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4 years ago ::
Jan 23, 2009 - 4:26PM
#51
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this seems like a promise to me, that they're gonna drop some or all of the other tools they proposed a year back. this vision has nothing to do with either of the tools they are lacking since 7 months...
To be clear I was just describing the dungeon builder as it stands now, but with a tab for intro and a tab for conclusion.
Mike.
Mike Donais.
Cryptozoic R&D
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4 years ago ::
Jan 23, 2009 - 5:46PM
#52
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- Senior Volunteer Community Lead
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2005
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To be clear I was just describing the dungeon builder as it stands now, but with a tab for intro and a tab for conclusion.
Mike.
Hot.
Wolf Star76 Community Advocate (SVCL) for D&D Organized Play, Avalon Hill, and the DCI/WPN LFR Community Manager DDi Guide  Created by MyFitnessPal - Free Calorie Counter
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4 years ago ::
Jan 23, 2009 - 11:30PM
#53
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Date Joined:
Aug 13, 2007
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To be clear I was just describing the dungeon builder as it stands now, but with a tab for intro and a tab for conclusion.
well, this sounds entirely different to what the dungeon builder was described as being, but i'll take it even if what you said did not resemble the builder much.
if this is where the builder stands now, it should be out soon, no? :P
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4 years ago ::
Jan 24, 2009 - 7:18AM
#54
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Date Joined:
Jan 24, 2009
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Pardon my lateness getting into the Conversation, I believe I am just restating what others have specified and/or implied.
If DDI is still maintaining an endstate of Online Play that will reform the way we do it now, then I would think the current encounter builder needs to be more robust in what it can handle and output.
Once the Character builder and Encounter Builder are completed, move to the creation of the Dungeon Builder. I will not get into my thoughts on What exactly it should due, as that is not the purpose of this thread.
I agree with previous posts that the Character Visualizer should be the last of the above 3 products to be produced, but again, should not take much in the way creation, Pending the direction of detail DDI takes the program.
This would allow 4 fully developed programs if properly designed to be implemented into the Game table, along with its seperate functions and functionality.
I hate waiting...though customers come and go like the wind. Those that are truely intrested in the final product will stick it out, and others will replace the departed. Its just one of those facts of life...but should be use as an excuse for delay.
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4 years ago ::
Jan 24, 2009 - 11:38AM
#55
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Next tool should definitely be gaming table - I'm sure someone has thought of it already but dungeon articles come with maps/notes/stats and we already access them. having these ready to play should keep us dying of impatience while waiting to be able to make our own adventures. - least important is char visualiser (though once its out prolly where i will spend most of my non game time) 
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4 years ago ::
Jan 25, 2009 - 2:01AM
#56
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Date Joined:
Jun 29, 2003
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As I said in my own thread, I'm mostly waiting for the Portrait Thingie before I start paying for a monthly subscription. It may seem like pure fluff, and it is, but it's the fluff that I would find the most useful. Dungeons I can build. Characters I can create. Vizualizations, I'm not much good for. And I don't want to pay some artist on deviantart.com a hundred bucks for a drawing of my character that will probably never be perfect.
Thank you, I was getting worried that I was the only one who wanted the visualizer next. I will second the motion.
I've got graph paper, so I can draw dungeons. I've got a word processor so I can type out all the notes I might need and I've got a printer so I can also make campaign handouts. Heck, I have character sheets and a pencil so I was disappointed when it was announced that the character builder would be the first tool, though I'm still eagerly waiting for the full release they've been promising for the end of the month.
What I don't have is enough artistic talent to convey what my characters look like. Sure I have flawless mental image and I can try and describe the appearance to my friends, but it would be really nice to be able to just hold up a picture.
Whatever they work on next, I think the Visualizer will get "done" sooner than anything else after the Character generator... err, Builder.
I've got my fingers crossed.
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4 years ago ::
Jan 26, 2009 - 12:18PM
#57
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well, this sounds entirely different to what the dungeon builder was described as being, but i'll take it even if what you said did not resemble the builder much.
if this is where the builder stands now, it should be out soon, no? :P
Well the proof of concept is there but it needs work and bug fixing and we have all of our resources on the Character Builder launch.
So no, not soon. But I am making an awesome adventure using it on weekends and evenings.
Mike Donais.
