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5 years ago ::
Jul 04, 2008 - 5:05PM
#21
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Date Joined:
Jun 28, 2008
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as far as TWF goes, I would like a slightly more realistic system, but I'm not that worried about it, after all dnd combat is a very abstract system. For the most part I'm just glad they nerfed the old mechanics of if you have a second weapon you get another attack, and if you take a couple of feats you get 2-3 more. My own personal fighting experience tells me that you can make the same number of attacks (ie physical swingings of a weapon) wether your dual wielding, shield wielding, or using a two handed. or even a single one handed. the difference two weapon fighting makes is that your opponent has to keep track of both the main and off-hand weapons, but so do you. Without training, it's nigh impossible to dual wield effectively, however, i assume that the martial classes all have some training in all forms of combat using any weapons their proficient with, including twf, thus the feat as far as i'm concerned is a form of specialization. now, if you wanted to, you could make a twf proficiency feat, that negates some form of penalty, and then stick twf on the list of proficiencies for the fighter ranger and rogue. For the most part though, as was said above, twf is meant to distract your opponent with one weapon so the other can hit better, so a +1 to damage is great, take two weapon defense and now your using it as a shield as well, although I'm thinking about removing two weapon defenses prereq for twf, because it doesn't make since to me that you can't learn to block with it until after you learn to use it offensively, finally, I might bump twf up to a +2, just because +1 is kinda small. oh, and what someone said about what if the off hand weapon connects? that's why you can choose to attack with either one.
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5 years ago ::
Jul 04, 2008 - 11:56PM
#22
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Date Joined:
Jun 22, 2008
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Want a non-ranger to dual wield? Why not multiclass ranger?
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 12:52AM
#23
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2007
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Well, back in the day, I had a player in my group, a dual-wielding ranger, and he just dominated so much that the other characters all had to dual-wield just to keep up. Which was okay, but I though the Bard dual-wielding bastard swords was a little much (plus, he had Monkey Grip, so, he already did effectively what you were talking about above), so I'm glad its been toned down. I do know a guy that said he hated that you couldn't attack different targets, but that was always stupid anyway, because I am lead to believe that that is nearly impossible (something to do with how our eyes are set up or something).
I will admit that it does kinda suck that you pretty much have to be a Ranger to dual-wield, my last group had a Paladin that dual-wielded longsword and heavy shield (yes, he bashed people. A lot), but I'm not too disappointed. Also, though, I do believe that they already mentioned on the WotC main site that you could easily house rule it that if you have TWD, your off-hand weapon would be considered a shield for Fighter abilities. I haven't looked at the fighter in-depth, but that'd probably work pretty well, simply deciding that powers that specifically deal with bashing have to be made with a bludgeoning weapon. I see no problem with this. In fact, this would also work in reverse, allowing a shield to act as an off-hand weapon (of course, you can't use it offensively and still keep your AC/Reflex bonus, and I don't think TWD would work with it either, because that would just be...weird...).
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 1:59AM
#24
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Date Joined:
Oct 24, 2006
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Two Weapon Fighting - Gain the at-will power Dual Strike - Melee, Standard Action, must be holding a weapon in each hand, you make one basic attack with either weapon. If you are not using a main and offhand weapon, you take a -2 on attacks while using Dual Strike
This is significantly stronger than the Ranger's Twin Strike power, since it would add Strength bonus to damage.
If I were to make a non-Ranger version of Twin Strike, I might do something like this:
Requirement: You must be wielding two weapons.
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs. AC (main-hand weapon)
Hit: 1[W] damage. Make a secondary attack.
Secondary Target: One creature
Secondary Attack: Strength vs. AC (off-hand weapon)
Secondary Hit: 1[W] damage.
This is comparable to a basic attack, and not as good as Twin Strike - which seems fair, considering that Twin Strike is easily one of the best at-wills of any class.
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 4:40AM
#25
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Date Joined:
Feb 14, 2008
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Two Weapon FightingTier: Heroic Requirements: Strength 13 x or Dexterity 13  Benefits: Gain access to the Double Strike at-will power. Double StrikeFeat Attack 1 At-Will Martial, Weapon Standard Action Melee Requirement: You must be wielding two melee weapons. Target: One creature Attack: Strength vs. AC (main hand) Hit: 1 x damage, make a secondary attack ![](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?name=damage, make a secondary attack&type=card&set=["w"]) Secondary Target: Same creature targeted by primary attack. Secondary Attack: Strength vs. AC (offhand) Hit: 1 x damage ![](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?name=damage&type=card&set=["w"])
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 5:00AM
#26
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Date Joined:
Sep 18, 2007
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Regardless of anything, I wouldn't make it a replacement for the TWF feat in the PHB. I assumed that was not a feat that said "I know how to fight with two weapons" but instead one that says "I fight better when I'm holding two weapons" and as such was a way to specialize in the style more and make up a bit for not carrying a shield after getting both of them.
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 9:23AM
#27
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Date Joined:
Jul 22, 2007
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Want a non-ranger to dual wield? Why not multiclass ranger?
Or you could play a half elf...
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 8:58PM
#28
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Date Joined:
Oct 24, 2006
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Two Weapon Fighting
Tier: Heroic
Requirements: Strength 13 x or Dexterity 13
Benefits: Gain access to the Double Strike at-will power.
Double Strike
Feat Attack 1
At-Will Martial, Weapon
Standard Action Melee
Requirement: You must be wielding two melee weapons.
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs. AC, two attacks
Hit: 1 x damage
It's still giving an at-will power for a single feat with virtually no prerequisite, which is unprecedented. Moreover, the power gained is one of the most powerful in the game.
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5 years ago ::
Jul 05, 2008 - 9:18PM
#29
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Date Joined:
Jun 22, 2008
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Or you could play a half elf...
Yup. Dilettante FTW.
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5 years ago ::
Jul 06, 2008 - 4:09AM
#30
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Date Joined:
Feb 14, 2008
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It's still giving an at-will power for a single feat with virtually no prerequisite, which is unprecedented. Moreover, the power gained is one of the most powerful in the game.
It only allows you to attack one target instead of two like twin strike. In addition, it doesn't add any ability modifiers to it. It doesn't have any secondary effects either like a lot of other at wills. Not to mention the character is spending a feat to acquire it.
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