|
5 years ago ::
Jul 10, 2008 - 9:02AM
#41
|
Date Joined:
Dec 21, 2005
|
Perhaps, just maybe, the Artificer could find a better place as a Controller instead. Then again, it could step a lot on the wizard's toes...
It already does - sort of. Reading through the artificer, the feel of him is currently more like a scientific wizard - especially the on-the-fly things that feel like spells but in flavour text (I'm looking at you, caustic rampart).
I really hope for more short rest things, that would peg him more into the tinkerer niche, which suits the artificer better, I think - especially in front of the Eberron context, where wizards are having congresses and universities, from Eberron, I rather get the feeling: Wizards = scientists, artificer = engineer.
This artificer is more like tech-wizard and less adventure-happy MacGyver-tinker-engineer. And since the class is, at least partially, aimed at Eberron... it should, IMHO, try to preserve that notion.
Cheers, LT.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 10, 2008 - 9:19AM
#42
|
|
|
I really hope for more short rest things, that would peg him more into the tinkerer niche, which suits the artificer better, I think - especially in front of the Eberron context, where wizards are having congresses and universities, from Eberron, I rather get the feeling: Wizards = scientists, artificer = engineer.
This artificer is more like tech-wizard and less adventure-happy MacGyver-tinker-engineer. And since the class is, at least partially, aimed at Eberron... it should, IMHO, try to preserve that notion.
I completely agree. In the world of Eberron wizards are the main magical researchers in theoretical magic and artificers are the engineer counterparts. I can see wizards of the Twelve making conceptual and experimental magic items that then get transformed into "consumer" versions by artificers.
The MacGyver-tinker-engineer elements are already in this playtest, but mixed with fairy dust and Inspector Gadget goo. The Shielding Cube and Barbed Automaton are shining examples of that (though I find the Healing Figurine a bit on the silly side of the spectrum).
I feel they should stick to lightning and acid as main elements, the rod and the orb as implements and give the artificer the class feature of being able to attach one or the other to a crossbow (rods only go with regular crossbows, evidently). This could give rise to three different Artificer builds: Lightning, Acid/Alchemy and Traps/Mechanicals.
Each would work something like the warlock paths: if you are a Lightning specialist, you deal more damage with lightning spells and have bonuses on force spells, like Shielding Cube, an alchemist artificer would get larger blast areas and, if you're a mechanical artificer, your artifices can be sustained with minor actions, for instance. Each specialization could even have their own relationship with magical items: lightning allows you to overcharge wands, alchemy deals with potions and mechanics goes into weapons and maybe wondrous items.
Just like real life engineers specialize, Artificers should too.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 10, 2008 - 9:51AM
#43
|
|
|
Come to think of it, a Lightning/Force specialization Artificer would be a nice tie-in to the Eberron Lightning Rail. Alchemists could be better healers (than other types of Artificers), giving the distribution:
Lightning - Damage
Alchemy - Healing
Mechanicals - Battleground control
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 10, 2008 - 8:16PM
#44
|
Date Joined:
Sep 27, 2005
|
I was very happy to see this playtest class. It will help people get an idea of what the finished class will be like. It will also help those who wanted to make artifcers for the EB setting. I would love to see some playtest Dragonmarks  .
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 14, 2008 - 7:55AM
#45
|
|
|
I actually think the solution is already in the article - the temporary pseudo-magical items which take a short rest to create and last until the characters take an extended rest. They act like expendible magic items, which is an interesting and distinctive type of ability.
That said, I don't know how well that ability plays, and I have some concerns that it doesn't play well.
1) arcane replenishment is okay but still doesn't address crafting. at a bare minumum they should get enchant and disenchant rituals for free. one suggestion might be to let them craft items equal to their level + Int modifier.
2) also, what happened to the homonculus? i would like to see those rules put back in. maybe the final version will include them as they have an entry in the MM.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 18, 2008 - 3:04PM
#46
|
|
|
I'm getting a sort of a green arrow vibe (sort of like the Green Lantern vibe you may get from reading Incarnum.. not really 'the same' but there's some similar ideas)
I mean, you can fire a device out of your crossbow which has an effect on - Arcane Springboard may as well be called "Trampoline Arrow".. except.. an Artificier can't use martial or superior ranged weapons with proficiency. You would think that a class so dependent on ranged weapons wouldn't be limited to a hand crossbow or sling.
