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4 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2009 - 9:41PM
#21
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Date Joined:
Jul 28, 2007
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The good thing about 4e is it gets away from the "subjective" notion of alignment, and lays down a set of commandments (WotC's term) for each god. It's much more objective (and binary) test.
In what book might I find the 4e "commandments" for the gods?
Dave Arneson, on DMing: I was a little naive when we started playing Blackmoor (in 1971), I thought, as a GM, "I will be in control of the situation... I'm the referee!" Ha! Right...
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4 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2009 - 9:50PM
#22
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Date Joined:
Jun 10, 2009
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In what book might I find the 4e "commandments" for the gods?
Player's Handbook
Through the ages, many would wonder "Does art imitate life or does life imitate art?"
I wonder "Does the art of discourse on the internet imitate the art of discourse in life or does the art of discourse in life imitate the art of discourse on the internet?"
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4 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2009 - 9:55PM
#23
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Date Joined:
Jul 28, 2007
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Dave Arneson, on DMing: I was a little naive when we started playing Blackmoor (in 1971), I thought, as a GM, "I will be in control of the situation... I'm the referee!" Ha! Right...
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4 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2009 - 10:07PM
#24
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Date Joined:
Jun 10, 2009
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Thanks
My pleasure. Also note: SOME (as I said below, as not all gods are detailed, though the ones that grant special powers, generally, are) that don't appear in the PHB appear both in the book that introduced them, or in the Character builder/compendium entries.
Through the ages, many would wonder "Does art imitate life or does life imitate art?"
I wonder "Does the art of discourse on the internet imitate the art of discourse in life or does the art of discourse in life imitate the art of discourse on the internet?"
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4 years ago ::
Oct 05, 2009 - 1:03AM
#25
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In what book might I find the 4e "commandments" for the gods?
Player's Handbook
Might I add that the Divine Power book has a list of the Dieties toward the back and a description of what each of the divine classes should act like for each Diety.
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4 years ago ::
Oct 05, 2009 - 1:23AM
#26
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Date Joined:
Jul 31, 2009
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Dude. A paladin is a religious warrior. He bases his morality and behaviour on the tenets of his religion and the advice of his spiritual advisor (priest, monk, holy guru). He does not turn to philosophy and sociology. "What hath Athens to do with Jerusalem?"
Oh and so whenever the paladin is greeted by ANY problem EVER in his ENTIRE LIFE he consults a leading cleric of a prestiguous temple hall on ye 'magic mobile'. Don'[t be silly <.< "Hold on a trick ... **punches some numbers into his 'Rock of far-distance communication +2'** ... Ahhh yeah .. hi! Is Tom there? Yeah .. Tom the gold robed guy .... Oh Tom! Yeah .. just a moment ... How do I deal with this thief because he's stealing medicine ...? ---- Oh no Tom .. I can't reprimand him .. he's just a kid .... Oh no ... cant do that either Tom ... can't hand him into the authorities because they'll take his hands ... what do you reckon?" :P I doubt the paladin carries a 5000 pg book containing every ethical answer to any ethical choice he will come up against, written by his god or a leading priest ..."Thou shalt not steal ..." okay ... but where do you draw the line? For instance, you find a skeleton with a bag of gold coin ... a paladin should expend every asset to return those coins to the skeleton's next of kin or some other relative .... somehow ... but instead you just donate the bag of gold to charity ... A god that says "thou shalt not STEAL" is doubtful to have problems with this ... its not technically your gold ... but it's doing some good nonetheless. I doubt the paladin is going to take the gold to a priest of his faith and say "Find the rellies, or give it to the poor"?
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4 years ago ::
Oct 05, 2009 - 2:39AM
#27
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Date Joined:
Mar 30, 2008
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[:P I doubt the paladin carries a 5000 pg book containing every ethical answer to any ethical choice he will come up against, written by his god or a leading priest ..."Thou shalt not steal ..." okay ... but where do you draw the line?
thats the reason why i am play an avenger. they are so zealotic that they can be so violent as they need without bad conscience.
"Nobody expects imperial Inquisition"
"What doesn't destroys me, makes me stranger"
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4 years ago ::
Oct 05, 2009 - 5:33AM
#28
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Date Joined:
Oct 10, 2007
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Just remember, not all paladins are the same. A paladin of bahamut or pelor is going to handle situations very differently than a paladin of Torog or Bane, and I doubt even the paladins of vecna could fathom the logic and "code of conduct" found with the paladins of asmodeus. The role of paladin has changed since 2e and 3e. One paladin may arrest the thief, but go easy on it and then find a way to heal the sick legally. Another paladin might kill the thief and sell the medicine to the sick person while yet another paladin might slap the thief, smash the medicine and tell him that the sick fool deserves to die, since he was too weak to take care of himself. A paladin of bahamut would sacrifice himself to save his allies. A paladin of kord would remain behind and fight to test his skill and die gloriously, with bravery. A paladin of bane would force his "allies" to remain behind and defeat the foes, under his command. A paladin of asmodeus would sell his "allies" to the foes and then kill them all, saving only those who served a purpose.
