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Every time I see this it makes me a little more irratated. Temple of Wee Jas and Shrine of Yondalla? I know people are people and we all make mistakes. This is ok, but in an organization as powerful and prestigious as WOC, holding the rights to one of the most famous games ever made... it indicates a rotten corps. Nobody read through this or proofed this artist's work. I would go so far as to say the artist was not even aware of the mistake. I have read almost every module ever written and played through at least 75% or more of all D&D Adventure products ever made. In the last three years, even before the change to 4th Edition.. the editing was **** poor. Numerous mistakes not related to typing (although those were also pretty numerous). Why is this NOT ok? I'll tell you why... it is like buying a ticket to an NFL football game and watching highschool kids play the game. I know this one was a freebe so why complain... just because after watching this trend for three years this has gotten ridiculous. Expectations for a college thesus or novel by a great writer is higher than the expectations one has for a 1st grader's Mother's Day letter. It is NOT acceptable WOC.It is not ok to say, "well, it is a Role Playing Game"... it is the DM's job to place his or her own fluff into the game. That would be true If it were just THIS free on line product... but it is not --- and you guys KNOW it. I keep watching the best of the business walk out on you and join other companies, or start their own things... or just hang up the hat. That tells me something is rotten under the carpet. It starts with management... and it ends with pride in your work.. you are or have lost that. The level of competence and pride has slipped to a point where tiny upstart companies with small loyal fan bases can threaten your customer base. It is a slap in the face to your loyal and long time fans.. you should expect to be booed. I sat in a football stadium and listened to John Elway be booed... and that in Denver where he was loved. He had a bad game and appoligized for it. I havn't seen anything like that from you guys. I keep hearing excuses as to why we should just stop firing you up for every small thing... That is because YOU are not every other business.. you make a LIVING catering to a unique and largely intelligent type of people. The customers you cater to are particular... if you were a car sales company for example we could just go somewhere else... that is not possible with you as your products are as close to monopoly without crossing that line as possible.. kind of like another Seattle based company I know. We are not privy to looking under the hood of your car but if we were I would venture to guess... we would find a group of younger professionals with papers that say they are the experts. Resumes longer than the national budget filled with things they have written... and not one guy without an ego the size of the moon. The problem is all that talent and ego does not often mix to form a great TEAM. To busy trying to do your own things and to egotistical to help others with theirs. To many open projects and too few writers left with the true talent to finish them. Chaos comes to mind here. The whole affair is too much and it is coming out now in the products you are producing. The entire argument of if the game should have been changed or not is a moot point.. it has... only I think you have to ask yourselves... at what price? Is the game more fun (that is why people play games)... I know you understand that, but the changes you have made ... I am not sure make it more fun. Truth be told after playing it for just over a month now after all the excitement that built up to it... it is falling flat. I think you are losing the "game". My greatest hope is now that one of those micro companies can begin to steal enough customers from you to provide a challenge, driving up both the level of product quality and the rehiring of the guys you have driven off. I think you will find I am not a disgruntled ex employee... just a guy who plays the game and has for a long time. Get a new manager... get a new editor and get some people in there who care more about the game than they do about their own egos...

To be fair to Mike he's done an excellent job of retouching the map from Red Hand of Doom, those were the temples in Brindol originally, perhaps they should have been changed for 4th Ed but surely that should be up to the writer, or editor, not the map artist.

Are you guys going to revise the adventure add this to the download? I know everyone who uses this adventure, but doesn't check the boards would be helped by doing so. It can't be that hard to edit and the major benefit of electronic delivery is the product can be patched later.

Collasus wrote:

... get a new editor ...

I do agree with this notion. Many of Wizards of the Coast's D&D products are replete with errors. Notable items include Expedition to the Demonweb Pits, one of the worst offenders with errors throughout, and Complete Divine. One of my favorite blunders in the latter is Thrazidun's favored weapon, which read "check toee". So, yeah, put some effort into the editing process.

Back on topic, I like the maps from Red hand of Doom and I had zero problem seeing them get used again. No sense in letting a good set of maps go to waste. As aptly mentioned elsewhere, Wee Jas and Yondalla may need adjustment if not playing in Greyhawk. If so, I say leave'em.

Thanks for the help with the map, Mike.

Schley wrote:

Hey guys,
Apparently a listing of the keyed locations wasn't included in the PDF so I've included them here for quick access.

1. City Gates
2. The Stone Wyvern (Tavern)
3. Axenhaft Security (Guard Service)
4. Shank's Shivs (Weapon Shop)
5. Brindol Market
6. Thirsty Zombie (Tavern)
7. Red Magic and Sundries (Magic Shop)
8. Shrine of Yondalla
9. The Craven Raven (Tavern)
10. Velorian's Playhouse
11. Brindol Academy
12. The Laughing Manticore (Tavern)
13. Kaal Manor (Noble Estate)
14. Teskerwill Manor (Noble Estate)
16. The Hall of Great Valor
17. Cathedral of Pelor
18. Brindol Keep
19. Haskin Mansion (Noble Estate)
20. Brindol Cemetery
21. Temple of Wee Jas

Mike

Mike, love the look of your maps, but while the ranting above is not very productive (or legible) some of the points brought up are valid. Namely we were provided with a town map and a partial campaign map, but keys and locations do not match. Any idea where the locations presented in the adventure are located on either this map or the "vale" map?

I have ZERO problem with recycled maps, but it would help if they were keyed for the current edition and module they are repackaged with.

Where, on the vale map, is Rivenroar Keep?

Where are on Brindol map is the Antler and Thistle? The schematics of the street don't match any of the configurations on the city map that I can find.

For that matter, what about these locations from the text of the module:


Inns: Chatrenn and Sons; The Red Door; Avandrian Hostel; The Silk and Spoon; Pantashi Inn.
Taverns: Ilya’s Cardhouse; The Marooned Schooner; Cleftie’s; Brindol Gentleman’s Club; the Blue Parrot; the Antler and Thistle.
Major Guilds: Prospectors; Blacksmiths and Smelters; Teamsters and Farriers; Weavers; River Bargemen (halfling controlled).
Supplies: Alchemy by Adronsius (currently closed); Gavriel Arms and Smithy; Staghunter Outfitters; Alpenglow Trading House.
Temples: Temple of Erathis; College of Ioun; Shrine of the Sun (Pelor); Moondust Temple (Sehanine); Shrine of Bahamut (no permanent clergy); Shrine of the Open Door (Avandra).

If you can fill any of these in for us, we would appreciate it.