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Switch to Forum Live View Kerrus' Whiplement caster
4 years ago  ::  Jul 12, 2009 - 6:41AM #1
Kerrus
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Posts: 1,428
inspired by the bola/netizards that have been popping up, I decided to try and see if I could optimize the lowly whip. And I discovered, in fact, I could.

All right. Now that I've smashed my incorrect preconceptions, let's get down to business.

The name of the game is Chilling Cloud. It's the power you'll be using the most and in turn getting the most out of. We're wizards, not strikers- even if we may have hybrided into one. We're in this game to control and confound. And that's just what we'll do.

Chilling cloud, for the record, is a nice little low damage power. No damage rolls, just flat int modifier damage, but it's an area burst 1 within 10. The real treat is that everyone it hits takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of our next turn.

But we're not stopping there- we're whiplement users. Via hybriding implements, and a disruptive whip, whenever we hit an enemy with a whip, we get to pick a target- and the enemy takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls against that target until the end of our next turn.

Already, you're hitting multiple enemies, who are going to be taking a -4 to attack rolls against a given target, and a -2 against everyone else. Originally I thought one could gith psychic lock the power, but I've discovered that dual implements don't work like that. Alas.

But we're not done yet, because there's so much more that can be done, so let's get to it.

The first is a favourite of mine: Mark of storm. It's not very useful at the heroic tier of the game because we won't be dealing much thunder or lightning damage- but on cometh paragon.

I've arcane admixtured Chilling Cloud into Chilling Booming Cloud- it's a thunder/cold power now. And I've taken some feats to help that out.

1. Resounding Thunder: This increases the 'Area 1 burst within 10' to 'Area 2 burst within 10.' That's a nice big area of effect there to be sure.
2. Solid Sound: After I use any power with the thunder keyword, such as the previously admixed Chilling Booming Cloud, I get a +2 to a non-AC defence of my choice. Those enemies will be looking to take me out of the picture so they can actually hit people, yanno.
3. To capitalize on the fact that granting such blanket penalties to such a decent area, I've picked up White Lotus (Master) Riposte. Thus, whenever one of my targets manages to hit me through the penalties, and bonuses, I can hit him back- but more importantly, since I'll be using chilling cloud, I can reposition, to catch any enemies nearby that I missed the first time around.

But there's more then just that- because the penalty the whip grants is only against a specific target. If I choose to hit targets I've already hit, then I can pick a second target for them to take the penalty on. -4 to attack rolls is potent, just look at cloaks of distortion. But these penalties don't adhere to such condtionals as 'ranged attacks from 6+ squares away'. So already, it's inherently better. Coupled with the range, and other possible amusement, and you have always useful technique for really, really snazzy battlefield control.

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Garth Whiplement User_ the Untouchable, level 14
Shadar-kai, Wizard|Avenger, Abiding Reaper
Hybrid Avenger: Hybrid Avenger Will
Hybrid Talent: Armor of Faith
Arcane Admixture Damage Type: Arcane Admixture Thunder
Arcane Admixture Power: Chilling Cloud

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 14, Con 13, Dex 14, Int 22, Wis 19, Cha 9.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 13, Con 12, Dex 11, Int 16, Wis 15, Cha 8.


AC: 28 Fort: 20 Reflex: 23 Will: 23
HP: 90 Surges: 7 Surge Value: 22

TRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +16, Arcana +18, Religion +18, Perception +16

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Bluff +6, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +11, Endurance +8, Heal +11, History +13, Insight +11, Intimidate +6, Nature +11, Stealth +11, Streetwise +6, Thievery +9, Athletics +9

FEATS
Level 1: Two-Blade Warrior
Level 2: Whip Training
Level 4: Dual Implement Spellcaster
Level 6: White Lotus Defense
Level 8: Hybrid Talent
Level 10: Improved Armor of Faith
Level 11: Arcane Admixture
Level 12: Resounding Thunder
Level 14: Solid Sound

POWERS
Hybrid Avenger at-will 1: Radiant Vengeance
Hybrid Wizard at-will 1: Chilling Cloud
Hybrid encounter 1: Grasping Shadows
Hybrid daily 1: Renewing Strike
Hybrid utility 2: Distracting Flare
Hybrid encounter 3: Enmity's Reach
Hybrid daily 5: Stinking Cloud
Hybrid utility 6: Wizard's Escape
Hybrid encounter 7: Enemies Abound
Hybrid daily 9: Ice Storm
Hybrid utility 10: Channel Endurance
Hybrid encounter 13: Prismatic Burst (replaces Enmity's Reach)

