It doesn't mean that it isn't going away either. And it would be the perfect opportunity for Wizards to give the executioner's axe to a campaign they regularly expressed disdain for.
I think it would be a big mistake on Wizards' part. If LG got canned I could see lots of it's players migrating to Arcanis as they could stick with 3.5
I think it would be a big mistake on Wizards' part. If LG got canned I could see lots of it's players migrating to Arcanis as they could stick with 3.5
I think it would be a big mistake on Wizards' part. If LG got canned I could see lots of it's players migrating to Arcanis as they could stick with 3.5
I fear legal crap pulled to destroy Arcanis and Blackmoor.
I fear legal crap pulled to destroy Arcanis and Blackmoor.
Hmm, I would like to see some effort in making organised play widely available. You now, like having tournaments available every 3 month or so. I would love that.
Oh, and living in Germany, it would be great to have those events in europe, too :-)
Hmm, I would like to see some effort in making organised play widely available. You now, like having tournaments available every 3 month or so. I would love that.Oh, and living in Germany, it would be great to have those events in europe, too :-)
It doesn't mean that it isn't going away either. And it would be the perfect opportunity for Wizards to give the executioner's axe to a campaign they regularly expressed disdain for.
For all we know, Hasbro might wind up giving the axe to WOTC. I remember Ryan Dancey or someone else recently making a comment that if 4th edition came out this soon that the folks at WOTC should be polishing thier resumes as it would be a sign that Hasbro is looking to make a quick cashout of the company. For a long time, I've been wondering if the Hasbro acquisition of WOTC/TSR would wind up like the Quaker's near fatal bungling of Snapple.
For all we know, Hasbro might wind up giving the axe to WOTC. I remember Ryan Dancey or someone else recently making a comment that if 4th edition came out this soon that the folks at WOTC should be polishing thier resumes as it would be a sign tha
For all we know, Hasbro might wind up giving the axe to WOTC. I remember Ryan Dancey or someone else recently making a comment that if 4th edition came out this soon that the folks at WOTC should be polishing thier resumes as it would be a sign that Hasbro is looking to make a quick cashout of the company. For a long time, I've been wondering if the Hasbro acquisition of WOTC/TSR would wind up like the Quaker's near fatal bungling of Snapple.
It was Monte Cook I do believe http://www.ptolus.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?mc_los_155 and he wrote that if an announcement came out in 2006 for 4E to be released in 2007 then it would be too early, etc. He guessed that an announcement would occur in 2007 for 4E to be released in 2008, and he was right.
It was Monte Cook I do believe http://www.ptolus.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?mc_los_155 and he wrote that if an announcement came out in 2006 for 4E to be released in 2007 then it would be too early, etc. He guessed that an announcement would occur in 2007
I like LG a lot. Starting at level 1 would not be the end of the world. Them scrapping it would really suck.
I believe they do the level bump campaigns because LG already exists so there is no need to have another like it. If I am wrong and they start it over as a level bump campaign than that will be the same as killing it.
I like LG a lot. Starting at level 1 would not be the end of the world. Them scrapping it would really suck.I believe they do the level bump campaigns because LG already exists so there is no need to have another like it. If I am wrong and they st
Living Greyhawk – will be coming to a triumphant close next year, and they will be starting fresh with a new batch of characters and players. This will be discussed tonight or tomorrow
So there will be more information by the end of the weekend.
I think that's what they are doing. From the Design & Development Seminar summary on ENworld.So there will be more information by the end of the weekend.
I like LG a lot. Starting at level 1 would not be the end of the world. Them scrapping it would really suck.
I believe they do the level bump campaigns because LG already exists so there is no need to have another like it. If I am wrong and they start it over as a level bump campaign than that will be the same as killing it.
The level bump campaigns exist because they are easier to administer. You don't need to deal with widely differing APLs, since everyone is forced into the same level bracket.
However, in my opinion level bump campaigns are a pointless bad compromise. If the powers that be are unwilling to accept the overhead of a "living" campaign, they should just issue one-offs with xp/equipment guidelines for players and completely eliminate any pretense at character continuity -- for even less overhead to administer from the top and relieving players of accounting headaches.
The level bump campaigns exist because they are easier to administer. You don't need to deal with widely differing APLs, since everyone is forced into the same level bracket.However, in my opinion level bump campaigns are a pointless bad compromise.
So, LG is in for a total reboot after next year. Let's hope WotC attempts to cater to the very hardcore RPGA players immersed in LG. Come on, throw us some frickin bones here, folks.
So, LG is in for a total reboot after next year.Let's hope WotC attempts to cater to the very hardcore RPGA players immersed in LG.Come on, throw us some frickin bones here, folks.
Yeah, because that's not exactly what it sounded like.
Anyway, your post just sounds like spin. "As we know it". Well, yeah, we already knew that - it's going to 4E with first level PCs. It can still be as popular as the RPGA membership makes it, no matter what the "flagship" RPGA campaign is (whatever that means).
Yeah, because that's not exactly what it sounded like.Anyway, your post just sounds like spin. "As we know it". Well, yeah, we already knew that - it's going to 4E with first level PCs. It can still be as popular as the RPGA membership makes it, no m
So, LG is in for a total reboot after next year. Let's hope WotC attempts to cater to the very hardcore RPGA players immersed in LG. Come on, throw us some frickin bones here, folks.
In Australia LG is far and away the most popular RPGA campaign, alot of players myself included would be very unhappy if Living Greyhawk changed to a level bump system or even worse was thrown on the scrapheap of RPG history! (esp. Perrenland!)
