|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 11:52AM
#51
|
Date Joined:
Mar 31, 2008
|
Can you present rules stating such? I'd be happy to conduct my own research, but if I do (and find you wrong), I'll be obligated to give you much grief for any unbacked "you sir are wrong" and "Thats just the way that works" statements.
Chapter 12: NPCs
(See also NPCs, Player’s Handbook, NPC Parties, Monstrous Manual)
Of all the things the DM does–judging combats, interpreting the actions of the player characters, creating adventures, assigning experience–of all the things he can possibly do, nothing is more important to the AD&D game than the creation and handling of nonplayer characters (NPCs). Without nonplayer characters, the AD&D game is nothing, an empty limbo. The AD&D game is a role-playing game, and for the players to role-play, they must have something or someone to interact with. That's what NPCs are for, to provide the player characters with friends, allies, and villains. Without these, role-playing would be very dull.
An NPC is any person or creature the player characters must deal with and that the DM has to role-play. The player characters must deal with a trap, but the DM doesn't role-play a trap. It's not an NPC. A charging dragon is an NPC–the DM acts out the part of the dragon and the players decide how their characters are going to react to it. There are times when the DM's role-playing choices are simple (run away or charge), but often the DM's roles are quite challenging.
For convenience, NPC encounters are generally divided into two broad categories: monsters (those living things that aren't player character races) and full NPCs (races the player characters commonly deal with). The range of reactions in a monster encounter is generally less than in a full NPC encounter.
The DM has to think of himself as a master actor, quick-change artist, and impressionist. Each NPC is a different role or part the DM must quickly assume. While this may be difficult at first, practice makes the task much easier. Each DM develops certain stock characters and learns the personalities of frequently used NPCs.
There are many different categories of NPCs, but the most frequently encountered are common, everyday folk. Player characters deal with innkeepers, stablers, blacksmiths, minstrels, watchmen, petty nobles, and others, many of whom can be employed by player characters. These NPCs are grouped together as hirelings. See the entire Chapter 12 form that DMG.
Most often the NPC does get part of the XP, and the loot is up to the party depending on the position the NPC is in, either hireling henchman, and the reason the NPC travels with the party.
There is no rule for it, but if the NPC takes part in the fight, then there is a portion of the XP lost from the actual player party.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 11:55AM
#52
|
Date Joined:
Mar 31, 2008
|
Hellmute said:
This is the silliest mind set ever! Hey, who let the cool police in? Sheesh.
Sometimes a DM run PC is needed for a game to work. Sometimes I run solo games or games with 2-3 players tops. No a DM run PC is never needed. All you have to do is the job any DM should do, and make the game for those 2-3 players worth of characters. Or just for the solo character.
The rest is just excuses. If, as a DM, you cannot make the game for the number of players you have, then you need to learn how to DM for that number of players.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 12:08PM
#53
|
Date Joined:
Dec 16, 2005
|
No a DM run PC is never needed. All you have to do is the job any DM should do, and make the game for those 2-3 players worth of characters. Or just for the solo character.
The rest is just excuses. If, as a DM, you cannot make the game for the number of players you have, then you need to learn how to DM for that number of players. Wrongo. Sometimes there is a need. And it is not a matter of making the game work for 1-3 players, it's a matter of sometimes they(the players) want cooler fights with more people involved. Again, this isn't so that I can, as a DM, play a character in order to fulfill some selfish need, it is for filling out the group.
But to say that anyone who uses DMPCs needs to learn how to DM is rude. You are not the ultimate DM, no matter what your mom tells you, so stop acting like you are. Different strokes for different folks. Just because you can't use a DMPC without hogging the spotlight doesn't mean that no one else can do it either.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 12:48PM
#54
|
|
|
No a DM run PC is never needed in my games. There, I fixed that for you since you weren't elected to decide that for everyone.
All you have to do is the job any DM should do, and make the game for those 2-3 players worth of characters. Or just for the solo character. That can often times be more limiting then the players in question want as well as what the DM would like to do. Both sides need to have fun in a game.
The last point was addressed much more eloquently in the post above mine.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 1:27PM
#55
|
Date Joined:
Mar 31, 2008
|
"fixing" posts is a violation of the CoC. You have been warned.
When players want more or bigger fights, then they need to learn to play more than one character.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 1:43PM
#56
|
Date Joined:
Dec 16, 2005
|
Hellmute, you should probably just sit this one out. You don't have anything constructive to add to the conversation. You have stated your opinion on the subject and given that it is not constructive, I'm sure you need not go on in detail, detailing your awesome DMing might and over all ability to trump others opinions with your hard hitting facts. *Please note the sarcasm*
To the OP, as you can see, this is a touchy point for some DMs and players and so should be handled with caution and care. A key thing to remember about running a DMPC is not to have it take away from what the players are supposed to be doing. Ie, don't let you DMPC solve any puzzle, win any fights( unfairly) or save the day( Dues ex Machina styles). You might want to run it by your players first and see if they are into the idea of a DMPC in the group, and if so, what they would like to see it do and how it should function in the group. I find it best to choose mundane races( for 4th edition nothing from the MM, keep it to the PHB) and try not to choose a race that someone else in the group is already playing. Unless it makes sense, ie the group is all one race or something, then totally follow suit and make the DMPC the same. As to classes keep it to something that isn't going to be a glory hog. A shield and sword fighter or paladin is great for this. They wade out into combat, hunker down and soak up damage so the other players can do all the cool stuff. :D
Hope this stuff helps! And if you do use the DMPC, let us know what you are going with and how it works.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 4:26PM
#57
|
|
|
"fixing" posts is a violation of the CoC. You have been warned. No, I haven't been warned until a Moderator warns me.
So show me where it's a violation of the CoC. Besides, you might want to look on a couple of sections of it an how to be a responsible community poster...
Regardless, please report my post...I am sure the Moderators will be happy to look over yours as well.
When players want more or bigger fights, then they need to learn to play more than one character. That's pretty dubious advice at best. A player trying to play 2 characters can be just as disasterous as a poorly played DMPC. Besides, not every player really wants to try and play 2 PC's...I've rarely seen that option taken. I am sure YMV.
And yes, to the OP...definitely let us know how it turns out.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 4:55PM
#58
|
Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2004
|
page 116 we find the little text box that says Allies as extra characters. Excellent find. Thank you. My previous frame of reference was 3.5, which had things like: "The cohort does not count as a party member when determining the party’s XP."
And (from HoB p.62) "If the PC's get help from NPCs who fight at their side, reduce the number of enemies they get credit for overcoming in order to compensate for the help."
I will evidently need to ammend my thinking in regard to DMPC's in 4e.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 5:00PM
#59
|
Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2004
|
See the entire Chapter 12 form that DMG. I have no idea what you are referencing, nor how it pertains to my query.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Aug 16, 2008 - 5:10PM
#60
|
Date Joined:
Jun 28, 2008
|
Excellent find. Thank you. My previous frame of reference was 3.5, which had things like: "The cohort does not count as a party member when determining the party’s XP."
And (from HoB p.62) "If the PC's get help from NPCs who fight at their side, reduce the number of enemies they get credit for overcoming in order to compensate for the help."
I will evidently need to ammend my thinking in regard to DMPC's in 4e. Ahhh I see where you were coming from then. I assumed you meant more of a full party member than just a cohort.
|
|
|