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Switch to Forum Live View Cruel Lullabies: The Bard Handbook
1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 1:44AM #481
Litigation
Litigation
Date Joined: Jun 10, 2008
Posts: 3,135

Nov 29, 2011 -- 6:52PM, The_Crimson_Dawn wrote:

The Q and A thread is below and right now it looks like echoing weapon could be SKYBLUE since it can get double striker mods or at least be a minor action attack (for you or you friendly striker buddy) which is just awesome on a leader.

community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...



Good catch, and I changed the ratings for Echoing Weapon and its Greater version to sky blue.

D&DN Paladin: Half-Fighter, half-Cleric, all useless.
D&DN Ranger: Third-Fighter, third-Rogue, third-Druid, all useless. With one interesting concept that has its execution botched.

My 4e Character Op work:

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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 2:08AM #482
Litigation
Litigation
Date Joined: Jun 10, 2008
Posts: 3,135

Nov 29, 2011 -- 9:54PM, Lord_Ventnor wrote:

So... for Eladrin Cunning Bards, how optimal are orbs? You know, since they can get orb proficiency basically for free?



Considering all the forced movement powers they get, I'd say they're pretty good.

Also, Orb of Inevitable Continuance on Song of Discord (for two rounds of domination) is pretty sexy. 

D&DN Paladin: Half-Fighter, half-Cleric, all useless.
D&DN Ranger: Third-Fighter, third-Rogue, third-Druid, all useless. With one interesting concept that has its execution botched.

My 4e Character Op work:

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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 5:15AM #483
jonathan_sicari
jonathan_sicari
Date Joined: Sep 1, 2008
Posts: 3,363
Hey Litigation,

What do you think of a Dwarf strength skald (with some token charisma for song of rest) using Warhammers and Throwing Hammers (profiecient by default as a Dwarf)?
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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 6:16AM #484
Litigation
Litigation
Date Joined: Jun 10, 2008
Posts: 3,135
Workable but not really optimal. You really want +3 proficiency weapons as a leader class. And going STR-primary means you restrict yourself entirely to, well, the powers that came with the Skald. And while there's a solid power at most levels there, it's still not going to match the satisfaction a typical CHA-based Bard will get from stuff like Song of Discord, the Lv. 15 implement powers, Shout of Triumph, Staggering Note, etc., etc.
D&DN Paladin: Half-Fighter, half-Cleric, all useless.
D&DN Ranger: Third-Fighter, third-Rogue, third-Druid, all useless. With one interesting concept that has its execution botched.

My 4e Character Op work:

Character guides Show
Builds Show
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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 12:19PM #485
ezrider23
ezrider23
Date Joined: Jan 27, 2009
Posts: 1,090
I'm a total noob to Bards and i am currently the only leader in our 5+ member party and i was wondering what the must have feats and best paragon path for my Cunning Bard would be.
He is a Human Cunning Bard who is focusing on a strong controller secondary since the only controller in our party is a seeker and the rest are melee oriented. My current feats are MC Warlock/fey pact(roleplay reasons), MC Wizard for the awesome hypnotism power and access to wizard implements and Orb Expertise for the added forced movement. What should i be taking next and what paragon path would be the best for secondary control, aside from the great and mighty Resourceful Magician.
Here is the build, sorry for the spacing.

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======


Nizam al'Latif, level 3


Human, Bard


Build: Cunning Bard


Pact Initiate Option: Pact Initiate (fey pact)


Bardic Virtue Option: Virtue of Cunning


Signs of Influence Option: Travel in Style


Signs of Influence Option: Welcome Guest


Human Power Selection Option: Heroic Effort


Dark Sun, Inherent Bonuses


Scorned Noble (Scorned Noble Benefit)


Theme: Noble


 


FINAL ABILITY SCORES


STR 8, CON 13, DEX 10, INT 16, WIS 11, CHA 18


 


STARTING ABILITY SCORES


STR 8, CON 13, DEX 10, INT 16, WIS 11, CHA 16


 


 


AC: 18 Fort: 14 Ref: 18 Will: 18


HP: 35 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 8


 


TRAINED SKILLS


Arcana +9, Bluff +11, Diplomacy +10, Insight +6, Perception +6, Streetwise +10, Thievery +5


 


UNTRAINED SKILLS


Acrobatics +1, Athletics +0, Dungeoneering +2, Endurance +2, Heal +2, History +5, Intimidate +6, Nature +2, Religion +5, Stealth +1


 


POWERS


Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack


Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack


Noble Utility: Noble Presence


Human Racial Power: Heroic Effort


Bard Feature: Majestic Word


Bard Feature: Words of Friendship


Wild Talent Cantrip: Psionic Spark


: Arcane Defiling


Warlock Attack 1: Eyebite


Bard Attack 1: Staggering Note


Bard Attack 1: Misdirected Mark


Wizard Attack 1: Hypnotism


Bard Attack 1: Blunder


Bard Attack 1: Stirring Shout


Bard Attack 1: Victim of the Feywild


Bard Utility 2: Moment of Escape


 


FEATS


Level 1: Pact Initiate


Level 1: Ritual Caster


Level 1: Arcane Initiate


Level 2: Orb Expertise


 


ITEMS


Ritual Book


Glib Limerick


Comprehend Language


Dagger


Hide Armor x1


Mystery of the Hidden Veil (level 3)


Brooch of Shielding +1 x2


Backpack (empty)


Bedroll


Belt Pouch (empty)


Silk Rope (50 ft.)