In Australia LG is far and away the most popular RPGA campaign, alot of players myself included would be very unhappy if Living Greyhawk changed to a level bump system or even worse was thrown on the scrapheap of RPG history! (esp. Perrenland!)
small city, surronded by small cities, i just want wizards to have thier own online way of playing, without much of a cost, because i cant get people together i real life
small city, surronded by small cities, i just want wizards to have thier own online way of playing, without much of a cost, because i cant get people together i real life
You guys asking for more Living Greyawk are assuming that the RPGA network is going to be retained. With Hasbro introducing the new paid subscription service D&D Insider (forgive me if I didn't get the exact name correct), why would they continue to offer a free RPGA network? D&D Insider is going to be the new source of all gaming solutions per Hasbro.
I have no doubt Living Greyhawk will come to end and any official D&D tournament campaign will be based on Forgotten Realms. FR has been the best selling campaign and is the first scheduled released for 4E.
The current RPGA is nothing like the one I joined originally. The RPGA, if it does survive, is likely to be polymorphed again. -Roger
You guys asking for more Living Greyawk are assuming that the RPGA network is going to be retained. With Hasbro introducing the new paid subscription service D&D Insider (forgive me if I didn't get the exact name correct), why would they continue to
"No doubt", eh? Let's just wait and see, shall we? And the RPGA I RE-joined about three years ago seems MUCH better to me than the one I left about ten years ago ...
"No doubt", eh?:rolleyes:Let's just wait and see, shall we?And the RPGA I RE-joined about three years ago seems MUCH better to me than the one I left about ten years ago ...
Yeah, because that's not exactly what it sounded like.
Anyway, your post just sounds like spin. "As we know it". Well, yeah, we already knew that - it's going to 4E with first level PCs. It can still be as popular as the RPGA membership makes it, no matter what the "flagship" RPGA campaign is (whatever that means).
I've been in the RPGA going on 20 years, was a former regional director and know lots of people. That info comes from what I consider to be reliable sources.
Anyone who thinks that LG is going to play a major role in 4e is deluding themselves. Look at what happened to LC when 3rd edition came out. LG was released and it was the flagship campaign. It had ~20 regions with three volunteers each and another 5 for the circle. About 65 volunteers and LC staff at the time was maybe a half-dozen. Hasbro is trying to sell Forgotten Realms books and LG won't do it.
LG isn't going away, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it go to the D&D campaigns model.
Ed
I've been in the RPGA going on 20 years, was a former regional director and know lots of people. That info comes from what I consider to be reliable sources.Anyone who thinks that LG is going to play a major role in 4e is deluding themselves. Look
I've been in the RPGA going on 20 years, was a former regional director and know lots of people. That info comes from what I consider to be reliable sources.
Anyone who thinks that LG is going to play a major role in 4e is deluding themselves. Look at what happened to LC when 3rd edition came out. LG was released and it was the flagship campaign. It had ~20 regions with three volunteers each and another 5 for the circle. About 65 volunteers and LC staff at the time was maybe a half-dozen. Hasbro is trying to sell Forgotten Realms books and LG won't do it.
LG isn't going away, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it go to the D&D campaigns model.
Ed
I disagree. Almost all of those volunteers would quit if LG went to a D&D campaigns model. The RPGA will want to keep all that free labor. If the volunteers threaten to quit if LG institutes level bumps (and I believe most of them will) then the RPGA won't do it. All those volunteers administrating and writing modules for free is a resource that the RPGA won't just throw away. It just saves them so much money.
Derek
I disagree. Almost all of those volunteers would quit if LG went to a D&D campaigns model. The RPGA will want to keep all that free labor. If the volunteers threaten to quit if LG institutes level bumps (and I believe most of them will) then the RP
WotC has clearly stated that Living Grayhawk will have the door shut on it next year.
They've also stated that they are only releasing 1 new campaign setting a year, and that 2008 will be FR.
So for 2009, will they re-launch Eberron or Grayhawk?
hmmmm .... it shouldn't be that difficult for my magic 8-Ball to pick the winner in that race.
WotC has clearly stated that Living Grayhawk will have the door shut on it next year.They've also stated that they are only releasing 1 new campaign setting a year, and that 2008 will be FR.So for 2009, will they re-launch Eberron or Grayhawk?hmmmm .
I disagree. Almost all of those volunteers would quit if LG went to a D&D campaigns model. The RPGA will want to keep all that free labor. If the volunteers threaten to quit if LG institutes level bumps (and I believe most of them will) then the RPGA won't do it. All those volunteers administrating and writing modules for free is a resource that the RPGA won't just throw away. It just saves them so much money.
Derek
Well, if they go to a D&D Campaign style for LG, they don't NEED all those volunteers to run it - thus back to the reason WoTC prefers the Campaign style in the first place.
Well, if they go to a D&D Campaign style for LG, they don't NEED all those volunteers to run it - thus back to the reason WoTC prefers the Campaign style in the first place.
Well, if they go to a D&D Campaign style for LG, they don't NEED all those volunteers to run it - thus back to the reason WoTC prefers the Campaign style in the first place.
Yeah, they won't need the volunteers. They will also be saying they won't need the players either.
Yeah, they won't need the volunteers. They will also be saying they won't need the players either.
So they are killing...everything. Just as Xendrix expeditions was getting to the peak of fun...
Honesly though, not to actively try to complain, but why couldn't they have simply let those games continue? They are forcing all members of the RPGA to buy fourth edition books to continue playing. It's forcing our (consumer) hands.
