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Switch to Forum Live View Homebrewing some Shadow classes; anyone willing to help?
4 years ago  ::  Jun 08, 2009 - 3:28PM #1
Mist-Bound
Date Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 1,390
For quite some time now, I've had the inspiration for three seperate "Necromantic" classes bubbling around my head. Seeing as how Shadow has been pushed back to the PHB4, at the very least, I was thinking that it's time I actually tried to put my money where my mouth is and see if I have any grounds for thinking that these theoretical classes could actually work in 4th edition.

However, I'm rather a newbie to the art of creating classes, so I was wondering if anyone else would like to help me brainstorm in order to determine whether or not my ideas are valid? I'm not intending to work on all three at once, I fully understand that that way lies madness, but I've included the fluff for all three here in order to determine which one should first be tackled.


Necromancer
The Necromancer is a mage of the Shadow, who studies the dark and forbidden lores of the Shadowfell and how its energy interacts with death and the dead. Necromancers are masters of the undead and the death-born, calling upon dead flesh, bare bones, long-departed spirits and the spectral echoes of destruction and carnage to do their bidding. With these dark allies at their beck and call, Necromancers dominate the battlefield and drive their enemies to destruction. Though an inherently sinister and fearful art, the Necromancer is not inherently evil, though they will never truly walk in the Light.
Likely Role: Controller- like the Summoner Wizard, Necromancers use their powers to intercept enemies and keep them at bay.
Likely Stats: Intelligence as the Primary, as Necromancers study dark lore and forbidden secrets to acquire their power. Charisma and/or Wisdom are the most likely Secondaries.
Theme: Conjuration and Summoning powers, backed with "Invocations" (powers themed as temporarily summoning something from the Shadowfell into the Materium)


Thanatomancer
The Thanatomancer is a cousin to the Necromancer, and the two are often confused. The difference, however, is as distinct as it can be subtle; while Necromancers are masters of the undead, Thanatomancers are masters of death. Through an innate connection to the Shadowfell, Thanatomancers are able to draw upon and unleash the energies of death, decay and corruption, allowing them to afflict foes in all manner of ways. A Thanatomancer has no ability to call shrieking ghosts from beyond, or command the dead to rise from their tombs, but can wither foes with the chill of the grave, ignite the blood in their veins, drain their life with bolts of unearthly darkness, command swarms of vermin to devour their flesh and unleash rains of disease-laden filth.
Likely Role: Controller or Striker- the Thanatomancer is fundamentally a Shadow Sorcerer, compared to the Necromancer's Shadow Wizard.
Likely Stats: Constitution as the Primary, with Charisma as the Secondary.
Likely Damage Types: Necrotic, Cold, Poison
Likely Class Feature: ability to penetrate Necrotic Resistance, like how Sorcerers can ignore specific damage resistances


Baneblade
The final branch of the necromantic tree, Baneblades are Shadow warrior-wizards who mingle dark occultic lore with weapon techniques for offensive and defensive purposes. They learn how to weave webs of Shadow energy about themselves into potent curses to protect themselves from foes, but also learn how to use their weapons as a conduit for this dark power, assaulting enemies physically, mentally and spiritually. The simplest use of this power is to leech the strength, vitality or even the very soul from their prey, but there are other applications as well. A Baneblade can leave a wound festering with disease, or writhing with flesh-eating maggots. They can feed upon the energy they steal, growing stronger as their enemy weakens. Bones become brittle, muscles slacken and blood freezes in the veins of their foe. Some Baneblades even call upon the lingering remnants of past victims to assail their foes.
Likely Role: Defender
Likely Stats: Intelligence and Strength as Primaries, Constitution or Charisma as Secondaries
Likely Weapons: Heavy Blades, Axes, Polearms
Likely Paragon Path: Shadow Legionaire ("My name is Legion. For We are Many.")
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 09, 2009 - 4:51PM #2
JimProfit
Date Joined: Oct 12, 2007
Posts: 918
Good luck dude. I myself love the idea of shadow based powers, and if I had the willpower I'd try to make classes.

I'd base'em off 3rd edition shadow-like classes.

