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deanruel wrote:

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I was just wondering, as a momentary aside from the geography thing, about something. I'm wondering what aspects of 4E we can try to work into this project. Now I'll openly admit to not being very up to date about the 4E developments (it's always been my plan to wait till the release, peruse the books in the store and then decide whether I'm staying or going), so I'm wondering if some of you guys could help me out here.

As far as I can figure the only parts of 4E we can work into the town right now are the races. Making an effort to use Dragonborn or Eladrin as a mainstay of our settlement and thusly help out that way. We don't know enough about the classes now to make them have any real addition to the setup. Does anyone know what else we could insert into our town to develop new 4E ideas?

It hasn't really been finalized yet, but we were considering starting off the refugees (and possibly the city) without using any PC classes. In previous threads, the city had always been started with a PC class of significant level, which made it appear as though the city couldn't be started without one. For this city I thought we might deviate from that and show how it could be possible for non-player characters to form and build a successful city. Later, we could add PCs to the city as it grows in size (50 NPCs to 1 PC) and strength; I think this would highlight a "point-of-light" theme far better than making the city just an extension of PC accomplishments.

Now we do have some semblance of what will be going into the new rules based on the Wizard's Presents series Races and Classes and Worlds and Monsters. Much of that we have already touched upon here. There is also a thread here that gives a compiled list of confirmed rules for 4th Edition for those that can't access those books, though the information is only drawn from Races and Classes. Admittedly, I'm also not well versed in these and will probably also wait until the core books are released to stores before knowing anything about the game. However, this is merely a discussion thread; nothing we say or do here will have much affect on the official BAC4.0, at least not until we get the official rules. It would be hard pressed for us to finalize anything only to discover that we have to retcon everything simply because we got a few things wrong.

So, in a nutshell, anything you wish to contribute may be submitted here. This is an idea thread, and any idea is welcome. We will discuss it, critique it (maybe add to it), and when the time comes it may be included in the chronicles. And while most ideas will be addressed, just keep in mind that it may not be in the final product. For now though, we seem to be on the subject of concept: what is the city going to be like, how will it be built (slowly IMO), what will the environment be like (looks to be decided already), and what kind of folk live there. It may be prudent to keep our focus on that so we don't end up horribly disorganized at the last minute.

P.S. When we are ready to start the city, I (or someone else) will create a separate thread for the city and any related material (journals and such.) This thread will remain open for the purposes of discussion and proposals with regards to the city. And like this thread, I'll attempt to sticky it so anybody can view it and get ideas. In this way, I hope to avoid the mistakes of the last two installments, and allow the "city thread" to focus on the story instead of getting bogged down by differences of opinion.

PerennialRook wrote:

I like the cliffside images and the suggested map. Maybe I will break out my sketchbook and work up an elevation sketch of the redoubt in the pass, the steps, and the waterfall and small lake.

Some public domain photographs for inspiration:

Yosemite Valley Show

Bridalveil Falls Show

URL=http://travel.webshots.com/photo/2311680870039241787QDWFVO][/url]

Little Yosemite Show

From the valley floor Show

The wintered valley Show

Bird's-eye view Show

An area between Queenstown and Milford Sound Show

Another View Show

Overlooking Queenstown Show

james_gaines wrote:

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What if, assuming that the redoubt was already occupied, the people there didn't want the refugees? If a race of dragonborne had a clutch there, they might see people as dangerous and a menace, a view which could still exist today.

Alternatively, what if it wasn't one of the PC races there? A tribe of nomadic kobolds sheltered during the winter here.

How about: "When the refugees first came here to *town* they found a relatively peaceful solace from the fire and flames. They settled down and started to build a new community. Life was hard, that first year, many succumbed to sickness or accident, some trades had to be totally rediscovered ("is anyone here a blacksmith? No? Cr*p"), and crops had to be planted from what few seeds the refugees could scrounge or steal from the old city. However, nothing could match the battles that would be fought that winter.

The redoubt had been a refuge for the Tyrmannuck kobold tribe for decades, and they were not happy to see new arrivals stealing their water, inhabiting their nests, and trespassing on their grounds. For four weeks the kobolds engaged in out and out warfare, guerilla tactics, and sabotage..."

Eventually the people struck a truce with the kobolds, and allow them to stay during the winter months. This could either be a cause of celebration (to lighten spirits, encourage the 'tourists' to trade, or just as a rememberance of an end of fighting) or near hostility and tension throughout the entire city. The refugees didn't have it easy once they got to the valley, they had to overcome obstacles almost as bad as the original disaster.

Maybe the dragonborne could be the link between the people and kobolds, and thus have a special role in the villiages safety, acting as emissaries and translators.

PerennialRook wrote:

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Dragonborn are described as having clans of 20 to 50 relatives, though are often solitary. Clutches of eggs would be rare, as it seems that a female lays only one at a time.

The question of why the redoubt isn't inhabited, but is known to some of the refugees, wore on me. It seemed that the last surviving handful of dragonborn of a clan living in the redoubt and welcoming the weary travelers into a dry shelter, would be a good starting point for our new endeavor.

But then we run the risk of becoming too busy, which is something I think we should avoid, especially in a "points-of-light" environment. Don't get me wrong, I like the ideas; yet, I don't know if their well-suited to what we're trying to accomplish.