So they are killing...everything. Just as Xendrix expeditions was getting to the peak of fun...Honesly though, not to actively try to complain, but why couldn't they have simply let those games continue? They are forcing all members of the RPGA to bu
That really sucks. I appears that my RPGA days are numbered. I never could stand the FR setting. I always struck me as a very poorly managed world, not to mentioned poorly designed. On the plus side, a majority of the Greyhawk groups I have played with (LG or homebrew were great and mature); while, every FR group just fell apart from player (and DM bickering). Wait, they're getting rid of LG; that's a minus. :P
I'll give a try, but I just don't see me overcoming all those bad experiences with really bad groups to like a Living FR.
That really sucks. I appears that my RPGA days are numbered. I never could stand the FR setting. I always struck me as a very poorly managed world, not to mentioned poorly designed. On the plus side, a majority of the Greyhawk groups I have playe
So they are killing...everything. Just as Xendrix expeditions was getting to the peak of fun...
Xen'drik has always been a D&D campaign - they always have a 2 year lifespan, I don't think they are killing it early (can't remember exactly when it started so not 100% certain).
Kithran
Xen'drik has always been a D&D campaign - they always have a 2 year lifespan, I don't think they are killing it early (can't remember exactly when it started so not 100% certain).Kithran
Xen'drik has always been a D&D campaign - they always have a 2 year lifespan, I don't think they are killing it early (can't remember exactly when it started so not 100% certain).
It was Xendrik's time to end. It started at Gen Con last year and the D&D campaigns have two year lifespans. IIRC, there were preview events at Origins 2006.
Ed
It was Xendrik's time to end. It started at Gen Con last year and the D&D campaigns have two year lifespans. IIRC, there were preview events at Origins 2006.Ed
Sorry people, but two LG DMs at GENCON seemed to think that this was the last hurrah for LG, and that it would not be returning. Glad that I spent money and time this weekend to get excited about advancing an LG character that was obsolete before I gave them my money in May!
Sorry people, but two LG DMs at GENCON seemed to think that this was the last hurrah for LG, and that it would not be returning. Glad that I spent money and time this weekend to get excited about advancing an LG character that was obsolete before I
Sorry people, but two LG DMs at GENCON seemed to think that this was the last hurrah for LG, and that it would not be returning.
Only two DMs thought that? Weren't more paying attention during the RPGA member's meeting when it was announced that LG would premier its last adventures at Origins next year?
Huh.
:angelhide
Only two DMs thought that? Weren't more paying attention during the RPGA member's meeting when it was announced that LG would premier its last adventures at Origins next year?Huh.:angelhide
Will the servers at WotC be able to handle it when the gaming boards open up. OR will they do what they did at the debut and crash like Buster in a Chinese rocket chair?
Also could more than one PC be run per account at the same time?
Example: You have a group where the DM is on vacation or a business trip and the players are at home and they decided to set up an organized play session. Could the players at home all use one computer and one account to run all the characters in the virtual gaming table? Or are the accounts going to be limited to one PC per account at one time?
Will the servers at WotC be able to handle it when the gaming boards open up. OR will they do what they did at the debut and crash like Buster in a Chinese rocket chair?Also could more than one PC be run per account at the same time?Example:You have
Having lived through Living City 3e conversion, several LG 3.5 conversions I can say without a doubt... forget it. Just restart everything from 0. Otherwise it is a royal pain in the butt.
Too true I still have a binder with 3 fed ex envelopes stuffed with certs to convert my PCs. More then a few years in an organized play campaign people will know the game too well and it becomes math and power gaming not role-playing.
Too true I still have a binder with 3 fed ex envelopes stuffed with certs to convert my PCs. More then a few years in an organized play campaign people will know the game too well and it becomes math and power gaming not role-playing.
I can't seem to find any information online about D&D Experience 2008. There is no page at RPGA, or anywhere on Wizards.com, and every citation I see about it says "February 2008" with no specifics.
Is this information available yet? Can it be posted somewhere prominent? Thanks.
I can't seem to find any information online about D&D Experience 2008. There is no page at RPGA, or anywhere on Wizards.com, and every citation I see about it says "February 2008" with no specifics.Is this information available yet? Can it be poste
D&D Experience is the last weekend in February, 2008. It is at the same place it was last year (a hotel near the Reagan National Airport in Washington D.C.
It's kind of a funky place for a convention, but I went last year and had a blast. I would highly recommend it for folks interested in a weekend of D&D related gaming.
--sam
D&D Experience is the last weekend in February, 2008. It is at the same place it was last year (a hotel near the Reagan National Airport in Washington D.C.It's kind of a funky place for a convention, but I went last year and had a blast. I would hi
So far, the only thing I've see advertised for D&D Experience 2008 is the dates for it.... February 28 – March 2, 2008.
At D&D Experience 2008, you’ll be able to get your first full-on play of D&D 4th Edition in its final form. This will come in the form of preview adventures for the next Living campaign – Living Forgotten Realms!
So far, the only thing I've see advertised for D&D Experience 2008 is the dates for it.... February 28 – March 2, 2008.At D&D Experience 2008, you’ll be able to get your first full-on play of D&D 4th Edition in its final form. This will c
As i want to continue playing my established characters and like the living model, i will think about playing Living Greyhawk only and not play any other campaign.
This will up the playnumbers for LG and keep LFR down by just me.
IMHO only this is an argument that can sway management.
This is a call for taking all the play opportunities that present themselves with your LG characters.