Shadowcaster (Too obvious a name, but was a decent class)

Dread Necromancer (Sounds cooler then just plain necromancer)

Deathknight (Yes, it's World of Warcraft. And D&D gets compared to WoW enough. But it could be good like this homebrew 3rd edition class)
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Knig … D_Class%29

Hexblade (It was an interesting concept but sucked in 3rd edition)

Binder (This was an awesome class)
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 09, 2009 - 5:30PM #3
Mist-Bound
Date Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 1,390
Thanks for the support. I've got ideas, I just lack experience, and I work better if I've got partners to bounce ideas back and forth and to help polish the finished material into balanced work.
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 7:22PM #4
Mist-Bound
Date Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 1,390
So, is noone interested in giving me a hand with this project?
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 7:57PM #5
ShadowGuard
Date Joined: Mar 21, 2006
Posts: 331
Edit: This will be the place for the Reaver class.

Reaver Show
Class Traits
Role: Striker
Power Source: Shadow.
Key Abilities: Strength, Intelligence, Charisma

Armor Proficiencies: Cloth, Leather, Hide, Chainmail, Scale
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple Melee, Military Melee, Simple Ranged
Implements: Any Axe, Hammer, Heavy Blade, or Spear. Your weapon adds its enhancement bonus to attack rolls and damage rolls and any extra damage granted by a property (if applicable) when used as an implement. You do not gain your weapon proficiency bonus to the attack roll when using your weapon as an implement.
Bonus to Defense: +1 Fortitude, +1 Will

Hit points at 1st Level: 15 + Constitution Score
Hit points per level gained: 6
Healing Surges per Day: 8 + Constitution modifier

Trained Skills: From the class list below, choose four trained skills at 1st level. Class skills; Arcana (Int), Athletics (Str), Bluff (Cha), Endurance (Con), Intimidate (Cha), Religion (Int), Stealth (Dex), Streetwise (Cha), Thievery (Dex).

Build Options:
Class Features:Backlash Hex, Curse of Vulnerability, Dark Armory, Way of the Blade.

Reaver Class Features:

Backlash Hex: You gain the Backlash Hex power.

Curse of Vulnerability You gain the Curse of Vulnerability power

Dark Armor:When wearing any type of armor you can add half of its enhancement bonus (rounded up) as an Item bonus to your speed. In addition you can use powers with the Armor keyword.

The Armor keyword is a new keyword for powers. The Armor keyword requires the character to have armor equipped. Some Armor keyword powers require specific types of armor to be equipped, and that would be listed in the powers description. When using a power with the Armor keyword you can add the armors enhancement bonus to the attack rolls and the damage rolls of the attack.


Way of the Blade:
Way of the Baneblade: You make the following changes to these powers.
Backlash Hex:You gain a +1 to the attack roll with this power if you choose to deal Necrotic damage with the power. You deal additional +3 damage when you use this power. This additional damage increases to +6 at 11th level and to +9 at 21st level.
Curse of Vulnerability:When you expend this power you deal damage equal to you Backlash Hex + your Cha modifier to the target.

Way of the Hexblade: You make the following changes to these powers.
Backlash Hex:You gain a +1 to the attack roll with this power if you choose to deal Psychic damage with the power. When you use this power the target takes a -2 penalty to a defense of your choice until the end of your next turn.
Curse of Vulnerability:When you expend this power, the target takes a penalty to saving throws equal to half your Cha modifier (rounded down) (save -3 ends). Only one creature may be affected by your expended Curse of Vulnerability at a time

Way of the Bladethief: You make the following changes to these powers.
Backlash Hex:You gain a +1 to the attack roll with this power if you choose to deal Psychic damage with the power. You can score a critical hit with this power on an 18, 19 or 20
Curse of Vulnerability:When you expend this power the foe takes a 1d6 penalty to attack rolls (save ends).

Way of the Mournblade: You make the following changes to these powers.
Backlash Hex:You gain a +1 to the attack roll with this power if you choose to deal Poison damage with the power. When you use this power it ignores up to 5 + ½ your level Poison resistance. If a creature is immune to poison damage, treat the creature as having poison resistance 30.
Curse of Vulnerability:When you expend this power the target takes ongoing 5+ Int modifier poison damage (save ends).


