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Switch to Forum Live View Official Complaint: Taking away the art galleries and subscriber only now.
4 years ago  ::  Oct 02, 2009 - 4:59PM #51
lokiare
Date Joined: Nov 3, 2008
Posts: 14,740

Oct 2, 2009 -- 12:09PM, mudbunny wrote:


This is an interesting discussion.


A couple of months ago, there was a discussion in the DDI forums (and probably elsewhere as well) on whether a subscription to DDI was "worth it" or not.1 There were a number of people who felt that what they were getting was just not worth the cost.


I am fairly certain that this is a response to discussions of that nature.


1 - This decision is, as far as I am concerned, a completely personal decision.




I took part in those discussions and I specifically stated what would make DDI "worth it". This comes no where close. The only thing that would make DDI worth it to me would be something that I would use on an almost daily basis that I couldn't still use after I unsubscribe. Examples would be the GT (Game Table), or some other online only event that required me to be online to use and that involved other people.


Without proper notice, this does just look like a money grab to me.

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 02, 2009 - 5:16PM #52
RUMPLESTIX
Date Joined: Aug 4, 2008
Posts: 4,883

Oct 2, 2009 -- 4:59PM, lokiare wrote:


Oct 2, 2009 -- 12:09PM, mudbunny wrote:


This is an interesting discussion.


A couple of months ago, there was a discussion in the DDI forums (and probably elsewhere as well) on whether a subscription to DDI was "worth it" or not.1 There were a number of people who felt that what they were getting was just not worth the cost.


I am fairly certain that this is a response to discussions of that nature.


1 - This decision is, as far as I am concerned, a completely personal decision.




I took part in those discussions and I specifically stated what would make DDI "worth it". This comes no where close. The only thing that would make DDI worth it to me would be something that I would use on an almost daily basis that I couldn't still use after I unsubscribe. Examples would be the GT (Game Table), or some other online only event that required me to be online to use and that involved other people.


Without proper notice, this does just look like a money grab to me.




In those discussions was there any mention of making the art available to everyone only available to DDI as being something that people said they thought would make DDI better for them?


Was there such discussion that taking things away from everyone else so that only the DDI users could get them (them being stuff that DDI could get along with everyone else) as being something that DDI subscribers would want?

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2009 - 3:39AM #53
whitebaron
Date Joined: Aug 13, 2007
Posts: 5,772

Oct 2, 2009 -- 5:16PM, RUMPLESTIX wrote:


Was there such discussion that taking things away from everyone else so that only the DDI users could get them (them being stuff that DDI could get along with everyone else) as being something that DDI subscribers would want?




no, you'll have to search hard for subscribers who had that kind of suggestions - as usual, people want more from what they're already getting, more from what they still don't have - they usually don't want to change existing stuff to become even more excluisve.

Here be dragons:

May 25, 2012 -- 10:10PM, Dranack wrote:

Sadly, I don't think this has anything to do with wanting Next to be a great game.
It has to do with wanting Next to determine who won the Edition War.
[...]
For those of us who just want D&D Next to be a good game, this is getting to be a real drag.


Nov 17, 2010 -- 1:05PM, Jharii wrote:

I think I figured it out.  This program is a character builder, not a character builder.  It teaches patience, empathy, and tolerance.  All most excellent character traits.

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2009 - 5:58AM #54
WarlockDa
Date Joined: Jan 19, 2003
Posts: 109

If they keep pushing things into a "DDI ONLY" status, what's going to make ppl decide to hand over their hard earned money?


You have to have something to wet the appetite of potential customers, hell that's what made me decide to sign up.

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2009 - 7:28AM #55
Sacrament
Date Joined: Aug 9, 2009
Posts: 29

Oct 1, 2009 -- 11:26AM, Seeker95 wrote:


I look forward to WotC's response. I am hoping it was simply an oversight, as the art galleries are something that can be used for marketing better than for subscription incentive.




Indeed.

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2009 - 7:52AM #56
Joni-san
  • Shoots first, votes later
Date Joined: Jul 25, 2002
Posts: 1,678

Dude, not cool WOTC.

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4 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2009 - 10:06PM #57
sfdragon
Date Joined: May 8, 2004
Posts: 10,322

I'd like to have the free splatbook galleries back, the emag galleries can stay has pay to view, but then mind you you already have the art in the pdf file...

a mask everyone has at least two of, one they wear in public and another they wear in private.....
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4 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2009 - 10:26PM #58
ItaraKoturo
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Jan 20, 2006
Posts: 1,153

Oct 1, 2009 -- 12:20AM, willpell wrote:


Sep 29, 2009 -- 8:19PM, Salla wrote:


It's just art.  You're not missing out on anything important.





