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5 years ago ::
May 13, 2008 - 6:13AM
#21
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Date Joined:
May 13, 2008
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Initial Reaction: Holy Bloodbath! Sputter? TPK?.....
Received it at our shop last week, ran through it over the weekend with experienced GM and players (will attempt a repeat this Thursday night).
Whoever put this together as a first level adventure needs to have their head examined. This is far, far out of whack for a group of first level characters. I would not even try to introduce someone to the game with this meat-grinder, nor take anything but a pre-gen into. GM told us that if we were to survive he would have had to NERF the encounters big time.
There are a lot of things we are STILL shaking our heads at with regards to the abbreviated rules that came packaged with the adventure, there appear to be several broken things right off, but I will try another run at it Thursday and see if maybe it was just the newness of the shift or surge rules that threw us. I will post more Friday morning after we have another go at it.
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5 years ago ::
May 13, 2008 - 7:37AM
#22
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Date Joined:
Apr 12, 2008
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Initial Reaction: Holy Bloodbath! Sputter? TPK?.....
Received it at our shop last week, ran through it over the weekend with experienced GM and players (will attempt a repeat this Thursday night).
Whoever put this together as a first level adventure needs to have their head examined. This is far, far out of whack for a group of first level characters. I would not even try to introduce someone to the game with this meat-grinder, nor take anything but a pre-gen into. GM told us that if we were to survive he would have had to NERF the encounters big time.
There are a lot of things we are STILL shaking our heads at with regards to the abbreviated rules that came packaged with the adventure, there appear to be several broken things right off, but I will try another run at it Thursday and see if maybe it was just the newness of the shift or surge rules that threw us. I will post more Friday morning after we have another go at it.
I finally got the chance to play throught the adventure Sunday night. I found it not only easy to understand, but I picked up the 4E changes quickly. The DM, as well as the four players (myself included) had a blast. I played the dragonborn paladin, and found it, surprisingly, easy to run. How you arrived at the adventure being a "meatgrinder" is beyond me. It IS challenging, but it was nothing that a truly experienced DM and players couldn't handle. I have a feeling that there will be more difficulty in old-edition players rethinking D&D than new players grasping the concepts. Being a 20+ year DM, I reviewed all the materials prior to playing, and found them not only to be fair, but an excellent adventure to start new and experienced players with. Please explain what you considered "far out of whack" about it, if you will. My DM and myself both read this post and we shook our head. Neither one of us could come up with an explanation as to your description of the difficulty of the adventure or the rules.
In fond memory of Mark "Wrecan" Monack.
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5 years ago ::
May 13, 2008 - 7:48AM
#23
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Date Joined:
Oct 30, 2005
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I consider the keep module to be a trash release because It is a pregen preview mod. You cant make characters for it, and then when the PHB comes out your stuck with the pregens unless you want to break the story (which is entirely feasable mind you, just not very much fun IMO).
That is untrue. It is true if you want to start the adventure before June 6th, but I am going to be running H1 (then H2, H3...) as a campaign starting on the 6th, and the first night of the campaign is going to be character creation with the PHB. So no, you do not HAVE to use the pregen characters to play H1. You do if you want to play before the PHB comes out, but in that case it is a BONUS. If you want to use the adventure as a glorified playtest then you can. I am using it as a full campaign, and the PCs will be player made. So, just because people are using H1 as a playtest doesn't mean thats all it is. In my case (and I'm sure I'm hardly the only person doing this) it is just as good a product as every other D&D adventure I've ever bought (if not more so, we'll have to wait and see).
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5 years ago ::
May 13, 2008 - 8:43AM
#24
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Yeah honestly, they should have just released keep on the Shadowfell as a web Enhancement or something that people can download to try to advertise the game.
WotC is the only company that makes you pay to read advertisements for their game.
Most companies would just be satisfied to advertise their product and get the word out, but apparently not WotC.
To be blunt that really is nonsense on a number of levels. Firstly it is not advertising it is an adventure to play and have fun with. Secondly a large number of companies charge you to advertise their products. Games workshop for example charge for their catalogue and they are not alone. Also look at the clothes people wear with the brand plastered all over them.
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5 years ago ::
May 13, 2008 - 9:44AM
#25
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Date Joined:
May 13, 2008
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I finally got the chance to play throught the adventure Sunday night. I found it not only easy to understand, but I picked up the 4E changes quickly. The DM, as well as the four players (myself included) had a blast. I played the dragonborn paladin, and found it, surprisingly, easy to run. How you arrived at the adventure being a "meatgrinder" is beyond me. It IS challenging, but it was nothing that a truly experienced DM and players couldn't handle. I have a feeling that there will be more difficulty in old-edition players rethinking D&D than new players grasping the concepts. Being a 20+ year DM, I reviewed all the materials prior to playing, and found them not only to be fair, but an excellent adventure to start new and experienced players with. Please explain what you considered "far out of whack" about it, if you will. My DM and myself both read this post and we shook our head. Neither one of us could come up with an explanation as to your description of the difficulty of the adventure or the rules.