Reaver Powers
Class Feature Powers Show

Backlash Hex


Blah blah blah
At-Will Shadow, Implement, Necrotic, Psychic, Poison
Imediate Reaction Range 1 x 0
Trigger: An enemy within 10 x squares of you hits you
Target: The triggering enemy in range
Attack: Int vs. Reflex or Cha vs. Reflex
Effect: 1 x d6 Necrotic, Psychic or Poison damage
Level 11 x : 2d6 Necrotic, Psychic or Poison damage
Level 21 x : 3d6 Necrotic, Psychic or Poison damage
Special: This power can only be used up to 2 x times per round. At level 11 it increases to 3 times per round and at 21 level it goes up to 4 times a round.
In addition this power changes accoriding to the choice of Way of the Blade feature.

Curse of Vulnerability
Blah blah blah
At-Will Shadow, Necrotic, Poison, Psychic
Minor Action Range 1 x 0
Target: One creature within range
Effect: The target gains vulnerability 5 x against one of the following damage types, Necrotic, Poison, or Psychic. This lasts until the end of the encounter. Against foes with resistance, reduce the resistance by this amount. This has no effect on foes immune to that damage type.
Level 11 x : increases to vulnerability 10
Level 21 x : increases to vulnerability 15
Special: As a standard action you may expend this curse to trigger the effect listed under the Way of the Blade feature. When expended the vulnerability caused by this power expires. Once expended, you cannot use this power against the triggered target for the remainder of the encounter.



Reaver At-Wills Show

Thirsty Blade

As you plunge your blade into living flesh, it sucks the vital fluids that flow forth from the death blow, infusing you with fresh strength.
At-will, Shadow, Weapon, Necrotic, Healing
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 1 x + Str modifier Necrotic damage
Effect: If the target is reduced to hit points you can heal a number of hit points equal to your Cha modifier.
Level 21 x : Increase to 2[W]

Poisoned Strike

You quickly strike your foe with a blade deadlier than most, and with luck your foes will find them weakened by your venom.
At-will, Shadow, Weapon, Poison
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. Fortitude
Hit: 1 x + Str modifier Poison damage
Effect: If you roll a critical hit with this attack the target takes on-going Poison damage equal to your Int modifier (Save ends).
Level 21 x : Increase to 2[W]

Cloak of Night

A cloak of darkness covers you in protection. Within its shadows, horrid hands lash out shrouding you from your foes.
At-will, Shadow, Armor, Psychic
Standard Action, Close Burst 1
Target: Each creature in burst
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: 1 x d6 + Int modifier Psychic damage
Effect: You gain concealment against the target until the beginning of your next turn.
Special: Caster must be wearing Light Armor
Level 21 x : Increase to 2d6

Biting Curses

Baneful hexes woven into your armor spring to life, a thousand tiny mouths snapping and rending at flesh.
At-will, Shadow, Armor, Necrotic
Standard Action, Close Burst 1
Target: One or Two creatures within the Burst
Attack: Str vs. Reflex
Hit: 1 x d8 + Cha modifier damage
Effect: Targets hit by this power that end their turn adjacent to the caster takes Cha modifier Necrotic damage.
Special: Caster must be wearing Heavy Armor
Level 21 x : Increase to 2d8+Cha

Shadow Slash

Darkness veils your enemy's eyes and dulls their senses, clearing only when the pain of your strike registers. When they can see again, you have moved elsewhere.
At-will, Shadow, Weapon, Psychic
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 1 x + Str modifier Psychic damage
Effect: After the attack you can shift a number of squares equal to you Int modifier.
Level 21 x : Increase to 2[W]

Psycho Cut

You lash out with your blade, not to hit your foes heart, but to strike at your foes mind and leave it open for mental assaults
At-will, Shadow, Weapon, Psychic
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: 1 x + Str modifier Psychic damage
Effect: The target takes a penalty to its will defense equal to your half Cha modifier (rounded up) until the end of your next turn.
Level 21 x : Increase to 2[W]


Level 1 Encounter Powers Show

Shadow web

You ensnare a foe with strands of silken darkness, and then pull them into reach of your weapon.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Force
Standard Action, close burst 5
Target: One creature in burst
Attack: Str vs. Reflex
Hit: You pull the target a number of squares equal to your Str modifier and you deal 1 x + Str modifier Force damage

Writhing Wound

Where your weapon inflicts damage, ravenous maggots gestate within the wound, gnawing hungrily.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Poison
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. Fortitude
Hit: you deal 1 x + Str modifier Poison damage and the target takes a -2 penalty to its Fortitude defense until the end of your next turn.
Mournblade: The penalty equals 1 x + half your Int modifier (rounded up).

