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Switch to Forum Live View I Sold My Soul for This?!?! A Handbook for Warlocks as Pure Strikers
4 years ago  ::  Oct 30, 2009 - 8:49AM #21
Mommy_was_an_Orc
Date Joined: Apr 25, 2002
Posts: 4,975

Half-Elf + Hand of Radiance + Bard Multiclass feat + Combat Virtuoso + Student of Caiphon can turn into some large scale control/striker damage. The base damage might not be especially great, but when you throw in Student of Caiphon, the odds of critting go way, way, way up. Yes, this only works in certain combats, but most 4e combats tend to have more than 2 opponents. 4 attacks in Epic means you have a 60% chance of generating a crit in a round when there are 4 opponents. This can fuel a lot of Epic crit nonsense, especially given it is Radiant...


In that combo, Bardic Ritualist isn't a bad way to get the Bard access - Warlock is the one arcane class that doesn't by default get Arcana and being able to cast Song of Sustenance at 8+ for free each day is amazing(+5 to all endurance checks for the entire party might be better than the majestic word)


 

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 30, 2009 - 10:20AM #22
WOLead
  • Stampeding Hybrid
Date Joined: Jun 9, 2008
Posts: 1,277

Oct 30, 2009 -- 8:49AM, Mommy_was_an_Orc wrote:


Half-Elf + Hand of Radiance + Bard Multiclass feat + Combat Virtuoso + Student of Caiphon can turn into some large scale control/striker damage. The base damage might not be especially great, but when you throw in Student of Caiphon, the odds of critting go way, way, way up. Yes, this only works in certain combats, but most 4e combats tend to have more than 2 opponents. 4 attacks in Epic means you have a 60% chance of generating a crit in a round when there are 4 opponents. This can fuel a lot of Epic crit nonsense, especially given it is Radiant...




Yet without an Invoker MC feat, you can never use an implement with Hand of Radiance, meaning its less accurate, less damaging, and never gets Critical Hit damage.  Hence why I prefer sticking to Blazing Starfall when dealing with Student of Caiphon and Charisma Starlocks, as you do not even need to take the Sorcerer MC feat to use an implement with it if you take Arcane Implement Proficiency.


Now if only there was a good Radiant version for Con/Int Starlocks...

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 30, 2009 - 10:30AM #23
Mommy_was_an_Orc
Date Joined: Apr 25, 2002
Posts: 4,975

Oct 30, 2009 -- 10:20AM, WOLead wrote:

Yet without an Invoker MC feat, you can never use an implement with Hand of Radiance, meaning its less accurate, less damaging, and never gets Critical Hit damage.  Hence why I prefer sticking to Blazing Starfall when dealing with Student of Caiphon and Charisma Starlocks, as you do not even need to take the Sorcerer MC feat to use an implement with it if you take Arcane Implement Proficiency.


Now if only there was a good Radiant version for Con/Int Starlocks...




Eh, thought it was cleaner than that, but Windrise Ports and a starting Wis of 12 solves both of those issues...even lets you pick up Visions of Blood or Grasping Shards as a once per encounter option. And as a Rod is an Invoker implement...

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 30, 2009 - 2:16PM #24
furious_kender
Date Joined: Oct 25, 2007
Posts: 2,129

First off I just wanted to thank everyone for thier helpful comments and encouragement.  Hopefully, with your help, this guide can help some people make good use of a sorely under-rated class. 


I plan on putting up a lot of different, high DPR builds, using the different strategies I've set out already. So if anyone has a nice high dpr build that is primarily warlock, please keep letting me know. 


Oct 30, 2009 -- 6:38AM, Ytterbium_Dragon wrote:


I think that the format should be a little altered, though. The best advice that this handbook will be able to give is example builds showcasing strategies that work well to provide reasonable DPR. As such, I think that those should be near the beginning of the handbook. New players especially love to look at those first to see how everything lines up, then they get more specific later.


The stuff you have now is really for more advanced players looking to possibly make their own builds. As such, I'd put it closer to the end.




You're probably right.  However, I'd like to try to put as much info as possible up and then play around with formatting to make it the most usable. 


Oct 30, 2009 -- 6:38AM, Ytterbium_Dragon wrote:


Also, I don't think that you give Chalocks enough credit. MC Paladin helps their DPR quite a bit. While Divine Challenge + Eyebite (the good ole trick) has lost a bit of its luster, DC + White Lotus Master Riposte is decently potent and is an option that Conlocks don't have.




You're right in that there probably is an eigth strategy: the lose-lose stragety that warlock can borrow from defenders. 


With that said, check out my Sun Warlock build.  This is an initial draft of the build, but I am reasonably certain that it can out damage any actual cha'lock build using the same DC + White Lotus Master Riposte strategy.   


 


Oct 29, 2009 -- 10:19PM, ChaosMage wrote:


If you're looking for builds to include, consider the Polearm Warlock: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...


