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Switch to Forum Live View Campaign Settings- What are your pet peeves?
5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 1:49PM #21
Lord_Ventnor
  • Heroic Dungeon Master
Date Joined: Jul 9, 2008
Posts: 5,399

NachtSieger wrote:

You say that as if it were a bad thing =P.


Oh, no, no, not at all. Dragonborn look rather fun to play, actually. :D

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 2:25PM #22
Archtyrant_Terevoth
Date Joined: Jun 25, 2001
Posts: 1,254
1. It's high magic, but nobody knows that.

Even though you've got archmagi who can level cities and take out armies with the snap of their fingers, or who can create infinite suits of plate mail with fabricate, the world goes by as if these people just didn't exist. In fact, nobody seems to care that there are tons of ways to bypass conventional medieval defenses and they just go about happily building castles and start fortresses, completely ignoring that walls won't keep out any wizard of 3rd level or higher. Similarly, when the king dies, nobody suggests just raising him, instead everyone morns as though there was nothing that could be done. And nobody ever thought of combining portable holes and teleport spells for trade. Ever.

2. The endless war
Yes, planescape, I'm looking at you. As with any setting that has infinite battlefields and the like. It's bad as a PC to come up against an unwinnable war. It's ten times worse when you know that anything you might do is a drop in an infinitely large pond and that leads to the next one....

3. Low-level? Yeah you guys don't matter, don't even pretend that you're heroes.
This is the typical scenario in a world filled with high-level people, or at least enough where it's likely that the world actually doesn't need any help from low level people beyond doing dirty jobs that the higher level guys don't want to touch. If your low-level PCs fail, it's not going to be the end of Shadowdale or Cormyr. It's just not and you know it. Pretty much you can't be heroes.
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 2:38PM #23
Erk_
Date Joined: Oct 18, 2007
Posts: 880
Since I don't remember the last time anyone GMed for me () I'll turn the tables slightly:

1) Players who assume the setting is a collection of tropes
My settings are usually nuanced and complex, and if it looks like I used a trope to define an entire nation or species, chances are that is just so that I can start from stock and develop it. As an example, in my current setting the characters have just learned to speak Kobold, and are beginning to wonder if they've been on the right end of the sword this whole time.

Nevertheless, even in my pretty forgiving group of players who are aware I do this, I occasionally get someone assuming they know a species/culture/group based on the tropes assocated with them.

2) RAW fluff
The RAW fluff is, in my opinion, absolutely pathetic. The gods are flavourless, the races' history is generically bad fantasy, even the planes have weird names and functions. I encourage my players to ignore the RAW fluff and create their own for their characters.

That said, it's better than the 3e fluff: at least I can extricate the 4e fluff with a handwave.
My laptop resolution is 800x400.

The forum is 1224 pixels wide. Sorry, I won't be replying to many people until the designers learn to use "width: x%" instead of pixels.
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 4:30PM #24
gnarfflinger
Date Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 140
The wait for Ravenloft is actually cheesing me off. It was my favourite setting, and I really want to see if WotC is going to do much with it or if it's just a column in Dragon Magazine...
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 5:56PM #25
Rogue_Elendae
Date Joined: Oct 31, 2005
Posts: 329

KarlDark wrote:

I've only ever been in one campiagn where it was human only and it totally worked and was enjoyable... Legend of the 5 rings... not sure how it would work in 4e now but in 3.5 it was good stuff.


Big thing there is...L5R/Rokugan isn't actually a D&D setting. The Oriental Adventures splatbook effectively ripped off and d20-ified the actual Legend of the Five Rings game concept and retooled it for D&D use (there's a whole chunk on how to import D&D races and classes in the book, I believe, plus at least two non-Rokugan races and a class or two slapped in for good measure), but in the end the setting's not really meant for anything but humans and Nezumi. So I can see why the campaign was run with only humans allowed.

Anyway, to the actual topic...my personal pet peeves about campaign settings? Here's the major ones I can think of, complete with goofy titles, just for the heck of it. Be warned, some of this spills over more into the mishandling of setting creation/use by DMs, and isn't really a peeve with settings themselves...

1) "The world is not enough": otherwise known as too much friggin' detail. This is my biggest problem with published settings; I couldn't get interested in Forgotten Realms largely because it felt like there was far too much to take in with regard to history of every known part of the world, the involvement of various deities in the world and their little quirks (Lolth and her lot, I'm looking at you!), ancient artifacts, various groups of prestige and common knowledge, various named and powerful NPCs, etc. I felt that there didn't seem to be enough space for any sense of discovery or the sheer adventure of going into the unknown.

This particularly presents a problem when you combine it with players that have access to the backstory of the setting in the form of novels and the like; I'd never have run FR with a particular friend of mine who was obsessed with the various FR novel series covering Drizzt and Elminster; he'd be the first to metagame or otherwise use his knowledge--even unintentionally--to throw the proverbial wrench into any interpretation of the setting that wasn't like the books. Players might know more about the setting than the DM, and the knowledge can be further distorted by multiple authors' interpretations of it.

Not to say that this can't happen in a homebrew, but the release of information to the players is more easily mitigated to what's vital, and the DM can change the world to more easily fit around what the players do, so it's infinitely more mutable at a glance than something that's in print and has years of stuff to back it up.

2) "Why am I doing this again?": back to an over-detailed setting, the idea that there are NPCs of epic or near-epic level lurking in a world, particularly those regarded as great heroes or villains makes one wonder what some lesser villain or budding hero is doing there. Especially when it's implied that those great heroes and villains are still involved in the affairs of the world; those minor villains would either get squashed by the big villains so there's no challenge to their power-base, or knocked down by the heroes to keep them from getting to world-domination levels by common logic, so why are there uprising heroes who are somehow the only ones who can challenge them? Why are new heroes suddenly involved--even inadvertently--in stopping the affairs of some BBEG, at that?