Grappling Hook


Thieves' Tools


Torch


Residuum (Any)


Flute


Lute


Survival Day


Gambler's gear


Sacks


Longsword


Light Shield x1


Orb Implement x1


====== End ======
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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 2:56PM #486
warrl
warrl
Date Joined: Apr 16, 2009
Posts: 5,267

Nov 30, 2011 -- 12:19PM, ezrider23 wrote:

I'm a total noob to Bards and i am currently the only leader in our 5+ member party and i was wondering what the must have feats and best paragon path for my Cunning Bard would be.
He is a Human Cunning Bard who is focusing on a strong controller secondary since the only controller in our party is a seeker and the rest are melee oriented. My current feats are MC Warlock/fey pact(roleplay reasons), MC Wizard for the awesome hypnotism power and access to wizard implements and Orb Expertise for the added forced movement. What should i be taking next and what paragon path would be the best for secondary control, aside from the great and mighty Resourceful Magician.


A Cunning Bard is the true master of positioning. As such, it is almost a travesty to NOT take Advantage of Cunning. If you tend to get into melee a lot, either intentionally or otherwise, take a good hard look at Wild Virtue as well - but if you easily stay out of melee, skip it. Some further investment in enhancing forced movement might be worthwhile depending on what powers you choose.

If you're the party face and NOT trained in the Charisma skills, or if you're the party skill-monkey, Bard of All Trades is good.

The Bard is one of the weaker in-combat healers among leader classes. Buffing that could help.

"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 2:59PM #487
The_Crimson_Dawn
The_Crimson_Dawn
Date Joined: Oct 2, 2005
Posts: 2,552

Nov 30, 2011 -- 1:44AM, Litigation wrote:

Nov 29, 2011 -- 6:52PM, The_Crimson_Dawn wrote:

The Q and A thread is below and right now it looks like echoing weapon could be SKYBLUE since it can get double striker mods or at least be a minor action attack (for you or you friendly striker buddy) which is just awesome on a leader.

community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...



Good catch, and I changed the ratings for Echoing Weapon and its Greater version to sky blue.




Sweet I contributed and was my good deed of the day.  Now to add that power to my bard now that I know how it works.

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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 3:34PM #488
ezrider23
ezrider23
Date Joined: Jan 27, 2009
Posts: 1,090

Nov 30, 2011 -- 2:56PM, warrl wrote:

Nov 30, 2011 -- 12:19PM, ezrider23 wrote:

I'm a total noob to Bards and i am currently the only leader in our 5+ member party and i was wondering what the must have feats and best paragon path for my Cunning Bard would be.
He is a Human Cunning Bard who is focusing on a strong controller secondary since the only controller in our party is a seeker and the rest are melee oriented. My current feats are MC Warlock/fey pact(roleplay reasons), MC Wizard for the awesome hypnotism power and access to wizard implements and Orb Expertise for the added forced movement. What should i be taking next and what paragon path would be the best for secondary control, aside from the great and mighty Resourceful Magician.


A Cunning Bard is the true master of positioning. As such, it is almost a travesty to NOT take Advantage of Cunning. If you tend to get into melee a lot, either intentionally or otherwise, take a good hard look at Wild Virtue as well - but if you easily stay out of melee, skip it. Some further investment in enhancing forced movement might be worthwhile depending on what powers you choose.

If you're the party face and NOT trained in the Charisma skills, or if you're the party skill-monkey, Bard of All Trades is good.

The Bard is one of the weaker in-combat healers among leader classes. Buffing that could help.



I was planning to get the Advantage of Cunning feat but was undecided on sooner or later, did not know if there was other feats i should be prioritizing before that. How could i go about getting better healing as i was going to concentrate more on the control side of the class. We are playing in the low magic Dark Sun setting so i'm pretty much relegated to feats and power choices to boost forced movement and healing. I like my character's to be as versatile as possible so i was looking to take Bard of all trades at some point also.
Thanks for your help and any other help is greatly appreciated.

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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 4:16PM #489
The_Crimson_Dawn
The_Crimson_Dawn
Date Joined: Oct 2, 2005
Posts: 2,552
I think it might be worth mentioning that, as far as I can tell, unlike the other no action encounter powers the bard noaction ecnounter powers lack a 1/round limitation.  This means that if you have both greater dimensional step and dimensional step (or combine that with a stun or daze instead if you prefer) could be used off of the same basic attack assuming you have two allies worth teleporting and attacking.  Could make for some really nasty nova rounds by using a minor action to use echoing weapon and then using a basic attack and using two no action encounter powers all on the same attack.
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1 year ago  ::  Nov 30, 2011 - 4:26PM #490
IxidorRS
IxidorRS
Date Joined: Sep 3, 2011
Posts: 2,167
I was thinking about Echoing Weapon and realized that Chilled Blade slows without hitting, at least as far as I read it.

"Effect: The next weapon attack made with the target weapon before the end of your next turn slows the attack’s first target until the end of its next turn. On a hit, that target also takes 1d10 extra cold damage."

The next attack slows the first target. Nothing about requiring a hit.

I think you are quite correct about being able to stack all that extra damage on your strikers hit.

It's like your an extra theme for your striker similar to Mercenary or other themes that add extra damage or effects.

Party Op with a Skald could be interesting.
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