ITEMS
Disrupting Whip +3
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======
Oh Content, where art thou?
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4 years ago  ::  Jul 12, 2009 - 7:26AM #2
Kerrus
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Posts: 1,428
Fixed and open for business.
Oh Content, where art thou?
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4 years ago  ::  Jul 12, 2009 - 12:14PM #3
CubeKnight
Date Joined: Dec 19, 2003
Posts: 333
Love the idea, but I've got a question:

Kerrus wrote:

FEATS
Level 1: Two-Blade Warrior
Level 2: Whip Training
Level 4: Dual Implement Spellcaster
Level 6: White Lotus Defense
Level 8: Hybrid Talent
Level 10: Improved Armor of Faith
Level 11: Arcane Admixture
Level 12: Resounding Thunder
Level 14: Solid Sound


AFAIK, Two-Balde Warrior and Whip Training are both Multiclass Feats, so you can't get both. Is there something I'm missing that allows you to take both?

Edit: Also, why the Avenger Hybrid? I don't see anything that requires you to be an Avenger. Why not go, say, Warlord Hybrid and take Warlord Armor Proficiency? That also means you're a Martial class and don't need Two-Blade Warrior.

Edit 2: Nevermind, I just noticed why the Avenger Hybrid. It's to be proficient with Holy Symbols and being able to use the (Disrupting) Whip as an Implement, right?

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 12, 2009 - 12:29PM #4
Isenhertz
Date Joined: Jul 21, 2008
Posts: 461

Kerrus wrote:

3. To capitalize on the fact that granting such blanket penalties to such a decent area, I've picked up White Lotus (Master) Riposte. Thus, whenever one of my targets manages to hit me through the penalties, and bonuses, I can hit him back- but more importantly, since I'll be using chilling cloud, I can reposition, to catch any enemies nearby that I missed the first time around.


Unfortunately, that's a widely spread misconception. Note that WLMR specifically says you repeat the "at-will attack power's attack" against that enemy, not the full at-will. Still, another -4 to attack for that target can make a huge difference in the next turn.

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 12, 2009 - 1:55PM #5
Khan_the_Destroyer
Date Joined: Apr 4, 2004
Posts: 3,327

CubeKnight wrote:

AFAIK, Two-Balde Warrior and Whip Training are both Multiclass Feats, so you can't get both. Is there something I'm missing that allows you to take both?


Well, I don't see it in the OP, but the Windrise Ports background would allow him to multiclass in both Ranger and the Whip.

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 12, 2009 - 2:13PM #6
CubeKnight
Date Joined: Dec 19, 2003
Posts: 333

Khan the Destroyer wrote:

Well, I don't see it in the OP, but the Windrise Ports background would allow him to multiclass in both Ranger and the Whip.


Oh, there's a background that lets you MC in 2 classes? Nice!

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 13, 2009 - 3:33AM #7
Merchant_of_Shadows
Date Joined: Jan 13, 2008
Posts: 1,005
Why do you need two-bladed warrior? Wouldn't a staff or orb in the offhand work better for you?
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4 years ago  ::  Jul 13, 2009 - 8:32PM #8
Kerrus
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Posts: 1,428
Windrise ports it is.

And I need two blade warrior to be a martial class so I can get whip training.
Oh Content, where art thou?
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4 years ago  ::  Jul 13, 2009 - 8:34PM #9
ff6shadow
Date Joined: Sep 10, 2004
Posts: 10,574
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't this same basic trick work with bolas as well? If I recall, they sacrifice damage to immobilize until the end of your next turn, right? That would be some crazy control.
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Jun 9, 2012 -- 9:12AM, HairlessThoctar wrote:

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 14, 2009 - 1:47AM #10
karossii
Date Joined: Sep 3, 2007
Posts: 367
As I first read the windrise ports background, my initial thoughts were of finally taking whip training for a non martial non bard character. But then, much to my dismay, I actually READ the background - and it specifies that "You can take class-specific multiclass feats for two classes other than your own, rather than one. You also gain one additional language of your choice." Notice that non class-specific multiclass feats (such as net/whip/bola training) are specifically left out of the benefit.
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