Word of Pain

You spit a curse that wracks a foe in torment.
Encounter, Shadow, Implement, Psychic
Standard Action, Range 5
Target: One creature within range
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: you deal 1 x + Str modifier Psychic damage and the target takes a -2 penalty to its attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
Hexblade: The penalty equals 1 x + half your Cha modifier (rounded up).

Dark flame Blade

Your weapon wreathes itself in dark fire that consumes enemies bodies and soul.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Necrotic, Fire
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: you deal 2 x + Str modifier Necrotic and Fire damage
Baneblade: Until the end of your next turn you deal additional Fire damage equal to your Cha modifier with Weapon Attack powers. This bonus to damage is included with this attack.

Shadow Assailant

You land a shadow infused blow, implanting a ghastly illusion in your foes mind that leaves it open for another attack.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Psychic, Illusion
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: STR vs. Will
Hit: you deal 1 x + Str modifier Psychic
Effect: If the target is struck by the initial attack make the secondary attack
Secondary Target: Initial target
Secondary Attack: Str vs. Reflex
Hit: you deal 1 x + Str modifier Psychic
Bladethief: You gain a bonus to the second attack roll equal to half your Int modifier (round down)

Armor of Souls

you absorb parts of the souls of your enemies to fuel newfound powers in your armor
Encounter, Shadow, Armor, Necrotic
Standard Action, Close burst 2
Target: Each enemy in burst
Attack: Str vs. Fortitude
Hit: you deal 2 x d6 + Str modifier Necrotic damage
Special: If you are wearing Heavy armor you gain a +2 x bonus to Fortitude defense. If you are wearing Light armor you gain a +2 bonus to Reflex defense.


Level 1 Daily Powers Show
Barbed Hide
Reaver 1 x Daily Attack Power
Boney protrusions fire out from your skin, spilling blood on the ground that you readily pull into yourself.
Daily, Shadow - Armor, Implement
Standard Action, Close Burst 1
Target: All creatures in burst.
Attack: Str vs Ref
Hit: 2 x d6+Str damage and you gain 5+Int temporary hit points.
Miss: Half damage and you gain Int temporary hit points.
Special: If you are wearing Scalemail, the target takes on-going 3 x damage (save ends).

Deathly Coils
Reaver 1 x Daily Attack Power
Serpentine coils slither out from you, chewing at your foe and tying them down.
Daily, Shadow - Necrotic, Armor, Implement
Standard Action, Ranged 1 x 0
Target: One creature.
Attack: Str vs Will
Hit: 2 x d8+Cha Necrotic Damage and Immobilised (save ends).
Miss: Half damage and slowed until the beginning of your next turn.
Special: If you are wearing Chainmail, you may slide the target one square at the beginning of each turn (save ends both).

Cerberus's Bite
Reaver 1 x Daily Attack Power
The great three-headed dog lashes out through your ties to the afterlife.
Daily, Shadow - Armor, Weapon
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: Up to Three Creatures.
Attack: Str vs. AC
Special: You make three attacks, dividing them amongst your targets as desired.
Hit: 1 x +Str damage.
Special: If you are wearing Hide and you miss with all attacks, the attack is not expended.

Beshadow
Reaver 1 x Daily Attack Power
An inky haze spills from your enemy's wound, roiling back over you with inky darkness.
Daily, Shadow - Poison, Armor, Weapon
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One Creature
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 2 x +Str damage and you gain concealement against the target (save ends)
Miss: Half damage and you gain concealement against the target until the end of your next turn.
Special: If you are wearing Leather, the target grants you combat advantage (save ends both).

