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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 3:40AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Jul 23, 2008
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A friend asked me to ask here, if spells above the 10th level would now work in the Realms of the "new Age". Since Mystra is now gone, is there anything known who holds control now over the Weave and prevents mortals doing stupid things like our dear old friend Lord Karsus (any resemblance to forum-gods is purely coincidental :P )?
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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 6:21AM
#2
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-This belongs in the Realmslore section. It'll be moved.
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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 6:27AM
#3
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-The long and the short of it is, we don't know, officially, how the designers will handle things. As we all know, if there is something that they like, or want to happen, it can very well make an appearance without sense backing up it's existence 100%. Anyway, technically, 10th Level+ spells can't even be cast any longer, since those were drew power from the Weave. With no Weave existing any longer, have nothing to draw their power from. In 4e game terms, there are indeed 10th Level spells (they go up to Level 30, no?). These 4e 10th Level spells are not the equivalent of 2e/3e 10th Level spells, though. At some point in the future, might there be a supplement, or DRAGON article, or whatever else, that has 4e versions of 2e/3e 10th Level+ spells? Maybe. The casting of such spells will be as different as 10th Level+ spells and Epic Spells (despite anything that the potential designers might say).
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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 1:47PM
#4
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Date Joined:
Oct 22, 2004
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Since Epic Spells where introduced, I always used them as the old 10th-level spell... After all Karsus Avatar was a very long and expensive spell to cast !
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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 2:01PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2006
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Actually, there are no 30th level powers in 4e. The last spell, evocation, prayer, exploit, etc... is a daily power at 29th level. As far as I know, there haven't been any feats or class features that allow you to exceed that level, such as with 3e's metamagic feats. Rituals however, have a better possibility of obtaining 30th level. But as of yet, the highest ritual level is 28 with a tie between True Portal (PHB) and Imprisonment (Arcane Power).
if spells above the 10th level would now work in the Realms of the "new Age". Since Mystra is now gone, is there anything known who holds control now over the Weave and prevents mortals doing stupid things like our dear old friend Lord Karsus (any resemblance to forum-gods is purely coincidental[/quote]
Judging from a strictly conversion standpoint, I would've made the spell Karsus Avatar a 30th level ritual.
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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 3:06PM
#6
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Actually, there are no 30th level powers in 4e. The last spell, evocation, prayer, exploit, etc... is a daily power at 29th level.
-Twenty nine instead of thirty, then.
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4 years ago ::
May 19, 2009 - 5:42PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2006
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-Twenty nine instead of thirty, then.
Hehe, didn't want to give people the wrong info  (yea, it's nit-picking I know).
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4 years ago ::
May 20, 2009 - 6:09PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Dec 11, 2005
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The original 10th plus spells were suggested to have been drawn from the essence of Mystryl herself, rather than the weave she presided over. Mystryl/ Mystra were essentially hot spots (IMO, I have gone into this with more detail in the past, supporting it with lore) of raw magic, created when the raw magic of the universe was brought to a single focal point, and given sentience. The danger of this, is that it taxed her too greatly, and things that normally wouldn't be possible, were made possible.
This additionally explains why true magic is no longer possible without Mystra, as Raw magic is simply too diluted to draw effectively into the focused patterns Mystra made possible. The universal magic is in effect a turbulent ocean, and the weave was the break water. While some spells carry over at their respective levels, most have moved to higher spots. This is explained easily by the Raw Magics chaotic nature. Some spells move up and become marginally more potent, while others have diminished in potency with the weaves collapse.
Additionally, Epic spells, are not true 10th plus. True magic drew on Mystra, so the caster was simply able to cast them as they would any other spell. Epic magic requires the caster provide all the components, from gold to xp, themselves.
-RW
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4 years ago ::
May 21, 2009 - 12:22PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Nov 23, 2005
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Personally, I would've expected the loss of the Weave to have effectively wiped out high level casting for quite a while. The more complex something is, the harder it should be to find an alternative way of doing it as well (even if you understand the underlying physics)
It may be that nothing is restricting Karsus Avatar, but the knowledge required to cast such a spell just won't be available for a long time to come, since whole levels of research leading upto it are unavailable, especially for magic as it is now.
Anyway, I see no real reason for Karsus Avatar to not exist for very high level characters. Its not like there aren't other ways to become gods or god-like beings.
Afterall, Szass Tam was trying to pull off something that would've been much greater than Karsus Avatar.
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4 years ago ::
May 21, 2009 - 3:20PM
#10
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...even if you understand the underlying physics...
-This is an aspect that is, unfortunately, ignored- so many issues, and for so long.
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