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5 years ago ::
Jul 29, 2008 - 7:36PM
#11
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Thats.. pretty easy. DC 20? I mean, 1/2 level per skill means at at level 30 they'd already have gotten 15 of the 20 DC.
Unless im misunderstanding. I would think something as difficult as this would be like, DC 35, 40, 45, etc. Or harder!
I was joking.
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5 years ago ::
Jul 30, 2008 - 8:25AM
#12
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Wow, thought this thread had died, glad it didn't. You have some pretty damn good arguments though, interesting stuff. I might have to use this hook myself.
Thanks!
So you guys all say diplomacy's the way to go here?
I always considered diplomacy to involve a lot of flattery and proper adressing (eg ranks or nobility titles) to get people to "like you" better, not really "making your point" but more getting them friendly enough that they'd help you even if your points aren't all that good.
I consider Orcus too smart and just too plain evil to fall for this. Probably the use of diplomacy should give an automatic failure (like intimidate does in the DMG example) 'cuz he sees it as a weakness, and an insult to him that you think he'd fall for such "flowery happy" crap.
This is really more a question of: "is your reasoning correct?" -which would be either judging my arguments or checking religion- and "can you convince Orcus that this is the only/best way for him to achieve power" -check the current combat(?) situation, power status of his cult, intimidate(?)-?
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4 years ago ::
Jun 10, 2009 - 6:06AM
#13
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Date Joined:
Feb 24, 2009
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IMO you should need Bluff and Diplomacy because he's a Demon Prince.
Bluff to stroke his ego say DC 35 or so
then Diplomacy of at least DC 40
thats even if you can make it into a close enough range to even communicate with him
on another note... Convincing him that he is already the God of Blood or God of Slaughter might work better
but pitting him against Vecna!!! that's something that I would love to see!!! or at least read about... fighting for the title of God of Undead!!!
I am using the Cult of Orcus in my Shadowfell campaign... and the war has already begun!!
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4 years ago ::
Jun 10, 2009 - 2:28PM
#14
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Date Joined:
May 16, 2009
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The thing I have trouble seeing is how you would get Orcus to even talk to you in the first place...
From his entry in the MM;
"Orcus finds amusement in the suffering and anguish of the living and satisfaction only when he drinks their blood. Most living things enrage him by their mere presence, and Orcus permits only undead to be near him; even his demon servitors are undead."
So parlaying with Orcus himself is probably not going to happen, unless your party happens to be undead. Once you've battled your way to his inner sanctum the chips are down, and once a living being has violated his sanctum with its presence there's no way he's letting you out alive.
That said, you could possibly try negotiating with Orcus via proxy, but in this instance I think it would be doubly hard to really convince him of your position, he is a Chaotic Evil demonlord after all. Even if you do manage to hammer out some kind of agreement you can be damn certain he's not going to hold up his end of the bargain. Once he's got what he wants the deal is off.
Of course, if you guys want to tell a different story go right ahead, it's up to your DM in the end; but I personally do not see Orcus, as written, being the kind of opponent you can overcome diplomatically.
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4 years ago ::
Jun 11, 2009 - 11:18AM
#15
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I really don't think you're going to be able to convince him to give up on the idea of "God of Death" and the associated overthrow of the Raven Queen. On the other side, you might manage to convince him to try to take out Vecna as a stepping-stone to greater power, with which to overthrow the Raven Queen. Being undead at the time might be helpful - consider the Archliche ED. You can get the other good gods to help out largely on the premise that Orcus (kinda dumb in some ways, and predictable) is just easier to handle than Vecna. Bonus points on the convincing if you can dredge up the Sword of Kas from somewhere to offer him for the project.
Of course, at that point you're not really serving the Raven Queen all that well. For serving her - well, if you're going on a great quest of the faith, and providing such a service to the Raven Queen, talk to her first. I figure if you slaughter your way through is minions, lock him in a seal of binding, and then activate some artifact to let her know you're ready, she'll be happy to show up and accept a gift-wrapped Orcus - and she'll probably have some way of making sure that he's really dead when he dies this time.
Side note: I would not have described your character as Nuetral, back in 3.x. Fortunately, Unaligned fits him pretty well.
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1 year ago ::
May 21, 2012 - 3:20AM
#16
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2010
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Orcus isnt about petty things, he covets ravens throne not for this but for power to destroy tharzidun his father and take over hell and the abyss. His goal is to consume the shard of pure evil piercing the hollows of the abysd and become a god. He'd go for what sounds good if it can be pulled off, but hes a plans of thousands of years guy, he could attack anyone at anytime, even the players.
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1 year ago ::
May 21, 2012 - 3:24AM
#17
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2010
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Dont forget dcs.... They increase as players level. By increments of 5 level divisible by 5 for easy and 5 at each level of difficulty for that level, so at 30th its 30 easy 35 moderate 40 hard and to convince orcus 45 for not a shot but try anyway
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13 months ago ::
May 21, 2012 - 3:27PM
#18
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Date Joined:
Apr 16, 2012
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This depends on if the DM uses Orcus straight out of the book or makes changes. Orcus has an extreme hate for anything living in the book, I doubt you could say one word before he orders your party's death. You can always change what you don't like though. Just my 2 cents.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 10:12AM
#19
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Date Joined:
Mar 20, 2007
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Hopefully you are good at shouting too, as Orcus will be damaging you durring the entire conversation unless you are 20 sq. away. (Aura 20: 10 Necrotic Damage) I hear it is hard to have a philisophical conversation 100 ft. away from eachother.
Well, if you beat the crap out of him, now he is damaging you for 20 Necrotic per round. (while Orcus is bloodied.
Just a thought.
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