As i want to continue playing my established characters and like the living model,i will think about playing Living Greyhawk only and not play any other campaign.This will up the playnumbers for LG and keep LFR down by just me.IMHO only this is an ar
I really do hope that online play is an option for the new Living campaign. I've been interested in the living campaigns for years, but never had the opportunity to join one. If I could play Living Forgotten Realms online, that $10/month for the online initiative seems more palatable. Not to mention levaraging the online system seems to make a heck of alot more sense than using paper certs and such.
I really do hope that online play is an option for the new Living campaign. I've been interested in the living campaigns for years, but never had the opportunity to join one. If I could play Living Forgotten Realms online, that $10/month for the on
I really do hope that online play is an option for the new Living campaign. I've been interested in the living campaigns for years, but never had the opportunity to join one. If I could play Living Forgotten Realms online, that $10/month for the online initiative seems more palatable. Not to mention levaraging the online system seems to make a heck of alot more sense than using paper certs and such.
You know, they've said the Dungeon & adventures will be directly pluggable into the virtual tabletop. I wonder if they can, or will, do that with the RPGA adventures.
You know, they've said the Dungeon & adventures will be directly pluggable into the virtual tabletop. I wonder if they can, or will, do that with the RPGA adventures.
I am definitely interested in hearing more about Living Forgotten Realms and other sanctioned RPGA D&D4 campaigns as soon as possible, but what I am REALLY excited about is the stated potential for play rewards for simple home play.
I am definitely interested in hearing more about Living Forgotten Realms and other sanctioned RPGA D&D4 campaigns as soon as possible, but what I am REALLY excited about is the stated potential for play rewards for simple home play.
You know, they've said the Dungeon & adventures will be directly pluggable into the virtual tabletop. I wonder if they can, or will, do that with the RPGA adventures.
My understanding is the D&D Gameday in November will have some small clues about 4e. One important one is that it will have the first D&D Minis stat card which should have 4e stats on one side.
--sam
My understanding is the D&D Gameday in November will have some small clues about 4e. One important one is that it will have the first D&D Minis stat card which should have 4e stats on one side.--sam
I would like to see Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Eberron and at least the framework of other owned realms, like Ravenloft or Planescape perhaps with integrated storylines connected via Spelljammers or Teleport(als) at high level play.
I would like to see a high level campaign overall in fact. Since there's not a "sweet spot" at mid-level anymore I would like to see (and play and DM) world shaping characters struting their stuff.
I would like to see Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Eberron and at least the framework of other owned realms, like Ravenloft or Planescape perhaps with integrated storylines connected via Spelljammers or Teleport(als) at high level play. I would like to
This is my wish for 4E Organized Play...have a D&D Campaigns (the two year story campaign with level bumps, etc) featuring a non-standard campaign setting, like Dark Sun or Ravenloft, and support it with D&D Insider articles. There is no huge product commitment for the settings (they wouldn't necessarily have to release campaign sourcebooks, just enough articles to provide details for the campaign) and they could test out the popularity of the settings, new rules, etc in a time-limited format, moving on to something else relatively quickly.
Rob Little
This is my wish for 4E Organized Play...have a D&D Campaigns (the two year story campaign with level bumps, etc) featuring a non-standard campaign setting, like Dark Sun or Ravenloft, and support it with D&D Insider articles. There is no huge produc
This is my wish for 4E Organized Play...have a D&D Campaigns (the two year story campaign with level bumps, etc) featuring a non-standard campaign setting, like Dark Sun or Ravenloft, and support it with D&D Insider articles.
To this I must say . . . Brilliant!
I would happily deal with the bother of the D&D Campaigns level-bump campaign for one set in Dark Sun.
To this I must say . . . [SIZE="3"]Brilliant![/SIZE]I would happily deal with the bother of the D&D Campaigns level-bump campaign for one set in Dark Sun.
I am interested to see how the new regional system will work out for the Living FR Campaign. All we have gotten is that there will be fewer regions (at least in North America). Also that every place in the world will be part of a region from the get go, making this a global campaign.
I do hope that the regional system will continue to create materials that can only be played in the region. For those people extremely active in LG, their region became their identity and their play styles often reflected which region they came from. Traveling from region to region became part of the LG lifestyle I would hate to see the convention circuit ruined by making everything available anywhere. I know that our small con is about 30% people who have traveled from out side of the region. When going to even larger cons like Weekend in Dyvers it seems easily at least 50% of the attendee's traveled from out side the region.
Also I hope they are considering starting to create rewards cards that will be usable in the 4e Campaigns. It would be nice for those rewards mailings to start in the summer next year before gencon. No sense in receiving rewards cards for a campaign that will be finished. I would suggest that the first few cards are things like... masterwork sword!, Masterwork Armor! Second wind is a fantastic card for low level people. So are creation cards but since very little will be out when the campaign starts there isn't much content to refer to.
Administration will be difficult as well. It is always a tricky balance of having enough volunteers to do the work and keeping the work down to an acceptable level so as not to burn out volunteers. I think having fewer regions will help in general. With say 6 regions in North America I would suggest One global admin per 6 regions, and in each region (which are larger than current regions) 4 administrators. There were about 20 regions in North America alone. So I would expect a reduction to at least 10 if not closer to 6 regions. That reduction creates a much smaller administration team but in the end will do approximately as much work as current triad in regions (IE each region offering 6-8 modules a year). Except there will be far more travel in these new large regions. It will be interesting to see if there will be meta-regional events.
