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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 10:28AM
#21
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Date Joined:
Sep 30, 2003
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And 15 bucks a month? Who would complain about such a trivial amount of money? I can barely buy lunch for that. Not only that, but it's less than subscribing to the print versions of Dragon and Dungeon magazines used to be, except that you get both magazine, plus rulebook add-ons, plus digital tools, online gaming table, etc etc...
One year subscriptions to the magazines were $3.25 each per month. That's $6.50 per month for both. WAY less than $15 per month. Not even close.
Also, I only pay $6-$10 for lunch. Paying $15 for lunch would be enough to convince me to bring a bag lunch to work. I'm glad I don't live where you do.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 10:38AM
#22
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Date Joined:
Jan 12, 2007
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Would you go on a message board talking about how terrible a restaurant is that you've never eaten at? How awful a book is that you've never read?
Let's say they have someone up front giving free appetizers, and you don't like them. THEN the restaraunt, serving gourmet hamburgers, has listed menu prices of $30 a plate. I would complain then.
How ghastly a movie was that you didn't watch?
Again, let's say the trailers were awful, and that the local Cinemark has to charge $40 a ticket to pay for the high cost of the movie. Yep, I would complain and still not see it.
Buy it or don't buy it, but please hold off on the rhetoric if you think it's wrong for someone to suggest being open-minded.
I did approach this with an open mind. You, however, have not. You're blindly willing to give WotC the benefit of the doubt, and your cash, despite anything and everything you've heard, and are unwilling to accept that someone may have a legitimate complaint.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 10:41AM
#23
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Date Joined:
Nov 29, 2007
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There´s only one MMORPG that´s 15$ a month and thats AoC
ALL others charge 10 to 0.
Vanguard, DDO, Lotro, WoW, and EQ2 are all $14.99 a month if you pay monthly. Eve is $14.95.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 11:06AM
#24
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Date Joined:
Aug 18, 2007
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And Flyff is free.
You just have the option to pay extra for a la carte items that you want to upgrade your play experience.
This sounds a lot like insider, where you have to pay extra for the virtual minis you want... and not at all like most of the other mmorpgs where you get the whole experience for one cost.
Well, it's like insider in that you pay for the extras, but it's not like it in that it is free instead of $15 per month.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 11:06AM
#25
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Date Joined:
Jan 12, 2007
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You make me sound cheap...
Seriously, though, am I getting as much game for DDI as I am with WoW? From what we've seen of DDI thus far (and it's been nearly a year now), the answer is an unequivocal 'no'.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 11:51AM
#26
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Date Joined:
Nov 29, 2007
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Well, WoW sucks so that's not a good comparison.
I guess it depends on how much you end up using DDI. If you use it to game remotely with people three nights a week, for example, then I think you're getting some good game time out of it. If you rarely use it, the no.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 12:19PM
#27
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Date Joined:
May 23, 2008
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I'm not outraged, but I am disappointed. I run a game using a virtual gaming table with friends from college. We have gone different paths financially, and while $15 a month isn't a lot to me, I don't feel comfortable asking the same of some of my friends. I don't think that WOTC settled on $15 as a fair value, I think the number is based on what they feel the market can bear.
As a value proposition, I just don't see it. My understanding is that the product consists of:
1) an electronic version of dragon magazine ($3.50 in print- should be cheaper without distribution and production costs)
2) an electronic version of dungeon magazine (see above)
3) A character visualizer (how much would you pay for this stand-alone? $20?)
4) A character sheet utility (Hero-Lab is a one-time cost of $29)
5) an virtual table (I use battlegrounds, one time cost to players of $15)
One-time costs are immensely preferable to recurring ones. The competition to D&D insider software is cheap- about $64 dollars outlined above. If you remove the value of the magazines ($7 a month)- after 8 months of subscription, you could own a competitive series of products.