Visions of Nightmare
Reaver 1 x Daily Attack Power
Eerily descriptive words roil across your armor, burning torments of the afterlife on a foe's mind.
Daily, Shadow - Psychic, Armor, Implement, Charm
Standard Action, Close Burst 5
Target: One Creature within the Burst.
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: 2 x d6+Cha damage and Dazed until the beginning of your next round.
Miss: Half damage.
Special: If you are wearing Cloth or Plate, until the end of the encounter, any enemy that moves adjacent to you takes Cha mod Psychic Damage.

Powers done by Johnathan Vagabond


Level 2 Utility Show


Shout of Black Speech

You shout words of a forbidden language that fill the ears of your foes, each understanding that you are a harbinger of destruction
Daily, Shadow
Minor Action, Close burst 3
Target: Each enemy in burst
Effect: You can make an Intimidate check against each target within the burst. Intimidate checks made with this power do not take the penalty if you don’ x ;t speak the language the target can understand. Creatures that have been success fully Intimidated take a -2 to attack rolls against you until the end of the encounter.

Follow the Cursed

As long as your curse remains strong, the foe can’ x ;t out run your onslaught.
Encounter, Shadow
Immediate Reaction, Range 1 x 0
Trigger: A creature within range under the effect of your Curse of Vulnerability moves away.
Target: The triggering creature
Effect: You can teleport to a square adjacent to the triggering creature

Reckless Fate

You spin a bit of black magic into the fate of your next attack, but the price of this could be dire.
Encounter, Shadow
Free action, Personal
Trigger: You make an attack roll you dislike
Effect: You Re-roll the attack roll and gain a +2 x bonus to the attack. You grant combat advantage to foes until the beginning of your next turn.

Armor of Curses

You spit a slew of hexes to form an armor of curses that plagues those who strike at you.
Daily, Shadow
Minor Action, Personal
Effect: Until the end of your next turn any foe that attacks you gains the Curse of Vulnerability.


Level 3 Encounter Powers Show

Weight of Sins

You curse a foe to feel the weight of all the crimes and sins it has committed, slowing it down for every soul it has taken.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Psychic
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: 2 x + Str modifier Necrotic damage and the target is slowed until the end of your next turn.
Hexblade: The target is Immobilized until the end of your next turn.

Noxious Onslaught

poisonous pus oozes from your weapon, leaving your foes infections in their wounds.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Poison
Standard Action, Close burst 1
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. Fortitude
Hit: you deal 1 x + Str modifier Poison damage and the target ongoing 5 Poison damage (Save ends)
Mournblade: You deal an additional amount of damage equal to your Int modifier

Burry into the Grave

You strike your foe with a mighty blow to make sure they never rise again, its demise inspires you to fill the graveyard further.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Necrotic
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: you deal 2 x + Str modifier Necrotic damage and you knock the target prone
Effect: If the target is reduced to hit points you gain a +2 to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
Baneblade: If the target is bloodied you gain a +2 x to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.

Strike from the Illusion

A foe finds itself striking an illusion, while you find yourself striking your foe.
Encounter, Shadow, Weapon, Psychic, Illusion, Teleportation
Immediate Interrupt, Close burst 5
Trigger: A Creature within the burst attacks you
Target: The creature that triggered this power.
Special: You teleport to an unoccupied square adjacent to the creature.
Attack: STR vs. Reflex
Hit: you deal 2 x + Str modifier Psychic damage
Bladethief: If you miss with this attack you do not expend the power.

Armor of the Black Tar

Your armor spews a black tar that coats you and your foes.
Encounter, Shadow, Armor, Necrotic
Standard Action, Close burst 2
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. Reflex
Hit: you deal 2 x d8 + Str modifier Necrotic damage
Effect: Until the end of your next turn any creature that attacks you takes 5 x ongoing Necrotic damage (save ends)
Special: If the caster is wearing Heavy armor you may reduce forced movement by a number of squares equal to you Str modifier


Level 5 Daily Powers Show

Wailing Shroud

Vestigial faces, the shattered remnants of your many victims, begin to swim across your armor, howling, screaming, crying, begging. The hideous cacophony drives away those who would dare to oppose you.
Daily, Shadow, Armor, Stance, Psychic
Standard Action, close burst 1
Target: Each creature in burst
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: 2 x d8 + Str modifier Psychic damage and the target is pushed 2 squares.
Effect: You enter into a stance of the Wailing Shroud. At the start of each of your turns, each enemy adjacent to you can be pushed 1 x squares as a free action.