I'm interested to see how this will effect the player groups. It seems to me that in location in LG where there is a Triad (or within 2 hours drive) there is a stronger play presence and a more active community. Leadership is easily accessible and there is at least one connected person trying to keep things running via conventions or game days. People who are several states away become rather disenfranchised with ruling triad members when they have never seen them. For example it is easily a 12 hour drive from one side of our region to another. The people furthest away often feel neglected. This is a tough battle to overcome that will only increase to become difficult with larger territories.
I am interested to see how the new regional system will work out for the Living FR Campaign. All we have gotten is that there will be fewer regions (at least in North America). Also that every place in the world will be part of a region from the get
I guess my concern is that if RPGA does go online, how will that effect GM levels. Will it count as a home game? Game day or what? Seeing as I would be a lot more comfortable running games online than driving a few hours, taking days off of work and going by myself to these conventions. I've avoided a lot of organized play because of that (also a fairly bad experience with some local RPGA players). How it's counted is important to level upkeep, and in a few months I'll be thinking about going up from Master and will need some more work under my belt. Also, how would reward cards be handled with the online aspect? Will they have a code on them to verify them into the new system as well?
I guess my concern is that if RPGA does go online, how will that effect GM levels. Will it count as a home game? Game day or what? Seeing as I would be a lot more comfortable running games online than driving a few hours, taking days off of work and
Reconsider allowing 3-7 Players (+GM) to make a table. Currently, 4 people can’t play (even with a cohort) and having 8 people forces someone to be excluded.
Consider allowing some (but not all) regional adventures to be playable outside the region. Perhaps require that the GM be from the region.
Since the next batch of RPGA Rewards Cards comes out in ~4 months, please make most of them 4e compatible.
I wish you wouldn't kill LG. It'll take some convincing for the local group to play LFR - we'll probably play Paizo's Pathfinder or some other Home Game Adventure Path instead.
Reconsider allowing 3-7 Players (+GM) to make a table. Currently, 4 people can’t play (even with a cohort) and having 8 people forces someone to be excluded.Consider allowing some (but not all) regional adventures to be playable outside the re
I was not favorably impressed at WoTC's computer expertise to handle the traffic after the 4E announcement.
If they can't do that relatively simple task how can they expect to do the online gaming?
As for Living Greyhawk, why not just allow folks to convert to 4E based on XP? Most have a lot of time invested in their PCs.
We'll have to wait and see how things develop.
I was not favorably impressed at WoTC's computer expertise to handle the traffic after the 4E announcement.If they can't do that relatively simple task how can they expect to do the online gaming?As for Living Greyhawk, why not just allow folks to co
I was not favorably impressed at WoTC's computer expertise to handle the traffic after the 4E announcement.
If they can't do that relatively simple task how can they expect to do the online gaming?
As for Living Greyhawk, why not just allow folks to convert to 4E based on XP? Most have a lot of time invested in their PCs.
We'll have to wait and see how things develop.
Think about it, the website administration and the people coding the online game tables are probably completely different people. Plus revenue from the online gaming will fund the equipment to handle it. I know the people who are programing for Gleemax, and I know they know how to handle online game tables for board games.
Think about it, the website administration and the people coding the online game tables are probably completely different people. Plus revenue from the online gaming will fund the equipment to handle it. I know the people who are programing for Gleem
I am definitely interested in hearing more about Living Forgotten Realms and other sanctioned RPGA D&D4 campaigns as soon as possible, but what I am REALLY excited about is the stated potential for play rewards for simple home play.
I have actually been wondering about that myself since I saw the presentation that announced 4e. It sounded like there was going to be more than simply the RPGA in terms of organized play. I don't imagine they can do anything like D&D miniatures or Magic, so I'm wondering how it is going to be set up.
With Gleemax and D&D Insider, I think there is a lot of opportunity to enhance the tools and presence of whatever organized play they have outside and inside of the RPGA as well. It should be interesting to see how they integrate all four of the pillars that were mentioned for D&D fourth edition.
I have actually been wondering about that myself since I saw the presentation that announced 4e. It sounded like there was going to be more than simply the RPGA in terms of organized play. I don't imagine they can do anything like D&D miniatures or
This is my wish for 4E Organized Play...have a D&D Campaigns ... and they could test out the popularity of the settings, new rules, etc in a time-limited format, moving on to something else relatively quickly.
Agreed. This does sound brilliant. Has anyone heard anything about the so-called rewards system that will be in place? Discount on DDI? Points to buy cool avatars or online stuff? Any thoughts?
Agreed. This does sound brilliant. Has anyone heard anything about the so-called rewards system that will be in place? Discount on DDI? Points to buy cool avatars or online stuff? Any thoughts?
I'd be interested in seeing some sort of Living Planescape. Especially with some of the events that have come about during 3e (For example, the death of the Hag Countess).
Ok I don't know what the death of the Hag Countess is but I could almost kiss you for mentioning a "Living Planescape."
I would love it if the D&D worlds were connected by this online play thingy!
Ok I don't know what the death of the Hag Countess is but I could almost kiss you for mentioning a "Living Planescape."I would love it if the D&D worlds were connected by this online play thingy!
I have actually been wondering about that myself since I saw the presentation that announced 4e. It sounded like there was going to be more than simply the RPGA in terms of organized play.
It is worth noting that the comment could have been completely off-the-cuff and meant to refer only to making it easier to participate in the usual sort of Organized Play, but that's not how I took it.
It is also worth noting that having an online play system would make tracking accomplishments and awarding points for "home" games much easier -- or rather, possible -- for the RPGA...