Cryptozoic R&D
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4 years ago ::
Jan 27, 2009 - 2:46PM
#58
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Date Joined:
Jan 26, 2009
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I've been a part of late software projects before, and I imagine it isn't a case of messed up priorities, but priorities set straight. I imagine someone at Wizards had a big meeting and said "Okay, we've got all these other projects that are half done and behind schedule. We need to get something out, so everyone drop everything and get the character builder out NOW". And they did it, and its awesome, and now we want more :p. So if I were in charge (or had the ear of someone who was), here is what I would propose. First, focus on making the existing tools more useful. Display combat stats on the encounter builder. Let me load existing monsters and tweak them, or add templates or make them solos or whatever. Let me save these monsters for later, so if my campaign features Blue Horned Orcs, I only have to create them once. Second, allow users to share the results of those tools. Let me save my Blue Horned Orcs, and if people want to include my monsters they can do so. Maybe some system of collections could be put together by the community. Let me do the same with my encounters. Let me save them and share them with other DM. It may sound like short term bennies, but this is part of a long term strategy. The next step is the dungeon builder. Don't make it like a CAD program, make it drag and drop. Let the DM create encounters in the encounter builder and link it to areas on the map. Allow the DM to put in notes, terrain, all kinds of fun stuff. After this, the Adventure Builder. This is seperate from the dungeon builder, and will let the user combine the elements into a unified whole. They can take their custom monsters, encounters, and maps and put them together into a single document. And let us not only save them, but share them with other DMs! One of the big selling points for Neverwinter Nights were the thousands of fan-made adventures. DDI could have that same draw - not only do you get the professional adventures in Dungeon, but you get dozens, hundreds, eventually thousands that other DMs have created. Only then, put effort into the visualizer and Game Table. Because then the Game Table will come online with a vast library of adventures that WotC didn't have to develop. This approach would require embracing the community as never before, and really empowering players and DMs. This is a strategy that really will change the way the game is played. Just a suggestion  PS - Also, knowing what development environments are like when they're behind schedule, the first thing Wizards should do is give their developers a nice long vacation, let them do some gaming and relaxing. They earned it!
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4 years ago ::
Jan 27, 2009 - 3:59PM
#59
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I imagine someone at Wizards had a big meeting and said "Okay, we've got all these other projects that are half done and behind schedule. We need to get something out, so everyone drop everything and get the character builder out NOW". And they did it, and its awesome, and now we want more :p.
I too work in software development for an insurance company. I agree with your speculative assessment. Instead of every software project running behind it seems they decided to make certain ones a priority.
So if I were in charge (or had the ear of someone who was), here is what I would propose.
First, focus on making the existing tools more useful. Display combat stats on the encounter builder. Let me load existing monsters and tweak them, or add templates or make them solos or whatever. Let me save these monsters for later, so if my campaign features Blue Horned Orcs, I only have to create them once.
I wish you were in charge. I agree with you. The encounter builder and the monster builder need to be improved. I would definitely use those tools more than the virtual game table.
Second, allow users to share the results of those tools. Let me save my Blue Horned Orcs, and if people want to include my monsters they can do so. Maybe some system of collections could be put together by the community. Let me do the same with my encounters. Let me save them and share them with other DM.
Say it again, brother!
It may sound like short term bennies, but this is part of a long term strategy.
By doing these smaller projects and making them succeed you build a winning tradition. Much like a new coach needs to do to a perennial bad sports team. You must show the bad team how to win so you can change the attitudes.
The next step is the dungeon builder. Don't make it like a CAD program, make it drag and drop. Let the DM create encounters in the encounter builder and link it to areas on the map. Allow the DM to put in notes, terrain, all kinds of fun stuff.
See, I don't need this. I spent a little bit of cash and bought Pro Fantasy's Campaign Cartographer, Dungeon Designer and City Designer. I have been experimenting with those tools.
I realize others don't have the money to buy those tools and they may want these other tools first. I was making a statement about my own desires for DDI.
After this, the Adventure Builder. This is seperate from the dungeon builder, and will let the user combine the elements into a unified whole. They can take their custom monsters, encounters, and maps and put them together into a single document. And let us not only save them, but share them with other DMs! One of the big selling points for Neverwinter Nights were the thousands of fan-made adventures. DDI could have that same draw - not only do you get the professional adventures in Dungeon, but you get dozens, hundreds, eventually thousands that other DMs have created.
I can also wait for this since I think I can do many of these things with Pro Fantasy.
Only then, put effort into the visualizer and Game Table. Because then the Game Table will come online with a vast library of adventures that WotC didn't have to develop.
I like the idea of the game table. I just don't know if I would use it. I'm not all that interested in the visualizer. I may change my toon (mispelling intentional) after I see it working.
This approach would require embracing the community as never before, and really empowering players and DMs. This is a strategy that really will change the way the game is played.
I like your suggestions. Nice post, Maddman1975.  
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4 years ago ::
Jan 28, 2009 - 8:02AM
#60
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Date Joined:
Jun 28, 2001
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First, focus on making the existing tools more useful.
Second, allow users to share the results of those tools.
The next step is the dungeon builder.
After this, the Adventure Builder.
Only then, put effort into the visualizer and Game Table.
Yes, yes, yes, yes and then yes. Get yourself a job being in charge of DDi please!!!
Cheers!
B
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