Hm.. a Reparation Apparatus works if you're a cleric healing a Warforged, or am I reading that wrong?
Other crossbows also fall into simple ranged as well just not long/short bow which are military. It would also work for any type of golem, homunculous or your artifice.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 20, 2008 - 1:40PM
#47
|
Date Joined:
Feb 15, 2003
|
Haven't had a chance to playtest/have one of my players playtest this class yet, but it looks like what I found weird on 1st glance with it have all been brought up my Titanium Dragon already! 
Yours,
Dave the Brave
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 21, 2008 - 4:24AM
#48
|
Date Joined:
May 11, 2005
|
I was already in the process of creating a human artificer when I also noticed this. Any suggestions on what at-will power could be used as a substitute?
In my feedback to D&D insider, I suggested either a wizard power or a cleric power with the Wis/Str stat changed to Int.
Btw issues I reported were the following (copied from my mail):
1. The overview lists among the implements the orb. The text under
'Implements and Weapons' however does not mention it.
2. Healing Infusion: Creative Admixture: A healing surge seems a
fairly high cost for temporary hit points (which are less you get for
a normal second wind, and last only for the encounter). I guess this
is something for playtesting, but I would definitely hesitate to spend
a healing surge for that unless I am desperate.
3. AC of artifices (level + 4) are a bit odd. It will be AC 5 at level
1, and AC 34 at level 30. It follows the to-hit of monsters, but at
such a rate that any monster of the artificer's level has near no
chance to miss it. To make artifices survivable (they don't have much
hp, likely to go down in one good hit), I suggest either AC level +14,
which is the AC of a monster with the controller role, or AC level+12,
which is the AC of a monster with the artillery role.
4. There are two at-will powers listed. This is generally sufficient
unless you play a human - then you need three. For a playtest it is
useful to be able to pick human as a race, so either a third at-will
power needs to be listed, or a suggestion (in the what's a playtest
article) side bar for a replacement at-will power should be given. A
valid suggestion migth be thunderwave, which could easily be mimicked
with a sonic artifice, or a cleric at-will power, where Will/Strength
are replaced with Int.
5. Repair Object: Does this work on objects? Would it work on a warforged PC?
6. It is not clear if powers that use weapons use the weapon's
proficiency bonus when determining to hit. It seem logical, as this is
how it would work with powers based on Strength or Dex, but it might
need pointing out. If it doesn't apply I think it will seriously
affect the effectiveness of the artificer.
7. Shielding Cube: Why do you need a ranged weapon? The power does not
have a weapon keyword. It is a cube, which can't realistically be
launched with any ranged weapon except a sling, and it has a fixed
range rather than that of the weapon. I suggest dropping the
requirement.
8. Regeneration Infusion: does this last until the creature is no
longer bloodied, or does it last indefinitely?
9. Reparation Apparatus: if it only works on constructs, it's use is
rather limited as there are no constructs in the artificer's
environment (except perhaps warforged). Maybe include normal objects
and/or artifices to make it more useful.
Gomez
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 21, 2008 - 6:36AM
#49
|
Date Joined:
Mar 20, 2001
|
You don't need to use an implement, it just helps.
Yes but at higher levels it's virtually required to have a decent attack value verses their defense.
Strangely while you need to be using a ranged weapon, it's enhancement bonus and damage are not used for the attack at all. That all comes from the implement.
Seems very poor for an Encounter power (compared to say Lance of Faith, Divine Glow) to me and why do you need a ranged weapon in hand to use it? According to the flavour text the artifice is what is doing the damage, so why not say the implement projects it, or the Artificer throws it?
The requirement of the ranged weapon is pointless.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jul 21, 2008 - 12:15PM
#50
|
|
|
Only comment I have is this:
PLEASE clarify what can be held, what can't, and how they all interact with your powers. Please, please, please. The artificer can use an implement, or a ranged weapon, which probably will be a crossbow. The crossbow requires two hands to load, presumably. An implement requires one. Is this intentional? Are you intended to use just one or the other? Are you expected to be spending minor actions switching everything around? This is a part of the game that never gets much attention, but it comes up in play all the time. Please spell it out so that a moron can understand it.
|
|
|