It is worth noting that the comment could have been completely off-the-cuff and meant to refer only to making it easier to participate in the usual sort of Organized Play, but that's not how I took it.It is also worth noting that having an online pla
A few general comments of things which I think need to be 'tightened up' if organised play is to have a more significant role in the 4e era:
1) Correct the various errors/out of date information which the RPGA disseminates. Most notable of this is the reference to rpgahq@wizards.com and rpgagm@wizards.com which no-longer work. The email sent after sanctioning an RPGA event, for instance, needs re-writing and appearing to come from a different, valid, email address. Similarly, the placeholder file for LFR adventures must not be a simple copy of the placeholder for regional LG adventures, which is woefully out of date and refers to non-existent websites.
2) Dramatically improve the communication flow between RPGA HQ and members. The participation of Chris and Ian on the messageboards is a great deal better now than it has been in the past, but there are still a ridiculous number of reports of emails to rpgasanctioning@wizards.com going un-acknowledged. The solution for this is likely to only be possible if the budget for the RPGA extends to employing more staff - a couple of dedicated customer service reps who develop a good working relationship with Chris and Ian is probably the minimum to ensure that the expectation of members is met: Wizards wants organised play to be an important part of 4e and the more that it says that, the more people will expect that if things are reported incorrectly or files are not available for download, or new members can't log in to the members' area that these problems are acknowledged when they are reported and fixed within a considerably faster timeframe than is common at the moment.
(Note that this isn't a criticism of the current RPGA staff - I'd far rather that Chris and Ian get on with their current jobs and not get distracted by replying to emails saying "we got your email, we'll get it fixed tomorrow," or whatever, but there needs to be someone who sends that email back to the RPGA member if people are to feel confident that the RPGA is fit for purpose.)
A few general comments of things which I think need to be 'tightened up' if organised play is to have a more significant role in the 4e era:1) Correct the various errors/out of date information which the RPGA disseminates. Most notable of this is the
It is also worth noting that having an online play system would make tracking accomplishments and awarding points for "home" games much easier -- or rather, possible -- for the RPGA...
This would be good actually-- I tried awhile back to run a home game for the RPGA (Mark of Heroes actually), but it was so much trouble trying to get my players up and running with IDs and actually report the gameplay that I eventually gave up on it. If signing up for Gleemax (since D&D Insider will be a pay service) actually also automatically gave you an RPGA membership that you just need to activate online, that would be great.
This would be good actually-- I tried awhile back to run a home game for the RPGA (Mark of Heroes actually), but it was so much trouble trying to get my players up and running with IDs and actually report the gameplay that I eventually gave up on it.
My gaming group would just be happy if we could earn great SWAG by promoting the game that we enjoy to all of our friends.
I wonder how 4e will interact with the D&D Game Day?
Easier tracking of characters is a bonus.
Is it not true that Knights of the Dinner Table foretold of the coming of character registration in one of the storylines? Something to the effect that the players "sold" their characters for real $$ so they could afford new characters. Someone help me out here.
My gaming group would just be happy if we could earn great SWAG by promoting the game that we enjoy to all of our friends.I wonder how 4e will interact with the D&D Game Day?Easier tracking of characters is a bonus.Is it not true that Knights of the
I was wondering here in Europe we don't really have organized play for D&D. What is it? I mean how can you do this. As far as I have played D&D its some thing you do with your friends.
I was wondering here in Europe we don't really have organized play for D&D. What is it? I mean how can you do this. As far as I have played D&D its some thing you do with your friends.
I am interested to see how the new regional system will work out for the Living FR Campaign. All we have gotten is that there will be fewer regions (at least in North America). Also that every place in the world will be part of a region from the get go, making this a global campaign.
I do hope that the regional system will continue to create materials that can only be played in the region. For those people extremely active in LG, their region became their identity and their play styles often reflected which region they came from. Traveling from region to region became part of the LG lifestyle I would hate to see the convention circuit ruined by making everything available anywhere. I know that our small con is about 30% people who have traveled from out side of the region. When going to even larger cons like Weekend in Dyvers it seems easily at least 50% of the attendee's traveled from out side the region.
I like the region idea and it did work in LG, but that doesn't mean that it can't be improved.
Match the regions to territories in a fairer way: in LG, Michigan gamers got the whole Kingdom of Furyondy while the gamers in the UK got Onnwal. Onnwal has one town of 4,500 population and even that's under occupation.
Make the regions smaller, not bigger: It would be more work, but the language barrier does put a limit on cross region gaming in Europe, is there any reason why Britain can't get somewhere like the Dragon Coast and split in into six to ten sub-regions so we can have more cross-region gaming.
Incorporate online gaming to the region structure: DMs should only be able to run games in their own region but players ought to be able to play in any region without penalties. Make the out of region penalty apply to individual characters (eg, I live in the Westgate sub-region of the Dragon Coast and DM there, but also have a character in Luskan that I play online, the Luskan character shouldn't have a penalty when playing in Luskan, but should if I play him in a convention in the Dragon Coast area)
I like the region idea and it did work in LG, but that doesn't mean that it can't be improved.Match the regions to territories in a fairer way: in LG, Michigan gamers got the whole Kingdom of Furyondy while the gamers in the UK got Onnwal. Onnwal ha
I like the region idea and it did work in LG, but that doesn't mean that it can't be improved.
Match the regions to territories in a fairer way: in LG, Michigan gamers got the whole Kingdom of Furyondy while the gamers in the UK got Onnwal. Onnwal has one town of 4,500 population and even that's under occupation.