It can still use some tweaking, but it's an excellent fighter/warlock (leaning heavily towards warlock) build.  With Iron Vanguard and Draconic Arrogance, it will do str+con extra damage on any push or knock prone. 



I love gish builds and was wanting to include some nice push builds with good DPR, so I really appreciate your suggestion.


Oct 29, 2009 -- 11:14PM, WOLead wrote:


I was quite happy with my Epic level Gnome Feylock made in a Warlock Challenge thread, calculating out the damage that could be done per round.  Maybe I'll go and write up a full build setup for it as well as fully tweaking the damage out now that I have a couple more tricks that I've realized now.  Sadly, I know the Heroic and early Paragon levels are "eh" at best.



That is a nice epic cha'lock build.  An eyebite build that hurts.....who would have thought Laughing 


Thanks again for all of your comments.  This looks like it's going to be a fun guide to put together.


 

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 30, 2009 - 2:37PM #25
Bergtann
Date Joined: Sep 20, 2007
Posts: 313

The feat "Sorcerous Power" allows you to add your Dex or Str bonus to the damage of all arcane powers. However, it is a bad fit for the secondaries, and requires Sorcerer PMC.

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 30, 2009 - 5:28PM #26
true_shinken
Date Joined: Jun 20, 2007
Posts: 944

This is my take on a Strikerlock, using the hybrid advice from the guide. I chose all Caiphon powers simply for flavor. 


 



Strikerlock, level 16


Tiefling, Swordmage|Warlock, Student of Caiphon


Swordmage Aegis (Hybrid): Aegis of Assault


Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Star Pact (Hybrid)


Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex


Hybrid Talent: Swordmage Warding


Eldritch Strike: Eldritch Strike Charisma


Twofold Pact: Fey Pact


Background: Birth - Cursed (+2 to Bluff)


 


FINAL ABILITY SCORES


Str 14, Con 12, Dex 11, Int 22, Wis 9, Cha 22.


 


STARTING ABILITY SCORES


Str 13, Con 11, Dex 10, Int 16, Wis 8, Cha 16.


 


 


AC: 32 Fort: 20 Reflex: 25 Will: 25


HP: 100 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 25


 


TRAINED SKILLS


Arcana +19, Streetwise +19, Bluff +23, Intimidate +19


 


UNTRAINED SKILLS


Acrobatics +8, Diplomacy +14, Dungeoneering +7, Endurance +9, Heal +7, History +14, Insight +7, Nature +7, Perception +7, Religion +14, Stealth +10, Thievery +8, Athletics +10


 


FEATS


Level 1: Hybrid Talent


Level 2: Weapon Expertise (Heavy Blade)


Level 4: Vengeful Curse


Level 6: Soldier of the Faith


Level 8: White Lotus Riposte


Level 10: Focused Expertise (Longsword)


Level 11: Relentless Curse


Level 12: Twofold Curse


Level 14: Twofold Pact


Level 16: Devastating Critical


 


POWERS


Hybrid Swordmage at-will 1: Sword Burst


Hybrid Warlock at-will 1: Eldritch Strike


Hybrid encounter 1: Flame Cyclone


Hybrid daily 1: Dread Star


Hybrid utility 2: Caiphon's Leap


Hybrid encounter 3: Delban's Deadly Attention


Hybrid daily 5: Enervating Slash


Hybrid utility 6: Swordmage's Decree


Hybrid encounter 7: Dazing Rebuke


Hybrid daily 9: Brood of Hadar


Hybrid utility 10: Troublesome Aid of Caiphon


Hybrid encounter 13: Dark Reach of Xevut (replaces Flame Cyclone)


Hybrid daily 15: Free the Storm Within (replaces Dread Star)


Hybrid utility 16: Caiphon's Disquieting Liberty


 


ITEMS


Sunblade Longsword +2, Veteran's Leather Armor +3, Bracers of Mighty Striking (heroic tier), Boots of Eagerness (heroic tier), Feinting Gloves (heroic tier)

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 31, 2009 - 5:57PM #27
BRJN
Date Joined: Jun 7, 2001
Posts: 1,168

Try this trick for CHA'locks:


Turn 1: Curse target (who we hope is not a minion)


Turn 2: Chains of Levistus: 2d6 cold and call in 1d6 curse damage


Turn 3: Curse of the Dark Dream: 3d6(?) radiant and 2d6 cold from Chains (because you make him move) and call in 1d6 curse damage.


Total: 9d6 damage (average 31.5 HP).   You can do this once a day (Dark Dream is a daily) starting at Level 1.  You could also look for other encounter powers that make the target move, so you can do it fight after fight.


Feel free to correct me if I am misapplying any rules.

Best complements I have yet received:
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Making it up as I go along:
{BRJN}
     If I was writing the Tome of Lore, I would let Auppenser sleep. But I also would have him dream.
     In his dreaming he re-activates the innate powers of (some) mortal minds. Or his dreaming changes the nature of reality - currently very malleable thanks to Spellplague &c. Or whatever really cool flavor text and pseudo-science explanation people react positively to.
{Lord_Karsus}
You know, I like that better than the explanations for the Spellplague.