Long Live Dragonlance and the Nexus! I still want an athasian nightmare beast and a warforged dragon mini! "Look, Meat, I'll tear your face off, rip your throat out and eat what's left-because that's what I do to food like you." ~Thrikreen Intimidation Tactic. My Custom 4th edition Content (New Content:2)
Show
* My Personal 4e Darksun Material found below:
Updated Weapon Options. (critical impact, repair, salvage)
http://www.4shared.com/document/bMZK2PNy/Updated_Optional_Darksun_Weapo.html
4th edition Athasian Sloth v1.2 (includes three monster write ups and a new disease)
http://www.4shared.com/document/lj561SRh/4th_edition_Athasian_Sloth_v10.html
4th edition Athasian Flailer v1.0
http://www.4shared.com/document/JGi9PqSe/4th_edition__Athasian_Flailer_.html
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4 years ago ::
Oct 05, 2009 - 11:54AM
#29
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Date Joined:
Jun 28, 2009
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Poor paladins! I'm so glad they are no longer held to a nebulus standard of Lawful Goodness. I'm enamored with the class but the only time I played one in my 3.x years was during a straight dungeon crawl game completely devoid of RP, where I didn't have to be concerned with what the DM felt a paladin should act like. Since my old DM once played a paladin who had a long-distance, chaste relationship with a woman he intended to marry, would he be fine with my paladin sleeping with the local bard who keeps flirting with me? I never dared to find out. As a side note, every class has things they're supposed to be doing in order to get these powers--wizards study, druids commune with nature, etc. I think the problem is that it's mostly assumed that the fighter is practicing his stances or what-have-you, whereas the paladin's source of power is more likely to come up during RP. It's not common to have a situation where the other PCs are like, "Yeah, let's burn the forest down!" while the druid's jaw drops, or where the most obvious path forward in the plot is to force the fighter into being strapped into a chair and eating buckets of pudding for a whole month, but a group could feasilby come to the decision that they have to torture their captured enemy for information, or have one PC want to steal an enchanted object from someone's grave to study or use. Then the typical LG paladin has a problem, since they get their power from following an external set of rules. And that is the end of my rambling.
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4 years ago ::
Oct 05, 2009 - 2:48PM
#30
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Date Joined:
May 10, 2009
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Dude. A paladin is a religious warrior. He bases his morality and behaviour on the tenets of his religion and the advice of his spiritual advisor (priest, monk, holy guru). He does not turn to philosophy and sociology. "What hath Athens to do with Jerusalem?"
Oh and so whenever the paladin is greeted by ANY problem EVER in his ENTIRE LIFE he consults a leading cleric of a prestiguous temple hall on ye 'magic mobile'.
Don'[t be silly <.<
"Hold on a trick ... **punches some numbers into his 'Rock of far-distance communication +2'** ... Ahhh yeah .. hi! Is Tom there? Yeah .. Tom the gold robed guy .... Oh Tom! Yeah .. just a moment ... How do I deal with this thief because he's stealing medicine ...? ---- Oh no Tom .. I can't reprimand him .. he's just a kid .... Oh no ... cant do that either Tom ... can't hand him into the authorities because they'll take his hands ... what do you reckon?"
:P I doubt the paladin carries a 5000 pg book containing every ethical answer to any ethical choice he will come up against, written by his god or a leading priest ..."Thou shalt not steal ..." okay ... but where do you draw the line?
For instance, you find a skeleton with a bag of gold coin ... a paladin should expend every asset to return those coins to the skeleton's next of kin or some other relative .... somehow ... but instead you just donate the bag of gold to charity ...
A god that says "thou shalt not STEAL" is doubtful to have problems with this ... its not technically your gold ... but it's doing some good nonetheless.
I doubt the paladin is going to take the gold to a priest of his faith and say "Find the rellies, or give it to the poor"?
Huh? I never said a paladin would be unable to make decisions without a priest. You fail to appreciate that millions of people in the real world make ethical decisions based on their religion. A paladin is one of those people. Look around you: millions of people base their decisions on the bible and the Koran. You may question their sincerity, faithfulness, intelligence or consistency, but they would adamantly insist that they do follow a certain code of religious behaviour. A paladin is a man, so naturally his sinful nature will make excuses, evade responsibility, twist the truth and take advantages, but his earnest desire is to overcome his base instincts and act according to what he believes and has been taught to be right. My point was to conttadict that a paladin would think in terms of "utilitarian philosophy," Kantian philosophy or any other philosophical or sociological framework. Kujihn, you said that a paladin would not ask' "What would Bahamut do?" My point is that, in cases of moral dilemna, he would indeed ask himself that.
Member of Grognards for 4th Edition
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