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Switch to Forum Live View Avenger/Pitfighter/Demigod
4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 3:07AM #1
SongNSilence
Date Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 1,274
July 2010: The eratta to free action attacks and especially bloodiron led to a huge drop of damage, but 211 DPR is still quite good, since many other high DPR builds were also hit. The build works better with radiant cheese  (morninglord + boon etc), but a) Morninglord is a very likely candidate for the next update and b) i wanted to keep the essence of a crithunter intact, even if the benfits are not as huge as before...

The Executioner


(Avenger/Ardent Champion/Eternal Defender)




Build Goal:
There are many Avenger builds, but most focus on getting 18-20 crit range or abusing Punisher of the Gods and Swordmaster. This build is to show that a more conventional heavy axe wielding Avenger can also be very competitive, without sacrificing defenses or getting laughs for his little knife :

Balanced Build 211DPR Show

Race: Revenant(Halfelf)
Class: Avenger
Censure: Pursuit
Multiclass: Fighter
Paragon Path: Ardent Champion
Epic Destiny: Eternal Defender

Ability scores, with racial adjustments:
Str 26 (+8)
Con 16 (+3)
Dex 16 (+3)
Int 10 (+0)
Wis 24 (+7)
Cha 12 (+1)

HP: 204; Bloodied: 102; Surges: 10 (59hp)
AC/Fort/Ref/Will: 46*/40/40*/41
Initiative: +22; Speed: 8 (land) 8 (fly)

¹:drops by 2 after first hit

Skills: Religion* (21), Arcana* (21), Stealth* (23), Heal* (26), Perception* (27), Nature (26), Athletics (22), Acrobatics (18), Endurance (18), Insight (21), Dungeoneering (21)
Feats: Armor Proficiency (leather, chain), Weapon Expertise Axe, Versatile Mastery, Weapon Focus: Axe, Deadly Axe, Hand of Divine Guidance, Double Axe Proficiency, Slashing Storm, Reaving Axe Brute, Reaving Axe Student, Battle Awareness, Headmans Chop, Fighter enc power, Half-Elf Soul, Painful Oath, Font of Radiance, Ritual Caster

At-Will: Twin Strike, Overwhelming Strike, Radiant Vengeance
Encounter: Fanatical Flurry, Scatter to the Astral Winds, Battle Fury(fighter), Phase Duel
Daily: Temple of Resolution, Battle Rapture, 2 free
Utility: Ghostly Vengeance, ED stance (not used), Vengeful Revenant, Refocus Emnity, Aspect of Agility, Battle Fury

to-hit: 15(lvl)+8(stat)+6(enh)+3(expertise)+2(weapon) = +34
damage: 6(enh)+3(focus)+6(stance)+6(item)+5(shard) = +26

Twin Strike: 2x +34 vs AC 44 -> 58.5%hit 21.25%critical
main hand: 2d12+26, reroll all 1's (40)
main hand, critical: 3d6+3d12+8d10+62, reroll all 1's (143)
off hand: 2d12+26, reroll all 1's  (40)
off hand, critical: 3d6+3d12+8d10+62, reroll all 1's (143)

damage twin strike + champion : 0.5825*(40) + 0.2125*(143) + 0.5825*(40) + 0.2125*(143) + 0.3798*(0.655*(53)+0.2125*(156)) + 0.91*(14)=  145.89 damage

Bit of conditional damage:
If we scored a critical hit, the enemy is prone due to reaving axe slayer. If he tries to stand up, we get a OA MBA (a). If he stays down, our whole attack next round will benefit from combat advantage and headmans chop (b).
a) 0.655*(53)+0.2125*(156) = 67.87 multiplied by 0.3798 crit chance = 25.78
b) 0.665*(45) + 0.2125*(148) + 0.665*(45) + 0.2125*(148) + 0.3798*0.665*(53) + 0.3798*0.2125*(156) + 0.96*(14)= 162.17 = 16.28 difference, multiplied by 0.3798 crit chance   = 6.18 dpr
I shall assume he chooses b) to minimize damage, but he actually might choose a to have a better chance to hit.
Also, Font of Radiance triggers on crit: 3d6 = 10.5, multiplied by 0.3798 crit chance = 3.99