Teeth below

Hidden jaws latch onto your foe from its shadow, engulfing its feet injecting it with a deadly poison that prevents it from moving.
Daily, Shadow, Implement, Poison
Standard Action, Range 5
Target: One creature within range
Attack: Str vs. Reflex
Hit: you deal 3 x d8 + Str modifier Poison damage and the target is immobilized (Save ends).

Blinding Curse

Your words take on shadowy forms, all wings and barbs, and envelop your victim's face. Clawing at the gouging, tearing mass, they stagger blindly into your ambush.
Daily, Shadow, Implement, Psychic
Standard Action, Range 5
Target: One creature within range
Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: you deal 2 x d8 + Str modifier Psychic damage and the target is Blinded until the end of your next turn
Sustain Minor: The condition persists.

Lashing Blade

Your weapon extends, flailing like some demonic tongue desperate for the quenching flow of blood.
Daily, Shadow, Weapon, Necrotic, Stance
Standard Action, Close Burst 5
Target: One creature within burst
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: you deal 3 x + Str modifier Necrotic damage
Effect: You enter into a stance of the Lashing Blade. As long as the stance is active you increase your melee reach by 1 x square.

Wraith Thorns

Ethereal barbs sprout from your weapon, each one the tooth of a soul-fragment bound to your will. Should you strike your foe hard enough; a fang will break off in the wound, that vestigial soul assailing your enemy's very mind.
Daily, Shadow, Weapon, Psychic
Standard Action, Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: STR vs. AC
Hit: you deal 2 x + Str modifier Psychic damage
Effect: If the target is struck by the initial attack make the secondary attack
Secondary Target: Initial target
Secondary Attack: Str vs. Will
Hit: you deal 1 x + Str modifier Psychic and the target takes ongoing 5 Psychic damage.


Level 6 Utility Powers Show

Blood Blade

you sacrifice a bit of health to add a deadly coat of necrotic energy to your blade
Encounter, Shadow, Necrotic
Minor Action, Personal
Effect: You spend a healing surge, until the end of your next turn your attacks gain the Necrotic keyword. Attacks made while under this effect deal an extra 3 x points of damage, this extra damage increases to 6 at paragon tier and 9 at epic tier.

Backlash Fury

you channel you anger in your Backlash Hex, making it a curse to be reckoned with.
Encounter, Shadow
Minor Action, Personal
Effect: Until the end of your next turn you’ x ;re your Backlash Hex deals extra damage equal to 1 + either your Int or Cha modifier.

Illusionary Coating

You blade swirls and fades into an illusionary realm to strike your foes mind
Encounter, Shadow, Illusion
Free Action, Personal
Effect: Your next attack strikes the Will defense of the creature instead of the normal defense. If the attack already targets the Will defense you gain a +2 x to the attack.

Shroud of Vile

a veil of vile poison seeps from your armor, making your foes think twice before attacking you.
Encounter, Shadow, Poison
Minor Action, Personal
Effect: Until the end of your next turn you’ x ;re you are hit by melee attacks the attacker takes ongoing 5 Poison damage (save ends)
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 8:05PM #6
Mist-Bound
Date Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 1,390
Thanks ShadowGuard, I appreciate it. So, is there a particular one of the three classes I suggested in the OP that grabs your attention? I figured that, if this project got off the ground, we'd tackle them one by one before figuring out other classes that might stem from the Shadow source. I've mentioned elsewhere that I think the Illusionist would work as the Shadow Leader, but I've always had more of a soft spot for the "necromantic" aspects of Shadow than the "nyctomantic" (illusion and phantasm) aspects.
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 8:35PM #7
ShadowGuard
Date Joined: Mar 21, 2006
Posts: 331
I think that the Necromancer is the corner stone of the shadow power source and it should be the first to be addressed. I like your ideas, and I can agree that the necromantic field is a great place to start off with the Shadow power source. I have a question, do you have Open Grave? If you do that would be great, because all my undead options are really in the MM. I’m sure there are plenty of undead ideas in that book that would make for great “summoning” fodder for the Necromancer. I agree that in first glance that the Necromancer should be a controller. The role is easy enough to establish but there is something I want to talk about first before we get into stats.

