please refer to normalized defenses as an optional number to report.
If you assume Combat Advantage (Rogues I'm talking mostly to you) Please put 121 DPR(CA), and if you're charging use (Ch). Unless you're a rogue please explain in your build why you can assume CA, or unless you're a Prime punishing ranger who's built around soloing, please explain why you can comfortably make certain assumptions. We may come up with other exceptional assumptions later. I'd like to veer away from needing too many keys and lookups.
138 DPR Stormwarden(30), by LordDuskBlade (1,6;@) [nAC=9, nfort=8, nref=10, nwill=-5]
or simply (minimum)
138 DPR Stormwarden (1,6;@)
DPR King Candidates 3.0How much damage should I shoot for?
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You're fired : 1 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .2 KPR
Fair Striker : 2 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .4 KPR
Highly Optimized : 3 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .6 KPR
Nerfbat please : 4 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .8 KPR
It's OVER 9000!!!!!: 5 Kills Per 5 Rounds = 1+ KPR
DPR? KPR? KP4R? Bless you
Show
DPR = Damage Per round ~= Chance to hit * damage on a hit
KPR = Kills Per Round. 1 Kill = 8*Level+24 damage
= DPR/(8*level+24)
KPNR = Kills Per N Rounds. How many standards can you kill in N rounds?
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3 years ago ::
Apr 02, 2010 - 2:46PM
#2
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Date Joined:
Mar 31, 2008
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without crunching anything, i'm going to throw it out there that I don't think anything will beat a Half-Elf (Twin Strike Dilettante) Avenger/Ardent Champion/Sage of Ages with Two-Weapon Opening and paired Waraxes.
Doesn't rely on any enchantments or keywords. Just... cuts the lawn.
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3 years ago ::
Apr 02, 2010 - 3:16PM
#3
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Date Joined:
May 26, 2009
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Anything with lots of static damage mods. Yeah, Twin-Strike Avengers have a lot of potential for this. I would think a Morninglord would be your best bet if you accept that a Paingul Oath attack is a Radiant keyword attack and Pervasive Light allows all further attacks to benefit from the Radiant Vulnerbility from Morninglord.
Even without items, radiant abuse is possible and potent.
Pit Fighter is the other obvious source of static mods.
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3 years ago ::
Apr 02, 2010 - 3:58PM
#4
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2008
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Pit Fighter is the other obvious source of static mods.
Son of mercy would do well for a few level 12 candidates
DPR King Candidates 3.0How much damage should I shoot for?
Show
You're fired : 1 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .2 KPR
Fair Striker : 2 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .4 KPR
Highly Optimized : 3 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .6 KPR
Nerfbat please : 4 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .8 KPR
It's OVER 9000!!!!!: 5 Kills Per 5 Rounds = 1+ KPR
DPR? KPR? KP4R? Bless you
Show
DPR = Damage Per round ~= Chance to hit * damage on a hit
KPR = Kills Per Round. 1 Kill = 8*Level+24 damage
= DPR/(8*level+24)
KPNR = Kills Per N Rounds. How many standards can you kill in N rounds?
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3 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2010 - 7:57AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Jul 14, 2008
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A gith brutal scoundrel would be good during heroic;
4th level
STR 15
CON 10
DEX 21
INT 8
WIS 13
CHA 10
Feats;
1 Gith Blade Master
2 Versatile Duelist
4 Backstabber
Equipment; +2 Bastard sword. Nothing else matters.
To hit; +14 (counting CA since the damage also counts CA)
Damage; d10+2d8+10 (5 DEX, 2 Feat, 2 STR, 2 Enhancement, 1 Versatile)
DPR with Piercing Strike, counting in crit; 24.425
The numbers seem off to me, since he hits on a 2, which seems wrong. But I can't find out what is wrong.
Anyways, this character doesn't care what equipment he gets as long as it is a bastard sword, and it hits pretty hard all through heroic. It lags during Paragon when other rogues go Daggermaster, so Kensei would probably be the best bet. But he'd have to lost some DEX to get his STR up to a point where the Kensei powers are not a waste.
One-half of the tabletop gaming news podcast Going LastCo-author on AoA 2-3 and 4-1.
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3 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2010 - 11:29AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2008
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A gith brutal scoundrel would be good during heroic;
4th level
STR 15
CON 10
DEX 21
INT 8
WIS 13
CHA 10
Feats;
1 Gith Blade Master
2 Versatile Duelist
4 Backstabber
Equipment; +2 Bastard sword. Nothing else matters.
To hit; +14 (counting CA since the damage also counts CA)
Damage; d10+2d8+10 (5 DEX, 2 Feat, 2 STR, 2 Enhancement, 1 Versatile)
DPR with Piercing Strike, counting in crit; 24.425
The numbers seem off to me, since he hits on a 2, which seems wrong. But I can't find out what is wrong.
Anyways, this character doesn't care what equipment he gets as long as it is a bastard sword, and it hits pretty hard all through heroic. It lags during Paragon when other rogues go Daggermaster, so Kensei would probably be the best bet. But he'd have to lost some DEX to get his STR up to a point where the Kensei powers are not a waste.