Total DPR, no resources: 156.06 DPR

Additionally, 5 encounters per day we use a large dancing kopesh+4 for a melee base attack
Melee Base: +32 vs AC 44 -> 45%hit 19%critical
main hand: 2d10+32, reroll all 1's (44)
main hand, crit: 3d10 + 3d6+ 5d6 + 64 (117)
0.485*(44)+0.2125*(117)+0.62*0.2125*(0.655*(53)+0.2125*(156)) = 55.13


Total DPR, including dancing kopesh : 211 DPR

Gear:

hand1: +6 large Radiant Double Axe with shard+5
hand2:
implement: +6 holy symbol
body: +6 agile chain
neck: +6 Cloak of Displacement
hands: Gauntlets of Destruction
arms: Executioner's Bracers
head: Eye of Awareness
waist: Belt of Mountain Endurance
ring: Ring of Giants
ring: War Ring
misc: Adventurers Kit, 5x large Dancing Kopesh+4

Damage Build, 232 dpr Show


Race: Revenant(Halfelf)
Class: Avenger
Censure: Pursuit
Multiclass: Fighter
Paragon Path: Ardent  Champion
Epic Destiny: Eternal Defender

Ability  scores, with racial adjustments:
Str 26 (+8)
Con 16 (+3)
Dex  16 (+3)
Int 10 (+0)
Wis 24 (+7)
Cha 12 (+1)

HP: 204; Bloodied: 102; Surges: 10 (59hp)
AC/Fort/Ref/Will: 46*/40/40*/41
Initiative: +22; Speed: 8 (land) 8 (fly)

¹:drops  by 2 after first hit

Skills: Religion* (21), Arcana*  (21), Stealth* (23), Heal* (26), Perception* (27), Nature (26),  Athletics (22), Acrobatics (18), Endurance (18), Insight (21),  Dungeoneering (21)
Feats: Armor Proficiency (leather, chain),  Weapon Expertise Axe, Versatile Mastery, Silvery Glow, Deadly Axe,  Hand of Divine Guidance, Double Axe Proficiency, Slashing Storm,  Reaving Axe Brute, Reaving Axe Student, Battle Awareness, Headmans Chop,  Fighter enc power, Half-Elf Soul, Painful Oath, Font of Radiance,  Ritual Caster

At-Will: Twin Strike, Overwhelming  Strike, Radiant Vengeance
Encounter: Fanatical Flurry,  Scatter to the Astral Winds, Battle Fury(fighter), Phase Duel
Daily: Temple of Resolution, Battle Rapture, 2 free
Utility: Ghostly Vengeance, ED stance (not used), Vengeful Revenant, Refocus  Emnity, Aspect of Agility, Battle Fury

to-hit:  15(lvl)+8(stat)+6(enh)+3(expertise)+2(weapon) = +34
damage:  6(enh)+4(feat)+6(stance)+6(item)+5(shard)+3(set) = +30

damage ring of rad. storm + brutal 1:
d12 -> 9,25
d10 -> 7.75
d6 -> 4.75

Twin Strike: 2x +34 vs AC 44 -> 58.5%hit 21.25%critical
main hand: 2d12+30,  reroll all 1's + rad storm (48.5)
main hand, critical: 3d6+3d12+7d10+62, reroll all 1's + rad storm (158.25)
off hand: 2d12+30, reroll all 1's + rad storm  (48.5)
off hand,  critical: 3d6+3d12+8d10+62, reroll all 1's + rad storm (158.25)

damage twin  strike + champion : 0.5825*(48.5) + 0.2125*(158.25) + 0.5825*(48.5) +  0.2125*(158.25) + 0.3798*(0.655*(61.5)+0.2125*(171.25)) + 0.91*(14) + 0.2125*0.8675*(5) + 0.2125*(0.655-0.5825)*(48.5)=  167.29 damage