The thanatomancer, I like the concept of the class but I have to question on whether or not it can stand alone as a class. You wrote down a lot of good flavor, but it seems more like a Necromancer build option. The divide between the two classes seem to leave the other lacking in options. If you think the Thanatomancer has enough to stand on its own, then I am all for making as many classes as you want to.

Now back to the necromancer, if we do fold them together than the stats would be easy to plan out. Intelligence should be the primary for the class, Con should be the focus of Thanatomancers for controlling death and life forces, while Cha should be for having the will power to sway the dead back to life.

Oh and your Baneblade idea is cool, and I think I could work as a class on its own.
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 8:57PM #8
Mist-Bound
Date Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 1,390
Yes, I have Open Grave- I have all of the non-adventure sourcebooks that have been released so far, though Eberron Player's Guide won't be here until next month (and ECG and Divine Power the month after that, presumably).

Just to go off topic for a second, do you think we could make it work if our Necromancer not only summoned "canon" undead, but could also call "death echoes"? Basically, by reaching into the Shadowfell, the Necromancer can summon a kind of "death memory", a particular resonance/flavor/whatever you want to call it of Shadowfell energy, which can then be sculpted into physical form to create a servitor, a living (so to speak) embodiment of that death? I got the idea from the Suffering; the enemies you fight there are material embodiments of death by various means (slashing weapons, firing squad, drowning/being eaten alive by rats, poison, electrocution, lethal injection).

Similarly, what about Golems? I'm pretty sure there are a few cases where creating "false life" is also attributed to Necromancers... I mean, you have Diablo's Necromancer, who can summon Clay, Metal, Blood and Fire golems, or even D&D's own Flesh and Bone golems.

I'll admit that the Thanatomancer, traditionally, is rolled into the Necromancer, but I think it might just be able to stand on its own. If you consider Thanatomancer to focus on the magic of death and how it interacts with the living world (which actually has an existing 4e incarnation, in the form of the Flesh Cults of Open Grave), and Necromancy on warping the boundaries between life and death, then I think that gives them room enough to stand on their own. I'll admit that they could be joined together, but I feel that would just be a repeat of "Druid Syndrome", where you have a class that feels like it could be split in half... so, really, I'd prefer to try and make them as seperate classes first, then roll them into one if that fails.

Hmm... what about dividing the Necromancer into these two builds? The "Phantasmagorist" focuses on the ephemeral side of necromancy, drawing upon spirits and shades, while the "Corruptor" (I suck at names, just so you know) focuses on the physical side, commanding the bones and flesh of the dead. In this case, Intelligence becomes the Primary- as you and I have said, the Necromancer studies dark lore, so it's fundamentally a Shadow Wizard and thus Int makes sense. The Phantasmagorist focuses on Wisdom; tricking, deceiving and otherwise manipulating thinking entities into doing their will. The Corruptor focuses on Charisma; using their sheer force of will to force the dead to move and kill only as they will it.

And I'm glad you like the Baneblade.
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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 9:30PM #9
ShadowGuard
Date Joined: Mar 21, 2006
Posts: 331

Just to go off topic for a second, do you think we could make it work if our Necromancer not only summoned "canon" undead, but could also call "death echoes"? Basically, by reaching into the Shadowfell, the Necromancer can summon a kind of "death memory", a particular resonance/flavor/whatever you want to call it of Shadowfell energy, which can then be sculpted into physical form to create a servitor, a living (so to speak) embodiment of that death? I got the idea from the Suffering; the enemies you fight there are material embodiments of death by various means (slashing weapons, firing squad, drowning/being eaten alive by rats, poison, electrocution, lethal injection).


I love the idea, and could see Phantasmagorist pulling these "death memories" spirits into life to spread dread amongst foes. There was a really cool 3.5 undead from the MM3 called the Drowned that would create a Drowning aura to make foes think they were experiance drowning with out there being any water to drown on. So I am so happy with idea.

Similarly, what about Golems? I'm pretty sure there are a few cases where creating "false life" is also attributed to Necromancers... I mean, you have Diablo's Necromancer, who can summon Clay, Metal, Blood and Fire golems, or even D&D's own Flesh and Bone golems.