Honestly, I could see Living Forgotten Realms breaking up the game on a much more global basis given the various continents that exist there and whether Wizards of the Coast has a large enough following in some of the other areas of the world. Rather than stretching Faerun across the entire world, you could have Faerun being North America and Europe, the Hordelands could be Russia, Al-Quadim could be the Middle East and Africa, Kara-Tur could be China, India, Japan, and Southeast Asia, and Maztica could be South America.
If they did it that way, we might even get some support for some of these other realms in the Forgotten Realms.
Honestly, I could see Living Forgotten Realms breaking up the game on a much more global basis given the various continents that exist there and whether Wizards of the Coast has a large enough following in some of the other areas of the world. Rathe
I was wondering here in Europe we don't really have organized play for D&D. What is it? I mean how can you do this. As far as I have played D&D its some thing you do with your friends.
Thadir, Organized Play for D&D has taken two different courses.
One is tournament play like the D&D Open at GenCon. In these events, you play pre-made characters and you have a defined goal to achieve in your 4 hour time slot. Another off-shoot of this is pre-made characters designed to interact in a more role-heavy setting. These adventures also have a defined goal for each character, but the goal can be acheived through roleplay instead of through killing the enemy.
The second style of Organized Play is the Living campaigns. This is where the campaign setting is divided into parts, depending on your real world geographic location. In this setup, you have local people that are elected or chosen to coordinate the creation and distribution of adventures that are tied to that geographic location in the campaign setting. So... if your geographic location is Verbobonc in Greyhawk... you play all your adventures there... and all the adventures generally tie together to form a story arc. Since everyone is playing the same adventures, you are all involved with the story.
That's the short version... I'm sure someone can come along and give a more detailed (and probably better) version. LOL
--sam
Thadir,Organized Play for D&D has taken two different courses. One is tournament play like the D&D Open at GenCon. In these events, you play pre-made characters and you have a defined goal to achieve in your 4 hour time slot. Another off-shoot of
There is quite a lot of organised play for D&D in the Netherlands - in fact I believe that the Living Greyhawk campaign administrator who is responsible for the European regions is Dutch (Pieter Slijpen). If you search for 'Sunndi' and 'Living Greyhawk' you'll find links to the Dutch groups which play Living Greyhawk - and through them you might find other organised play campaigns, both RPGA and independent.
There is quite a lot of organised play for D&D in the Netherlands - in fact I believe that the Living Greyhawk campaign administrator who is responsible for the European regions is Dutch (Pieter Slijpen). If you search for 'Sunndi' and 'Living Greyha
Honestly, I could see Living Forgotten Realms breaking up the game on a much more global basis given the various continents that exist there and whether Wizards of the Coast has a large enough following in some of the other areas of the world. Rather than stretching Faerun across the entire world, you could have Faerun being North America and Europe, the Hordelands could be Russia, Al-Quadim could be the Middle East and Africa, Kara-Tur could be China, India, Japan, and Southeast Asia, and Maztica could be South America.
I think that would be a great idea, but I would love Wizards to come up with a specifically Indian-style setting and there's some spectacular fantasy movies coming out of there. Quick, someone tell Hasbro how many people there are in India
I think that would be a great idea, but I would love Wizards to come up with a specifically Indian-style setting and there's some spectacular fantasy movies coming out of there. Quick, someone tell Hasbro how many people there are in India :)
1) Reconsider the termination of Living Greyhawk. If it has to be shut down for a few years, at least allow it return with a regional system that is very similar to what we have now.
2) Compile all of the LG canon from the 8+ years of the campaign. The quantity of this material is enormous, and might exceed all of the FR material ever published in sheer word count. Between the mods, the narratives, and the regional documents, there is plenty of material to be used to advance the campaign setting from CY 591 to CY 598+. Learn from the IP challenges that will occur with the production of this book.
3) Show that all of the work done by the LG community was important and release a new Greyhawk Campaign Setting that incorporates LG canon. Unlike the LGG, please produce this as a hardcover book with high production values. Don't be afraid to produce a 400+ page book, but remember that the sooner that its produced, the better it will sell.
4) Allow this new book to be the launch for the 4E LG that starts in CY 601.
5) Produce a new hardcover Greyhawk book every 3-5 years that incorporates the developments in Living Greyhawk.
6) Finally, embrace the fact that WotC has two campaigns, FR and Ebberon, that are driven from the top down, and that it has one very popular setting in Greyhawk that is driven from the fan base on up.
=============================
D&D Campaign set in Western Oerik
Little has been done with Western Oerik. I believe that a 2 year D&D style campaign, designed with the input of Greyhawk gurus like Jason Bulmahn, Gary Holian, James Jacobs, and Erik Mona would hold over Greyhawk fans for a while.
=============================
Manage Expectations
It was not widely expected that LG would end this suddenly. Yes its been mentioned that the Triads were working on three year story arcs that would conclude in 2008. There were also many other signs that the end of LG was no where in sight.
The region of Ratik was (re)started recently in the middle of this "final" three year story arc. Did the volunteers for Ratik know that they were building something that would soon be ended?
The Triad for my home region of Keoland has been aggressively releasing mods in order to be awarded nine mod slots for 2008. This effort was for naught.
Character creation cards were released for LG twice in 2007. Yes we get to play Snow Elves and Kobolds, but not for long.
The effort to manage expectations not only saves those in charge headaches, but its good customer service. Its shows respect.