Bit of conditional damage:
If we scored a  critical hit, the enemy is prone due to reaving axe slayer. If he tries  to stand up, we get a OA MBA (a). If he stays down, our whole attack  next round will benefit from combat advantage and headmans chop (b).
a)  0.655*(61.5)+0.2125*(171.25) = 76.67 multiplied by 0.3798 crit chance =  29.12
b) 0.665*(53.5) + 0.2125*(163.25) + 0.665*(53.5) + 0.2125*(163.25) +  0.3798*0.665*(61.5) + 0.3798*0.2125*(171.25) + 0.96*(14)= 183.33 = 16.04  difference, multiplied by 0.3798 crit chance   = 6.09 dpr
I shall  assume he chooses b) to minimize damage, but he actually might choose a  to have a better chance to hit.
Also, Font of Radiance triggers on  crit: 3d6 = 10.5, multiplied by 0.3798 crit chance = 3.99

Total  DPR, no resources: 177.37 DPR

Additionally, 5  encounters per day we use a large dancing kopesh+4 for a melee base  attack
Melee Base: +32 vs AC 44 -> 45%hit 19%critical
main  hand: 2d10+32, reroll all 1's (44)
main hand, crit: 3d10 + 3d6+ 4d6  + 64 (110)
0.485*(44)+0.2125*(110)+0.62*0.2125*(0.655*(61.5)+0.2125*(171.25))  = 54.81


Total DPR, including dancing kopesh : 232  DPR

Gear:

hand1: +6 large Radiant Double Axe with shard+5
hand2: 
implement: +6 holy symbol
body: +6 agile chain
neck: +6  Cloak of Displacement
hands: Gauntlets of Destruction
arms:  Executioner's Bracers
head: Crown of Brilliant Sun
waist: Belt of  Mountain Endurance
ring: Ring of Giants
feet: Spark Slippers
ring: Ring of Radiant Storms
misc:  Adventurers Kit, 5x large Dancing Kopesh+4


Tactics & Conclusion



Great At-Will Damage:
Its safe to say that the Executioner won't lack good at-will damage with an average DPR of 211 DPR ... This damage includes damage from one of our dancing kopeshs+4, which we can and will use 5 encounters per day. Pure at-will damage without dancing weapon: 156 DPR. But our two avenger powers are not useless, covering ranged attacks (Radiant Vengeance) and tactical repositioning (Overwhelming Strike).

OK Defenses:
Since our secondary is Strength, there is no good way to use armor of faith+cloth, so we have to use chain. However, an AC of 46 and NADs of 40/40/41 is not that bad. If necessary, a war ring can be switched for shadow band.

Interesting Powers:
The very high At-will damage puts us in an interesting situation: We cannot choose any daily or encounter attack power which deals more damage than twin strike. This leaves the powers with interesting effects - and the Avenger certainly has a well sorted supply of those. Here are the highlights:
The Temple of Resolution (daily) creates a encounter lasting 5x5 zone of radiant damage (25 for entering, 25 for ending the turn). Its supposed to keep everyone out - but guess where everyone in your party will put his enemies for free damage.
Scatter to the Astral Winds (encounter). Teleport every enemy (but your target) 5 squares. Great for tactical movement, or at the edge of a volcano (or the wizards wall of fire). At worst, you can teleport everyone adjacent to you, for 23 damage from your rain of steel.
Phase Duel: removing someone from battle can be great, removing yourself from battle can be great. Phase Duel does both, and you can even attack the removed enemy !

Utility:
High perception, ok insight. Good speed, ignoring difficult terrain due to flying, and ok initiative (+22) makes sure our prey cannot escape. We fly up 20 squares with a double running move (and 1/encounter up to 40 squares), which allows us to reach most interesting places. Walk through walls for 1 full encounter (phasing) can also be very useful outside combat, like scouting the whole dungeon by walking inside the walls, moving through the big steel vault door etc. Ritual Caster is also very useful, especially with so many trained class skills...