Wow, that might actually be THE MOST ignorant statement I have ever heard.


I got news for you, buddy, art is the only thing in D&D or Magic that is actually worth paying for.  The rest is geeks playtesting the little maths they've brewed up to amuse themselves, and any bored college student could do the same.



I love how you followed up an incredibly narrow-minded statement with one that is equally - if not more - narrow-minded, and then had the gall to call the original statement ignorant.


I mean, really?  You can sum up this exchange with,


"Art is unimportant."


"You're so ignorant!  Art is all-important and everything else is unimportant!"


Just...wow.


As for the issue at hand, I'm ambivalent.  If the move gets more people to subscribe, I think it's a great idea.  Everyone playing the game should subscribe, as far as I'm concerned.

Tales from the Rusty Dragon (http://rustydragon.blogspot.com) - A 4th Edition Conversion Project Covering Paizo's Rise of the Runelords Adventure Path
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4 years ago  ::  Oct 04, 2009 - 12:16AM #59
Kerrus
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Posts: 1,428

I think what we have here is WotC doing an out of house 'playtest' of a potential change. It's clearly stirred up a lot of commentary on both sides of the argument, replete with complex interesting arguments, and the bland bull I've come to expect from people with nothing better to do with their time.


 


But at the same time, I honestly don't see this as a permanent change- WotC got their outrage. They're going to be losing more customers then they'd have gianed by the change if they don't put the book galleries back to free.


 



That being said, art is unimportant to some... and important to others, and to be completely honest, the way I see it is just as has been said. The art serves as a lure, to whet the interests of potential buyers. Splat book art galleries should be free when the book is released, but personally I'd also like to see DDI art become free itself- albiet under certain conditions.


 


I'm all for subscriber only art- it's a nice little bonus, but personally I don't really think it should stay 'exclusive' for that long. Make it DDI exclusive for the month after it's released, and after that point open it up to the public.


 


Right now, DDi is a big wall that separates the subscribers and the nonsubscribers- they don't really know what's going on on the other side of that wall unless they have a friend to tell them, or they're doing the dirty with piracy. Article titles and flavourtext preludes aren't enough- so why not give them the art too?


 


The art gallery for a given mag goes up at the end of the month. Make the art susbscriber only for the following month, and then make it available to everyone as a 'free' thing. Now those people can go look at the art. Because when you get down to it, we're still mostly ruled by our hindbrain- and our hindbrain sees the art and goes "Oh, that looks awesome!" and then you want to subscribe. Not seeing it- and in fact, being told that you have to subscribe to see any of it makes our hindbrain go "Man, you guys are such fornicating mammals, I wipe my hands of you." and actually causes lost business.



The real secret to marketing, something I'm sure those of WotC in sales can tell you- is to make the consumer think that giving you their money was their idea. 


 


And that's basically what releasing DDI exclusive art for free after a given period would help do. People would see it, and people would react to it. And at that point, people have already 'payed' for it. You won't get new business because of the art- unless you've got an art fanatic like up the page. Rather, you'll get the business because of what the art represents. And that's what you're really aiming for.

Oh Content, where art thou?
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4 years ago  ::  Oct 04, 2009 - 1:21AM #60
Jack99
Date Joined: Jul 20, 2009
Posts: 21

Oct 4, 2009 -- 12:16AM, Kerrus wrote:


Snip


But at the same time, I honestly don't see this as a permanent change- WotC got their outrage. They're going to be losing more customers then they'd have gianed by the change if they don't put the book galleries back to free.


Snip


Right now, DDi is a big wall that separates the subscribers and the nonsubscribers- they don't really know what's going on on the other side of that wall unless they have a friend to tell them, or they're doing the dirty with piracy. Article titles and flavourtext preludes aren't enough- so why not give them the art too?


Snip


The real secret to marketing, something I'm sure those of WotC in sales can tell you- is to make the consumer think that giving you their money was their idea. 




I want what you are smoking. What outrage? We have a 3-page thread with a few random people who say they think it should be free, and about 4 of those seem outraged (or should it be nerdraged)?


Seriously, one of the posters was even complaining that since he wasn't buying 4e stuff, he no longer had any reason to come here.. I mean, Quoi??? If you are not a customer, what do you expect? Why should WotC care what you think? It's not like the free galleries are going change the opinion of anything but a few people.


 


 

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