Yep, Corrupters should definatly get some Golem lovin so I am good with that idea as well.

I'll admit that the Thanatomancer, traditionally, is rolled into the Necromancer, but I think it might just be able to stand on its own. If you consider Thanatomancer to focus on the magic of death and how it interacts with the living world (which actually has an existing 4e incarnation, in the form of the Flesh Cults of Open Grave), and Necromancy on warping the boundaries between life and death, then I think that gives them room enough to stand on their own. I'll admit that they could be joined together, but I feel that would just be a repeat of "Druid Syndrome", where you have a class that feels like it could be split in half... so, really, I'd prefer to try and make them as seperate classes first, then roll them into one if that fails.


Okay two seperate classes it is. So what will be the big draw to the thanatomancer class?

Hmm... what about dividing the Necromancer into these two builds? The "Phantasmagorist" focuses on the ephemeral side of necromancy, drawing upon spirits and shades, while the "Corruptor" (I suck at names, just so you know) focuses on the physical side, commanding the bones and flesh of the dead. In this case, Intelligence becomes the Primary- as you and I have said, the Necromancer studies dark lore, so it's fundamentally a Shadow Wizard and thus Int makes sense. The Phantasmagorist focuses on Wisdom; tricking, deceiving and otherwise manipulating thinking entities into doing their will. The Corruptor focuses on Charisma; using their sheer force of will to force the dead to move and kill only as they will it.


Don't worry about names, I am not that great at them either so your not alone. I like the concepts for the two intial builds for the Necromancer so I am for it.

And I'm glad you like the Baneblade


Well the main reason I like it is because it can fill the Blackguard/Shadowguard type role well.

I have a little off topic idea to bring up as well. I would like one of the builds of any the classes to be a Grafter. It would be a person who would harvest the dead and fuse themselves with their tainted flesh to become death itself. I like the idea of Polymorph and turning into undead to control foes. It would be Con based and I could see it working as a build for any of the three classes presented.

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4 years ago  ::  Jun 17, 2009 - 9:51PM #10
Mist-Bound
Date Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 1,390
Hmm... with the "Grafter", perhaps that might make a Paragon Path for the Baneblade? I'm not a hundred percent sure it could be a full class... then again, I did once contemplate a "Deathtouched" class that revolved around the user channeling shadow energy into themself in order to mutate themselves in various ways (growing Ghoul's Claws to rake and poison a foe, or unleashing a Gibbering Scream to Push enemies away in fear), so perhaps best to keep it in the logs- could definately be worth investigating.

Hmm... I'm thinking the Thanatomancer's "schtick" would be either pure damage, status afflictions, or a combination of the two. For example, infecting a foe with a fast-acting plague that can spread to other enemies that get near it, or using a swarm of carnivorous locusts to rend at a victim's face, causing them to stagger around wildly as they try to brush them free. Kind of like a combination between the Sorcerer and the Warlock, if that makes sense. Despite that, I can see the builds. Life-in-Death focuses on using shadow energy to manipulate living creatures, so mysteries like Touch of the Plague, Call the Scavengers and Heart Ripper benefit from this build. Death-in-Life focuses on "death energy", so this build is more for the benefit of mysteries like Breath of the Tombs and Cloud of Night.

Alright then, so, where do we begin for the Necromancer?

::EDIT::
I was just thinking of something and I thought I'd bring it up. It is my opinion, though I can be swayed from it, that the Necromancer's powers will all damage foes *indirectly*. The motif of the Necromancer is that they use their powers to make other beings do their bidding, including to kill- it is the Thanatomancer and the Baneblade that directly strike at their foes with Shadow magic. So all of the powers they have should be fluffed as having revolved around some other entity- the Necromancer merely commanded that entity to do its bidding.

For example, if the Necromancer has an At-Will that does fire damage, then the Necromancer *doesn't* shoot flame itself- it calls forth the remnant of some creature who died in a fire, the blazing shade then embracing the Necromancer's target(s) and searing them as it shares its final moments with them.

Also, for reasons that basically tie into this, I'm thinking that the Corruptor will specialise in Summoning powers (which would be the ones that create corporeal undead and golems), while the Phantasmagorist will specialise in Conjuration powers (which would be the ones that summon death echoes and incorporeal undead).
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