My plot device: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/ … #489880509 (The reaction is the next post.)

Prepped ahead of time:
I started the thread "1001 Failed Interrogation Results"
{ADHadh}
These are all good and make sense!  I just can't come up with something that's not covered here and is not completely ridiculous.

My characters:
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Active Characters:
LFR Half-elf StarLock6     Gondolin Nightstar
AoA Dwarf Guardian Druid6     Narvik from House Wavir

Character A-building:
Neverwinter Dwarven Invoker / Heir of Delzoun / worships Silvanus (!)
"Truenamer" - speaks Words of Creation

Concepts I'm kicking around:
"Buggy" Wizard - insect flavor on everything
Halfling Tempest Fighter - just because nobody else is doing it
Shifter Beast-o-phile Druid - for PoL campaign
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4 years ago  ::  Oct 31, 2009 - 7:05PM #28
Nyronus
Date Joined: Aug 4, 2008
Posts: 757

In a debate on Warlock damage powers, I produced a build using SongNSilences now unfortunately defunct Wizard's Fury/Feycharger build. The build used Ageis of Assault, Riposte, and Eladrin Swordmage Advance. The "nerfing" of Reaper's Touch pretty much killed the old Arcane Feychargers, save for one: the Warlock. Eldritch Strike is still around to serve as an Arcane Keyword Basic Melee Attack. Here is the build I did:


 


 


The Revenant Warcharger
Eladring Soul Revenant Assaulting Swoardmage|Warlock/Fighter/Academy Master/Sage of Ages

Strength: 12 > 14 > 17 (4)
Constituion: 18 > 21 > 26
Dexterity: 18 > 20 > 22 (2)
Intelligence: 10
Wisdom: 10
Charisma: 8

Related Feats: Called Shot, Prime Punisher, Arcane Admixture (Thunder), Student of the Sword, Feycharger, Feywild Protection, Eladrin Swordmage Advance, White Lotus Enervation, Focused Expertise (Light Blade), White Lotus Riposte, White Lotus Master Riposte, Eladrin Soul, Weapon Focus (Light Blade), Dual Implement Spell-casting, Two Weapon Fighting, Two Weapon Opening, White Lotus Evasion

Relevant Powers: Eldritch Blast

Relevant Items: +6 Bloodiron Daggers x 2, +6 Bracers of Mighty Striking

To hit: +37 vs. 43

To hit: 15 (Half Level) + 6 (Enhance) + 1 (Academy Master) + 3 (Implement Expertise) + 2 (Sage of Ages) + 1 (Enervation) + 8 (Constiution) + 1 (Prime Shot)

Damage: 2d10 + 6 (Enhancement) + 6 (Bracers) + 6 (Dual Implement) + 5 (Prime Punisher) + 5 (Academy Master) + 1 (TWF) + 3 (Weapon Focus) + 8 (Constitution)

47 average
59 on Charge
71 on Charge + Curse

Average Eldritch Blast DPR, No Opening: (175*2/20)+(47*14/20) = 50.4
Average Eldritch Blast DPR, +Opening: (225.4*2/20)+(47*14/20) = 55.44
Average Eldritch Blast Charge DPR, +Opening and Sage: (225.4*.19)+(71*.77) = 97.496

DPR Before Thunder: 208.376

Thunder DPR: 8.5989+11.9178+14.5578 = 35.0745
Total DPR: 35.0745+208.376 = 243.4505


 


 


You can basically replace the Feywild Protection feat with Weapon Proficiency (Bastard Sword) and start with  14 Dex and 16 Strength to get about the same DPR. The build probably needs some work to be "playable," but it pretty much contains all of the tricks to recreate the classic Arcane Feycharger is a new form.


---


I also may work on combining some of the tricks presented so far in this guide and in this build to create a functional and versatile gish-striker build.

I am a: Lawful Good Dragonborn Paladin
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4 years ago  ::  Oct 31, 2009 - 11:14PM #29
padpaw
Date Joined: Jun 24, 2008
Posts: 82

I just want to say that I think you are doing a great job with this guide.  Warlock has been one of my favorite classes flavor wise, and I'v freequently wondered how to pump their dammage up to true striker levels.  I look forward to seeing your builds section when you get arround to posting it.

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4 years ago  ::  Nov 01, 2009 - 8:58AM #30
chanter_hound
Date Joined: Aug 11, 2006
Posts: 2,008

When talkinga about revs, you should mention some stuff about certian races that have good feats, but lack the stats needed.


Shradi kai for example have the ability to bypass necrotic resistance. I think Reapers touch also is now only limited to them as well.

I'd get along more with people if they didn't jump onto a hyberbole every single time you say something they don't understand.
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