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5 months ago ::
Jan 09, 2013 - 12:12PM
#421
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Date Joined:
Dec 22, 2010
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I haven't seen defenders use polearm momentum before.
Then you should read the forums more.
That guide is very cool in my opinion, though I would think it is more suited as a controller/striker.
Defenders are a subset of controller.
I have a guide that talks about the math relating the odds of CA too. It agrees with your assumption Fardiz. CA is not hard to get. It happens half the time in the first round, and 75% of time in any other round. Spending more than a feat on CA could be considered excessive design if you only wanted CA 75% of the time.
Post the guide and if the majority of the forum-contributers feal it to be accurate, then it should get added to this list.
There are guides rejected from this list subjectively, and there could be a list that has an explicit criteria free of subjectiveness. So long as opinions in a guide are started as opinions, and the RAW is correct the guides should be allowed. That way elitists can have this guide, and everyone is still equally encouraged to participate in the Char Op community despite not being popular with the Char Op click.
There is no CharOP clique or if anything there are several. But they all come together to maintain this thread by consensus.
Through the Fair Use of the 1976 copyright act any of the guides in the current list could be included. That should get around any childish claims that people only want their guide in one list.
I love how Americans always assume they can enforce their copyright laws globally...
Maybe Matyr could make the list, he seems level headed. Fradiz seems to have a great grasp on 4E as well. He could make it.
Catpikes guide is good too.
I'm glad I have a firm grasp on 4e. I also have a firm grasp on common sense - I'm not going to spend hours and hours (trust me my guide took many days of actual work) to recreate something that already exists.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 09, 2013 - 1:33PM
#422
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I recommend adding, as a replacement, LDB's Scout Guide to the list, it's more up to date...
Edit: ...and complete.
I have added the above to Strikers post on page 1.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 09, 2013 - 2:24PM
#423
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I recommend adding, as a replacement, LDB's Scout Guide to the list, it's more up to date...
Edit: ...and complete.
I have added the above to Strikers post on page 1.
guides
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my builds
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 09, 2013 - 11:00PM
#424
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As you wish Zelink, I redact it. Matyr and Fardiz couldn't make a less subjective collection of guides.
Fardiz, subsets and copyright will be set aside to be discussed elsewhere at Zelinks request.
I tried a long time ago to post a list to this collection and it was subjectively denied regardless the many community contributions it had received.
There were wild claims upon the thread. The worst of which was the fallacy that somehow a person might build their character purely from a list of 75 powers from various classes without viewing a guide on a specific class.
Some people would suggest things for the list, and were not available to defend the powers they picked when challenge was brought to them. The click blamed me as if I had picked those powers, and some others believed that I had picked them.
I tried to remind people that there are over 3000 powers in heroic tier. The list was highlighing 25 of the best by opinion, and 50 more awesome powers by opinion.
Then the thread was locked. Nobody who had contributed or spent time on the list could do anything about it.
However, the lists were mostly completed so it was kind of a relief. I was getting sick of repeatedly saying the same things. I constantly had to remind people of the submission format, there were 3000 powers, there isn't linearity of powers, the list was opinion based, powers were submitted by other players etc.
Debates had to just be documented in some cases. A concensus could not be reached on whether attacking one creature 1 extra time a turn was better than attacking with a lot of damage in an AOE.
I think the last headache for me to want to pursue generating the list came when I was faced with explaining to someone that when a power makes auspicious birth a required background, it is not as good as a power that does the same function without the requirement. *facepalm*
I have thought about trying it again in the way that my favorite thread was performed. He had a rule in there to determine the best for his list by a rule of 3 votes in or 3 votes out. He completely freed himself from trying to explain anything because he could put the onus entirely on the community. I believe that to the way to produce a list.
Spoiler:
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Concisely: I want a system where players don't have to pick between mechanics and roleplaying. I hope 5E fails asap so a better system can be made asap.
Spoiler:
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5 months ago ::
Jan 10, 2013 - 12:13AM
#425
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Zach, your thread, and your opinion on how threads should be run, and your knowledge of the rules, and your ability to follow Social Contract all suck. You contribute less than people who haven't been here in over 2 years, and clutter threads like this one with your nonsensical self-justification. Plain and simple, you're being a jerk by disrupting these forums repeatedly and by being so arrogant that you can't ever admit your actual mistakes, you just come up with excuses time and time again. You even gloat when the people who have snubbed you fail, and label anyone who points out any flaw of yours 'a mean jerk', but you're just a hypocrite, the biggest jerk of them all.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection. My Guides
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5 months ago ::
Jan 10, 2013 - 12:21AM
#426
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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Zath and Alcestis. I group you two up with Come and Get it and....