To repeat:
I will try another run at it Thursday and see if maybe it was just the newness of the shift or surge rules that threw us. I will post more Friday morning after we have another go at it. I am not going to drop a spoiler here (for others) to prove a point, so you will have to wait until after I get another go at it - or PM me for the list of grudges I have started. (Just for the record 26+years in the hobby...)
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5 years ago ::
May 13, 2008 - 9:48PM
#26
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Date Joined:
Oct 16, 2006
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I will post a couple points here:
I have played almost all the way through. We playtested it with characters we created. In the shops of Winterhaven we did not buy anything because we did not have a complete list of stuff to buy (we did not have a complete PHB at this point). My rogue is using basic daggers,a short sword, and an adventures kit. This has not posed a problem for me.
The module is tough and several times we have had one character close to dying but so far we are all still alive. It is a bit of a meat grinder at times but for those of you seeing it for the first time with out the full 4e context you are basing this perception on 3rd edition. The monster encounters look tough and many times I have thought "we are so screwed" but we always pull through because a) minions die easy and b) we can all heal ourselves to some extent.
This module is well written IMO and will be ton of fun with either pre-gens or playing with your own made characters if you wait until the PHB.
It will tie to H2 and H3 if you so choose and is more than just a "throw away" preview of 4e.
We will also provide extras on D&D Insider includes side quests, tying hooks for in between adventures, and other goodies.
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5 years ago ::
May 14, 2008 - 6:29AM
#27
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Date Joined:
Mar 26, 2008
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We will also provide extras on D&D Insider includes side quests, tying hooks for in between adventures, and other goodies.
That's great to hear 
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5 years ago ::
May 14, 2008 - 7:28AM
#28
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Date Joined:
Feb 29, 2008
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I will post a couple points here:
I have played almost all the way through. We playtested it with characters we created. In the shops of Winterhaven we did not buy anything because we did not have a complete list of stuff to buy (we did not have a complete PHB at this point). My rogue is using basic daggers,a short sword, and an adventures kit. This has not posed a problem for me.
The module is tough and several times we have had one character close to dying but so far we are all still alive. It is a bit of a meat grinder at times but for those of you seeing it for the first time with out the full 4e context you are basing this perception on 3rd edition. The monster encounters look tough and many times I have thought "we are so screwed" but we always pull through because a) minions die easy and b) we can all heal ourselves to some extent.
This module is well written IMO and will be ton of fun with either pre-gens or playing with your own made characters if you wait until the PHB.
It will tie to H2 and H3 if you so choose and is more than just a "throw away" preview of 4e.
We will also provide extras on D&D Insider includes side quests, tying hooks for in between adventures, and other goodies.
Thanks for the reply Scott. it always makes me happy when I see the developers of a product interacting with the fans of that product. Very good mojo.
Quick question for you.
Are there any plans to do a digital release of the module as a stand alone on DDI? (in like say a PDF format) I would personally be much more interested in the module itself if I could get a soft back version of it, or a digital version of it sans the PHB light bits and premade characters.
thanks for your time,
malkav
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5 years ago ::
May 14, 2008 - 8:57AM
#29
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Date Joined:
Oct 16, 2006
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Thanks for the reply Scott. it always makes me happy when I see the developers of a product interacting with the fans of that product. Very good mojo.
Quick question for you.
Are there any plans to do a digital release of the module as a stand alone on DDI? (in like say a PDF format) I would personally be much more interested in the module itself if I could get a soft back version of it, or a digital version of it sans the PHB light bits and premade characters.
thanks for your time,
malkav
Yes we plan on having both PDFs and a Game Table version of the Module with minis, maps, and NPCs that is meant to be plug and play.
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5 years ago ::
May 18, 2008 - 7:02PM
#30
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To repeat:
I will try another run at it Thursday and see if maybe it was just the newness of the shift or surge rules that threw us. I will post more Friday morning after we have another go at it. I am not going to drop a spoiler here (for others) to prove a point, so you will have to wait until after I get another go at it - or PM me for the list of grudges I have started. (Just for the record 26+years in the hobby...)
I wish you WOULD post your concerns -- that's part of the reason I read this thread! You can always throw up a big SPOILER ALERT for people who don't want the details of the adventure.
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