Wouldn't you get more DPR by making odd str and dex?
if you doubt the correctness of your to-hit please lay it out as you see it and we can confirm?
DPR King Candidates 3.0How much damage should I shoot for?
Show
You're fired : 1 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .2 KPR
Fair Striker : 2 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .4 KPR
Highly Optimized : 3 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .6 KPR
Nerfbat please : 4 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .8 KPR
It's OVER 9000!!!!!: 5 Kills Per 5 Rounds = 1+ KPR
DPR? KPR? KP4R? Bless you
Show
DPR = Damage Per round ~= Chance to hit * damage on a hit
KPR = Kills Per Round. 1 Kill = 8*Level+24 damage
= DPR/(8*level+24)
KPNR = Kills Per N Rounds. How many standards can you kill in N rounds?
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3 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2010 - 12:13PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Jul 14, 2008
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A gith brutal scoundrel would be good during heroic;
4th level
STR 15
CON 10
DEX 21
INT 8
WIS 13
CHA 10
Feats;
1 Gith Blade Master
2 Versatile Duelist
4 Backstabber
Equipment; +2 Bastard sword. Nothing else matters.
To hit; +14 (counting CA since the damage also counts CA)
Damage; d10+2d8+10 (5 DEX, 2 Feat, 2 STR, 2 Enhancement, 1 Versatile)
DPR with Piercing Strike, counting in crit; 24.425
The numbers seem off to me, since he hits on a 2, which seems wrong. But I can't find out what is wrong.
Anyways, this character doesn't care what equipment he gets as long as it is a bastard sword, and it hits pretty hard all through heroic. It lags during Paragon when other rogues go Daggermaster, so Kensei would probably be the best bet. But he'd have to lost some DEX to get his STR up to a point where the Kensei powers are not a waste.
Wouldn't you get more DPR by making odd str and dex?
if you doubt the correctness of your to-hit please lay it out as you see it and we can confirm?
You'd get more DPR by getting 16 STR and 20 DEX, but I built this character as though it were in actual campaign play rather than living only in the danger room (which I admit doesn't make sense for DPR calculations).
To hit with 20 DEX; +5 DEX, +3 Prof, +2 Level, +2 enhancement, +2 CA= 14
Damage with 16 STR and 20 DEX; +5 DEX, +3 STR, +2 Feat, +2 Enhancement, +1 Versatile= 13
Bumps the DPR with Piercing strike to 28.425
One-half of the tabletop gaming news podcast Going LastCo-author on AoA 2-3 and 4-1.
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3 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2010 - 12:41PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Dec 26, 2009
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Since when was a bastard sword a light blade, sling, or crossbow, which rogues are proficient with???
The best rogue weapon is the double sword, 1d8, +3 to hit, and +1 AC. It happens to also be BOTH a Light and Heavy Blade, qualifying for both sets of feats. Brutal Scoundrels are easily going to have the stats to optimize this item.
A bastard sword, however, is not a rogue weapon.
What is Gith Blade Master and where is it? I'm guessing it makes Githzerai proficient with Bastard Swords, but you still need a light blade for sneak attack.
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3 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2010 - 12:43PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2008
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Since when was a bastard sword a light blade, sling, or crossbow, which rogues are proficient with???
The best rogue weapon is the double sword, 1d8, +3 to hit, and +1 AC. It happens to also be BOTH a Light and Heavy Blade, qualifying for both sets of feats. Brutal Scoundrels are easily going to have the stats to optimize this item.
A bastard sword, however, is not a rogue weapon.
What is Gith Blade Master and where is it? I'm guessing it makes Githzerai proficient with Bastard Swords, but you still need a light blade for sneak attack.
Versatile dualist lets you use heavy blades for sneak attacking and powers that require light blades.
DPR King Candidates 3.0How much damage should I shoot for?
Show
You're fired : 1 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .2 KPR
Fair Striker : 2 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .4 KPR
Highly Optimized : 3 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .6 KPR
Nerfbat please : 4 Kills Per 5 Rounds = .8 KPR
It's OVER 9000!!!!!: 5 Kills Per 5 Rounds = 1+ KPR
DPR? KPR? KP4R? Bless you
Show
DPR = Damage Per round ~= Chance to hit * damage on a hit
KPR = Kills Per Round. 1 Kill = 8*Level+24 damage
= DPR/(8*level+24)
KPNR = Kills Per N Rounds. How many standards can you kill in N rounds?
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3 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2010 - 4:34PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Sep 10, 2004
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Since when was a bastard sword a light blade, sling, or crossbow, which rogues are proficient with???
The best rogue weapon is the double sword, 1d8, +3 to hit, and +1 AC. It happens to also be BOTH a Light and Heavy Blade, qualifying for both sets of feats. Brutal Scoundrels are easily going to have the stats to optimize this item.
A bastard sword, however, is not a rogue weapon.
What is Gith Blade Master and where is it? I'm guessing it makes Githzerai proficient with Bastard Swords, but you still need a light blade for sneak attack.
And DOuble Sword is just a d6/d6 light blwde now. No Light/Heavy shenanagins.
http://community.wizards.com/play-by-post_haven The Play-by-Post recruitment hub for the forums. Stop by, join us, and sign up for some games while you are there Cookie Collection
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