It's true that a game like world of warcraft has a similar subscription cost, but I haven't seen anything to convince me that writing/maintaining/serving D&D insider requires anything approaching the amount of resources a game like world of warcraft does. It's like comparing the costs of a bicycle to a motorcycle.
At the price D&D Insider is charging, that software will need to be SIGNIFICANTLY better than the current in-market alternatives. After 8 months, I could have purchased competitive software and the old magazines off the rack with the same financial outlay. Every month after that, I am effectively handing over $8 for software development (and again- the competitors are priced in the $20 range).
Which brings me to the question- why do we pay $15 a month for the months in which D&D insider DOESN'T include this software? At that point, aren't we just paying $15 for electronic versions of magazines we used to buy at the newsstand for $7?
To be fair- we haven't seen what D&D insider will bring. It's possible that this will be the most amazing battlemat ever, and that it will blow all competitors out of the water. I've seen powerpoint presentations at conventions that make the assertion that you are getting a LOT for your $15, but I haven't come to the same conclusion yet. I hope they do it! If D&D insider is actually that much better than what is currently in-market, then life will be extremely good for virtual tabletop users (who are already pretty happy).
I believe WOTC are good people that are going to really work to try to make D&D insider worth it. I just want to be clear about how much work I expect that to take.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 12:29PM
#28
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Date Joined:
Mar 11, 2006
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Let's say they have someone up front giving free appetizers, and you don't like them. THEN the restaraunt, serving gourmet hamburgers, has listed menu prices of $30 a plate. I would complain then.
Again, let's say the trailers were awful, and that the local Cinemark has to charge $40 a ticket to pay for the high cost of the movie. Yep, I would complain and still not see it.
We're just arguing about mind set now, and maybe there's no point to that, but I still disagree with you.
You're saying that you'd complain about the restaurant because you didn't like the free sample, and you'd complain about the movie because you didn't like the free trailer? Why? Isn't your mind already made up?
After you've already decided you don't like the product anyway, you still think it's important to complain about the price? If you aren't buying it anyway, what does it matter if it's $15 or $15,000? If it was free, would you take it because it's free, even though you've already decided you don't like it?
I did approach this with an open mind. You, however, have not. You're blindly willing to give WotC the benefit of the doubt, and your cash, despite anything and everything you've heard, and are unwilling to accept that someone may have a legitimate complaint.
I'm not sure you understand what being open-minded is. If you're willing to give benefit of the doubt, you're open-minded. If you've made up your mind without seeing the finished product, you're not open-minded.
And I think I'm open-minded enough to listen to legitimate complaints. I haven't seen any so far in this thread. I have some of my own. I don't think the quality of Dungeon and Dragon magazines is yet equal to what Paizo was publishing. I think the 3D character thing is unneccesary. I'd like to see some real improvements and I'd like to see some impressive content for me to decide $15 a month is worth it. But, I'm open-minded enough to give it a chance before I dismiss it.
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 12:41PM
#29
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THere are 3 paying options 10 a month /year 13 / 3 months 15/ 1 month. And if your going 10 a month you'll paying less than what MOST mmorpgs monthly fees are.
This entire MMORPG statement assumes that EVERYONE who play D&D plays some kind of MMO, and, guess what? Thats not true
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5 years ago ::
Jun 04, 2008 - 12:43PM
#30
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There's not much point in debating whether the $15/month, or $180/year, is a lot of money or not. I don't know anyone over the age of 16 who would think that's a lot of money, but if you do then you have my sympathy.
Nice to know you are rolling in cash. I know ALOT of people over 16 (most in their 30s), who consider it a significant amount of money to waste on something they won;t be using every day, ore even every other day. Especially when you figure mortgages, car payments, bills, food, and other expenses into life.
And for the MMO comparisons, there's a difference. Most people who play MMO's do so at least every other day, if not daily. Honestly, are any of you going to use DDI daily? Maybe 1 or 2 times a week, but not like you do an MMO
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