3) "Low Magic": plain and simple. I want my high-fantasy, crazy magical world in D&D. I want to see Wizards and Warlocks throwing around dangerous elemental power or eldritch energy straight out of Hell or wherever, magic artifacts of ancient power, etc., because if I didn't want fantastical things, I wouldn't be playing a game that's geared toward sword-and-sorcery types of fantasy themes. If I wanted grim-and-gritty (what some people seem to equate "low magic" settings to, it often seems), I'd play nWoD mortals-only, or Shadowrun, or even L5R with the Shadowlands on the rise. Those can do gritty, dark, potentially life-threatening danger far better IMO than an outright neutering of magic in D&D. Especially because it always seems that higher level play in D&D is practically tailored to either the need for magic or at least weapons that're either magic or meant to disrupt it to bypass DR, etc.

4) "The Rule of Cool" and the "I Just Don't Like 'Em!": this is not always a pet peeve...sometimes it's a very good thing, as the former can help justify why things that are slightly illogical are so, or otherwise cover for minor oddities. The second can also be used for good to a lesser extent, but it can still cover for why a DM might do something. I don't like it when it goes too far, particularly in homebrew; some people use it to justify their dislike of a race/class/spell/etc. by making them utterly unplayable in their setting, or make one race/class/etc. stand out as overtly good, or otherwise strain the concept of "My world, my way."

For examples of what I consider good/bad uses of the "Don't like 'em" concept (Because rule of cool is harder to define as when it's gone too far), my BF freely admits to not really liking Elves, but he doesn't go out of his way to make them a hated creature that won't even be able to get into a town without people wanting to burn them at the stake, or making them pure evil. They're just less prevalent, and slightly more insular in their communities, so they might not be a common sight but are by no means seen as monsters. It's a solution that leaves room for the possibility that a player might want to use one, and the DM will have to work with it, but that it can be less than ideal for the player. Just not impossible to work with.

In contrast--especially with 4e--it seems like a lot of people want to do just that with races like the Tieflings or Dragonborn, and try to use their appearance/RAW history fluff/classic RAW fluff as their reason to vilify them, particularly the Tiefling. And often, it seems to boil down to the person saying "I'm the DM, so I'm going to do this because it's my world, and I don't like them!", without any sense that they know what their players might think, or that they've considered alternate and less overt ways to make the race/class/whatever uncommon or otherwise not as likely to be seen in their world.

Those are about the most glaring peeves, I suppose. And I know if I take it any further than this, I'll really wind into a rant...therefore, I'm leaving it here.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 10:27PM #26
Viktor_Von_Doom
Date Joined: Sep 25, 2007
Posts: 1,969

Lord_Ventnor wrote:

So I'm assuming your a big fan of Dragonborn and Tieflings?


Yup ! Races I'm the biggest fan of are Yaun Ti, Gnolls, Minotaurs, Dborn, Tieflings, and Kobolds.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 10:37PM #27
Cyber-Dave
  • I am a plot device.
Date Joined: Sep 20, 2004
Posts: 9,506
I'm more of a tiefling, minotaur, Dark Sun elf, Eberron Dark Elf, Eberron halfling, shifter, vampire sort of guy myself... :P

Orc and human barbarians are cool sometimes too...
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 10:47PM #28
CCS
Date Joined: Nov 27, 2006
Posts: 3,535
The Forgotten Realms.

Or rather most of the people who love/hate it. You know who I'm talking about:

A) Those who believe that every word ever written concerning the Realms is & must always be a part of any Realms based game.
You kow what? I like the Realms in a general sort of way. But I've read alot of Realms crap over the years that just doesn't work for me. Places, items, NPCs, conflicts, whatever. So I simply view this mountain of company produced stuff as a chronicle of how someone else's campaign has unfolded. Maybe I'll borrow a bit, maybe I wont. Either way I can run a perfectly enjoyable Realms based game.

B) The people who maintain that everythings too detailed in the Realms. That there's no room for the PCs to actually do anything.
Bull****.
Once again, I can run you a perfectly fine FR game. And I can do this using all that empty space found on the map(s) OR smack in the middle of all the WoTC crap you can imagine.
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 25, 2008 - 11:32PM #29
tyrandor
Date Joined: Dec 9, 2007
Posts: 907
1 - Group X controls the world

Usually paired with low magic games, this is a world where a powerful organisation controls pretty much everything and is used as beating stick by the DM to make sure his world remain the way he wants it.

Said DM also rarely let you go against the organisation mo matter how powerful you are or even join them - you're supposed to carry on and consider them part of the world, like gravity.

The DM also usually consider this group to be super cool and original.

2 - It's a bird, it's a plane... it's super npc

Already mentioned several time, but it usually Group X will have several of those guys. A personal pet peeve of mine is when the game hinge on watching 2 super npcs duke it out with the pc basically unable to affect the outcome.
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 26, 2008 - 8:21AM #30
Kistra
Date Joined: Aug 24, 2007
Posts: 502
1) After you end up in a fight with some guy you have never heard of before:

DM: "Oh yeah, that guy is cannon, he can't die."

Us: ... you couldn't have told us that before we got in the fight!




I'm with a bunch of you on hating uber-GMPCs.

We have three in one game I am in. Everybody in the game threatened to quit because of them so the GM agreed that we would never see them again. And yet, six months later they are still in the game "because we haven't gotten to a place in the story where it would be appropriate for them to leave" and the DM can't figure out why nobody wants to post ever (PbP). And this is despite the fact that one of the uber-GMPCs was pregnant until about a month ago and now has a one month old baby!!!!
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