Suggestions/Improvements/Comments are welcome
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 3:45AM #2
runreallyfast
Date Joined: Aug 20, 2007
Posts: 1,128

DPR : 0.56*(51) + 0.19*(203) + 0.56*(44) + 0.19*(106) + 2*0.19*0.56*(58) + 2*0.19*0.56*(210) + 0.19*0.56*(51) + 0.19*0.19*(113) = 178.58 damage *


The bolded term seems to me to be incorrect; presumably you intend this as the chance of criticalling on the Reckless Attacker attack, but if so it should be 2*.19*.19*(210).

Doing it in a completely different way, I get a DPR at 30th level for the given character of 152.51, which is, of course, still excellent.

You also cannot trigger Reckless Attacker attacks off of themselves, since it only works when you hit with a fighter power, and Reckless Attacker gives a basic attack, which is not a fighter power.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 4:15AM #3
SongNSilence
Date Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 1,274

runreallyfast wrote:

The bolded term seems to me to be incorrect; presumably you intend this as the chance of criticalling on the Reckless Attacker attack, but if so it should be 2*.19*.19*(210).

Doing it in a completely different way, I get a DPR at 30th level for the given character of 152.51, which is, of course, still excellent.

You also cannot trigger Reckless Attacker attacks off of themselves, since it only works when you hit with a fighter power, and Reckless Attacker gives a basic attack, which is not a fighter power.


Thank you for helping me out, i really appreciate it. The post is updated with the new damage result. I also noticed that DPR with just two bloodiron axes is actually higher now than the bloodiron+reckless combination... 169 DPR vs. 152 DPR !

Edit: or not, copy&paste error

Edit2: 152 it is

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 4:19AM #4
runreallyfast
Date Joined: Aug 20, 2007
Posts: 1,128

DPR : 0.56*(39) + 0.19*(191) + 0.56*(32) + 0.19*(164) + 2*0.19*0.56*(46) + 2*0.19*0.56*(198) + 0.19*0.56*(39) + 0.19*0.19*(164) = 169.2 damage


Heh.

I bet you can't guess what I'm going to say next.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 4:54AM #5
SongNSilence
Date Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 1,274

runreallyfast wrote:

Heh.

I bet you can't guess what I'm going to say next.




I think everything should be correct now

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 12:26PM #6
NoSix
Date Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 18

SongNSilence wrote:

Feats:
2: Improved Armor of Faith
4: Weapon Expertise Axe
6: RROT
8: Weapon Focus: Axe
10: Multiclass Fighter

Feats:
12: Righteous Rage of Tempus
14: Deadly Axe
16: Ritual Caster
18: Two Weapon Fighting
20: Two Weapon Opening
[/sblock]


did i miss something or did you get RROT twice?

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 12:41PM #7
runreallyfast
Date Joined: Aug 20, 2007
Posts: 1,128

NoSix wrote:

did i miss something or did you get RROT twice?


Well, it's a really good feat.

I'm not sure why it (as opposed to something else) was trained out at 11th level, but it was, for Reckless Attacker.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 1:23PM #8
SongNSilence
Date Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 1,274

NoSix wrote:

did i miss something or did you get RROT twice?


Like runreallyfast said, i took a one level break from RRoT for reckless attacker, since the extra attacks on criticals are huge in paragon, especially with avenger and a jagged weapon.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 1:46PM #9
mad2crazy
Date Joined: Aug 28, 2008
Posts: 461
This build pleases me greatly and, IMO, will generally play out better than the other crit fisher builds b/c your encounters and dailies will be nastier and that's what RROT is used on. Oh, and moar nova power :D
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2009 - 2:12PM #10
Caeric
Date Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 1,677
Not to bring you down, but I've looked into stuff and there is no line whatsoever that states that multiclassing allows you to treat yourself as one of the class for the sake of what Epic Destinies you meet the prerequisites for.

Seriously, the Player's Handbook just says Paragon Paths. I also know the Character Builder gives you flack for trying; you have to houserule it to have a Minotaur Barbarian/BeastBlooded Minotaur/Eternal Defender. Which is a shame, because a striker with an Execution Axe that deals 2d6 damage (brutal 2) is very very handy. No less than half damage all the time.

I'd like you to prove me wrong, but that's what I've read.
I don't use emoticons, and I'm also pretty pleasant. So if I say something that's rude or insulting, it's probably a joke.
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