THICKET OF BLADES!!!
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out hereSpoiler:
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
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5 months ago ::
Jan 10, 2013 - 12:24AM
#427
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Date Joined:
Feb 26, 2011
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That so didn't work out as expected.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 10, 2013 - 12:43PM
#428
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Date Joined:
Nov 16, 2010
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Baja says.....
Spoiler:
Show
As you wish Zelink, I redact it. Matyr and Fardiz couldn't make a less subjective collection of guides.
Fardiz, subsets and copyright will be set aside to be discussed elsewhere at Zelinks request.
I tried a long time ago to post a list to this collection and it was subjectively denied regardless the many community contributions it had received.
There were wild claims upon the thread. The worst of which was the fallacy that somehow a person might build their character purely from a list of 75 powers from various classes without viewing a guide on a specific class.
Some people would suggest things for the list, and were not available to defend the powers they picked when challenge was brought to them. The click blamed me as if I had picked those powers, and some others believed that I had picked them.
I tried to remind people that there are over 3000 powers in heroic tier. The list was highlighing 25 of the best by opinion, and 50 more awesome powers by opinion.
Then the thread was locked. Nobody who had contributed or spent time on the list could do anything about it.
However, the lists were mostly completed so it was kind of a relief. I was getting sick of repeatedly saying the same things. I constantly had to remind people of the submission format, there were 3000 powers, there isn't linearity of powers, the list was opinion based, powers were submitted by other players etc.
Debates had to just be documented in some cases. A concensus could not be reached on whether attacking one creature 1 extra time a turn was better than attacking with a lot of damage in an AOE.
I think the last headache for me to want to pursue generating the list came when I was faced with explaining to someone that when a power makes auspicious birth a required background, it is not as good as a power that does the same function without the requirement. *facepalm*
I have thought about trying it again in the way that my favorite thread was performed. He had a rule in there to determine the best for his list by a rule of 3 votes in or 3 votes out. He completely freed himself from trying to explain anything because he could put the onus entirely on the community. I believe that to the way to produce a list.
Someone musta hit that boy with Weight of Earth, because he is definitely slow /HankHill
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5 months ago ::
Jan 12, 2013 - 12:03AM
#429
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CharOp doesn't function on opinion. Neither do its guides.
Sorry for the late response. I was flying back to the US.
The following is from one of Zrathis' guides:
Spellmirror (I) - I'm not fond of immediates triggering off you getting missed, still, the damage is good for an off-turn attack, the range is impressive, and it works well against status causing enemies.
Zrathis makes good guides. I am pointing out that opinions play a bigger part than some are willing to admit.
Furthermore I dispute everything that Zrathis personally attacked me with and would appreciate it if we could focus on talking about my guides getting listed to this collection. I am willing to accept courteous constructive criticisms.
Spoiler:
Show
Concisely: I want a system where players don't have to pick between mechanics and roleplaying. I hope 5E fails asap so a better system can be made asap.
Spoiler:
Show
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5 months ago ::
Jan 12, 2013 - 12:37AM
#430
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Date Joined:
Jan 21, 2011
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Furthermore I dispute everything that Zrathis personally attacked me with and would appreciate it if we could focus on talking about my guides getting listed to this collection. I am willing to accept courteous constructive criticisms.
Okay, courteous constructive criticism:
Your guides (so far, and from what I've seen) have all been either 1) not useful to CharOp to the degree that would warrant addition to this thread, or 2) filled with inaccurate statements that would be misleading to anyone reading them for help.
There is no point in "talking about your guides getting listed to this collection," because no one else has agreed with you that they belong here. I do agree on the idea that there's somewhat of a CharOp clique that likes to pat each other on the back...but you're overlooking the fact that *no one,* at all, has been supportive of adding your guides. That means it's time to admit defeat and move on, because the ones you have now are not good enough.
By continuing to argue the point, you're just annoying people for no good reason. If you were going to get support, it would've happened by now; lots of people read this thread (speaking of which, please don't post in this thread any more than is necessary).
(If you would like to make a guide that is accepted, I will say this: a lot of people on this forum are very rude, arrogant, and patronizing. But they also know what they're talking about, so make sure you understand their points, because 95% of the time they will be correct, and even that other 5% will typically at least give insight.)
tl;dr: Your current guides are not ready to add, and don't post your followups in this thread.
I am okay with you saying my argument is stupid, or commits the munchkin fallacy, or any other bad thing you want. Particularly if you give a reason/explanation for it.
However, I will ignore any post that calls me stupid, or a munchkin, or what have you. Not because it bothers me; I've just found that people only start name-calling when that's the best argument they have left.
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