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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:19PM
#11
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I think that DM's who do use it, are holding over to the more "black and white" style of gaming. I am a big fan of "shades of grey" world. The most fun though, is playing the "black and white" character in the "shades of grey world" as he realizes maybe everything isn't that simple.
Yes, I think so too. And it's important to note that removing alignment from the books would have no impact on games with black&white morality. D&D did not invent the idea of evil and good. There will still be evil things and good things in your game even if you do not use the alignment system.
All the D&D games I run have had fairly simple morality. There are badguys and there are goodguys. Sometimes badguys disguise themselves as goodguys, and you can never tell who the goodguys are by the color of their scales alone, but other than that it's pretty black&white. Yet I still don't like using the alignment system.
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:23PM
#12
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Date Joined:
Oct 28, 2007
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My personal experience tells me that alignment leads to bad things. I played a Monk in 3.5. Anytime I tried to do something remotely cretive, the DM asked "What alignment are you again?"
That has nothing to do with alignment. That is designer asshattery. Alignment = morality quantified (and given tangibility). Having a problem with the idea of objective morality does not give you any leverage in debating its merit.
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:28PM
#13
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Date Joined:
Aug 20, 2008
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I rarely do. However, it is better to have it in the rulebook than not have it. For players who don't want it, it's easily dismissed. For players that appreciate it, it's available for use.
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:31PM
#14
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Removed.
EVERY DAY IS HORRIBLE POST DAY ON THE D&D FORUMS.
Everything makes me ANGRY (ESPECIALLY you, reader)
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:36PM
#15
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Date Joined:
Dec 21, 2001
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I still use alignment and am far from a new player. I use it to help define the character. In those early days of a character when they're little more than stats and an idea, alignment reminds me how I would like the character to act.
It's not the most important part of defining characters but it does help.
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:39PM
#16
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Date Joined:
Oct 28, 2007
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I think that DM's who do use it, are holding over to the more "black and white" style of gaming. I am a big fan of "shades of grey" world. The most fun though, is playing the "black and white" character in the "shades of grey world" as he realizes maybe everything isn't that simple.
I do the latter too. Alignment exists, but nearly everyone is Neutral, because people don't tend to ponder their personal ethics when there's bills to pay and mouths to feed. I played a Paladin once in a campaign that included some shady (though not necessarily Evil) characters. He ended up sorting most of them out and managed to persuade them to adopt concrete philosophies and strong principles. 'Twas fun.
Alignment actually does make room for shades of gray, for those interested in learning. We call it "Neutral."
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:44PM
#17
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I still use alignment and am far from a new player. I use it to help define the character. In those early days of a character when they're little more than stats and an idea, alignment reminds me how I would like the character to act.
It's not the most important part of defining characters but it does help.
I still use alignment after 10 years of playing. Maybe its because I always have used it or maybe its because I enjoy it, I doubt I'll ever know for sure. For me, I use alignment to label myself for my DM and for anyone interested what ideals I fight for and where I stand on morality.
I've never found it to be a restraint or a crutch. I made my character then gave him an alignment always. However, as I said, for those who don't like it there is no reason to use it at this point as there are no real rules for it.
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:45PM
#18
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Date Joined:
Feb 20, 2008
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I actually use Alignment but fairly loosely. For each new character first ask them what kind of character they have in mind, then run down the questionnaire found in the Personality section of the PHB (p23-24,) and have the players choose which train their character would choose and write down their choice in the Personality section on the back of their character sheet. This gives each a rough idea of the characters personality and attitude and from their they can either choose to pick an alignment or go unaligned.
More advanced players don't need to write down an artificial alignment at all but many still enjoy going through the questionnaire in a RP fashion.
To be frank I much prefer the Virtue & Vice system of the World of Darkness. It's very simple but gives even a basic player a very solid idea of what drives them. I've often considered converting it to my D&D games but it would require a fair bit of change to work, but still I think over all it's far superior.
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 12:51PM
#19
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Date Joined:
Feb 11, 2006
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Thank you for your responses so far. I'm well aware that some of you fear alignment more than God's wrath, but I'd like to focus on those DMs and players who still use it in 4e, and why. After my curiosity is sated by a few more comments from those folks, feel free to awaken the undying beast that is all the alignment bicker-fest threads that ever have been and ever will be. Give me until page two, that's only eleven more posts.  TS
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5 years ago ::
Oct 04, 2008 - 1:09PM
#20
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Date Joined:
Nov 13, 2004
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As a player? Pointless. On some base level, though, I do like how some creatures are absolute embodifications of good and evil. But that's just flavor.
As a DM? Well, it can be a nice to just glance at a stat block and get a very abstract idea of that creature's personality. Though "unaligned" is incredibly ambiguous and unhelpful in this department.
4e D&D is not a "Tabletop MMO." It is not Massively Multiplayer, and is usually not played Online. Come up with better descriptions of your complaints, cuz this one means jack ****.
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