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5 years ago ::
Sep 01, 2008 - 7:22PM
#21
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Unless the monsters were idiots, after it became obvious they couldn't beat this defensive bastion (when people keep getting up and falling down and getting up and ...) they should have retreated to lick their wounds, possibly to be encountered later.
The hallway in question was the only way in or out, so it came down to a battle of attrition that was boring for all (and particularly frustrating for thr GM). The monsters were far too mobile (or too far away) for the tank to get close without getting slaughtered on the way (consecrated ground only heals when you are bloody) and the strikers were in really rough shape from the first part of the encounter. Add to that, the fact that the monsters were firing from behind cover about half of the time. It sucked for all.
It was a pre-generated encounter that will be this GM's last. The week prior, he had informed us that he would finish the quest that we were on, but from then on, he would be crafting his own. This particular encounter really showed us why he wants to do that, and I am quite excited to see what he comes up with, as we have a fairly eclectic mix of classes and playstyles in our group. Pre-generated encounters have gone from one extreme to the other for us. The all have seemed rediculously easy or crushingly hard.
I think that an adventure that is designed to both use our strengths and force us to creatively overcome our weeknesses will be far more fun.
Back on topic: In our group, when a character goes down, we have always played as though the effects that he has created go away. Like a Fighter's mark or a Warlock's curse. Could the same happen with this? I know that it would be contrary to the RAW, but it would seem to solve the problem.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 01, 2008 - 8:32PM
#22
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Doesn't work. Regeneration only activates if you have at least 1 hp at the beginning of your turn.
A good point, though Consecrated Ground isn't formally regeneration, even though it has the same effect. That would be one way to remove this as an exploit (house rule or errata the power as granting regeneration), but as it stands it seems to be a legal use.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 01, 2008 - 8:41PM
#23
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Date Joined:
Aug 11, 2006
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It's a legal use and it requires that you blow two daily powers to pull it off - it's hardly unreasonable to expect it to be effective, especially in what amount to perfect circumstances to use it.
And no, I would not suggest causing all effects to disappear if the person drops - that's going to create problems, especially since it makes the leaders an even bigger target. (Knock them down to dispel all of the buffs on the party? Great!)
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5 years ago ::
Sep 01, 2008 - 8:51PM
#24
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And no, I would not suggest causing all effects to disappear if the person drops - that's going to create problems, especially since it makes the leaders an even bigger target. (Knock them down to dispel all of the buffs on the party? Great!)
I think by "goes down", he meant knocked unconscious/dying.
If such effects don't disappear when a character is dying, it invites coup de graces from the enemy. For instance, if a paladin uses Divine Challenge to mark someone and is then knocked below 0 health, is the enemy still marked on the next turn? Divine Challenge does radiant damage if the enemy attacks anyone besides the paladin, so it's basically begging the enemy to finish the paladin off.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 01, 2008 - 9:47PM
#25
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Date Joined:
Aug 11, 2006
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I'm aware that that's what he meant, but the point still remains - it effectively allows enemies to "dispel" any powers simply by knocking someone to 0 - that's not how the rules handle it and that's going to weaken those powers consideraby, especially the party-bolstering ones which leaders typically grant.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 02, 2008 - 9:48AM
#26
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A good point, though Consecrated Ground isn't formally regeneration, even though it has the same effect. That would be one way to remove this as an exploit (house rule or errata the power as granting regeneration), but as it stands it seems to be a legal use.
I was responding to the mention of Boundless Endurance, not commenting on whether or not the Consecrated Ground tactic works. That's why the quote block in my post was about Boundless Endurance.
Consecrated Ground does indeed pull you back up from below 0hp.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 02, 2008 - 1:06PM
#27
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Quick question;
If you are dead when at your bloodied value under 0hp, does that mean the power still gives you hit points back when you are dead because your hp is under half maximum and thus you're still bloodied?
The rules don't state that when you're dead you are removed from the game or that you are no longer bloodied when you are dead, so technically you could be dead and at half hp after a few rounds of combat. Unless you come back to life that is.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 02, 2008 - 4:27PM
#28
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I'm aware that that's what he meant, but the point still remains - it effectively allows enemies to "dispel" any powers simply by knocking someone to 0 - that's not how the rules handle it and that's going to weaken those powers consideraby, especially the party-bolstering ones which leaders typically grant.
Personally, I'd rather creatures be encouraged to knock out a character and then be free to focus on other opponents, rather than encouraged to attack a character until he or she is dead.
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5 years ago ::
Sep 02, 2008 - 9:14PM
#29
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Personally, I'd rather creatures be encouraged to knock out a character and then be free to focus on other opponents, rather than encouraged to attack a character until he or she is dead.
And that would make sense for the first time they knock a PC down. The second time, I would expect the monsters to go for the kill.
I played in an LG game where my Archer knocked a fiendish mantis (or at least that was the mini, whatever it was had fast healing) down on one turn, but I didn't realize what it was (other than something large sized that fell out of a tree when shot two times) so the turn after it fell down, it got back up.
When it got back up though, I may have overreacted and used my Bracers of Quick Strike to triple shot the nearly dead thing (yeah, it must've had like 3 hp). But that is what happens when an enemy apparently gets up without assistance (especially when it is larged sized, because larged sized = owns archers under 3.5's reach rules).
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5 years ago ::
Sep 03, 2008 - 1:34AM
#30
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Date Joined:
Jul 16, 2008
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Y'know, I thought about CG and what it means in the campaign I play in. I imagine it's a HUGE "mark" the Cleric basically drops on the battlefield attracting almost every attack...at least against semi-intelligent creatures etc.
I'm gonna sit and wait to see how our GM deals with it...but he hinted that when my Pally gets Healing Font (paragon), the same will happen to her.
Fox
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