[SIZE="3"] Living Greyhawk[/SIZE]1) Reconsider the termination of Living Greyhawk. If it has to be shut down for a few years, at least allow it return with a regional system that is very similar to what we have now.2) Compile all of the LG canon fro
You know, as time moves on, and the end of Living Greyhawk looms in the future, I'm getting decidedly more entrenched in the fact that I don't want to play LF. There still appears to be behind the scenes shenanigans about Greyhawk. Wizards is really dropping the ball....
You know, as time moves on, and the end of Living Greyhawk looms in the future, I'm getting decidedly more entrenched in the fact that I don't want to play LF. There still appears to be behind the scenes shenanigans about Greyhawk. Wizards is reall
1) Reconsider the termination of Living Greyhawk. If it has to be shut down for a few years, at least allow it return with a regional system that is very similar to what we have now.
2) Compile all of the LG canon from the 8+ years of the campaign. The quantity of this material is enormous, and might exceed all of the FR material ever published in sheer word count. Between the mods, the narratives, and the regional documents, there is plenty of material to be used to advance the campaign setting from CY 591 to CY 598+. Learn from the IP challenges that will occur with the production of this book.
3) Show that all of the work done by the LG community was important and release a new Greyhawk Campaign Setting that incorporates LG canon. Unlike the LGG, please produce this as a hardcover book with high production values. Don't be afraid to produce a 400+ page book, but remember that the sooner that its produced, the better it will sell.
4) Allow this new book to be the launch for the 4E LG that starts in CY 601.
5) Produce a new hardcover Greyhawk book every 3-5 years that incorporates the developments in Living Greyhawk.
6) Finally, embrace the fact that WotC has two campaigns, FR and Ebberon, that are driven from the top down, and that it has one very popular setting in Greyhawk that is driven from the fan base on up.
=============================
D&D Campaign set in Western Oerik
Little has been done with Western Oerik. I believe that a 2 year D&D style campaign, designed with the input of Greyhawk gurus like Jason Bulmahn, Gary Holian, James Jacobs, and Erik Mona would hold over Greyhawk fans for a while.
=============================
Manage Expectations
It was not widely expected that LG would end this suddenly. Yes its been mentioned that the Triads were working on three year story arcs that would conclude in 2008. There were also many other signs that the end of LG was no where in sight.
The region of Ratik was (re)started recently in the middle of this "final" three year story arc. Did the volunteers for Ratik know that they were building something that would soon be ended?
The Triad for my home region of Keoland has been aggressively releasing mods in order to be awarded nine mod slots for 2008. This effort was for naught.
Character creation cards were released for LG twice in 2007. Yes we get to play Snow Elves and Kobolds, but not for long.
The effort to manage expectations not only saves those in charge headaches, but its good customer service. Its shows respect.
And this is the best post to date. Period. Genghis, hats off to you for a bunch of incredibly well-thought-out ideas. But we (Bissel) are still not rejoining the Empire....
And this is the best post to date. Period. Genghis, hats off to you for a bunch of incredibly well-thought-out ideas. But we (Bissel) are still not rejoining the Empire....
My gaming group would just be happy if we could earn great SWAG by promoting the game that we enjoy to all of our friends.
I wonder how 4e will interact with the D&D Game Day?
Easier tracking of characters is a bonus.
Is it not true that Knights of the Dinner Table foretold of the coming of character registration in one of the storylines? Something to the effect that the players "sold" their characters for real $$ so they could afford new characters. Someone help me out here.
You are correct. But because BA was delinquent on his updates to their characters, they sold them as name level characters, not the current low-level post level drained characters. This highlights a potential problem for doing everything online. DMs have to keep the information up to date and report sessions as soon as possible.
As a senior DM at a gameday, I try to keep everything up to date but it can be hard. If some game doesn't make, I might substitute another one on the fly so everyone can play. Except that I have to put in the order at least 3 weeks in advance. So I end up with too many gamedays on order. If my reporting was required for a character to level up so he can play in another apl bracket, the delay could be frustrating for the character.
I also tend to play things online so that I don't have to burn them. I've found out that you are at the mercy of the dm, who you never see, to get you your ars in a reasonable time. Some DMs are just flakes and you might never get your ars. Getting the flaky DMs to report things online may make things easier, but they are still just as likely to flake out as before and not report.
Getting errors fixed is also something the rpga doesn't do well at all. Some of my players can't login to the rpga website after repeated correspondence. I'm also still waiting on feedback of an error I made in reporting one my of a sessions.
The RPGA could greatly benefit from a help desk along the lines of ITIL (IT reference). You basically have one organization charged with taking the customers calls, creating documentation of the problem in the form of a ticket, and then making sure the ticket is worked on and resolved by the appropriate people.
Presently, the IT staff of WotC doesn't give me a lot of hope for their digital initiative and I hope that LR doesn't use a digital AR or cert unless they fix these problems.
Derek
P.S. I have almost every KODT ever published, but I don't want to go back through my collection to find the appropriate issue. I'm pretty sure I got the plot correct as I remember it.
You are correct. But because BA was delinquent on his updates to their characters, they sold them as name level characters, not the current low-level post level drained characters. This highlights a potential problem for doing everything online. D
I grew up on Greyhawk. Some might argue that this game is the reason I'm relatively sane.
Living Greyhawk was the realization of a dream that had fallen when TSR screwed up.
I never heard of Living City until late in it's career. I didn't care when I did hear about it because it wasn't Living Greyhawk.
For years I was one of the people pestering TSR to give up the Greyhawk name so that people who cared about the setting could continue developing it. The moral clarity, clear demographics, and an open future with a past adequately developed to build upon to create that future all are superior to Forgotten Realms.
Planescape was the only reason I was ever interested in Forgotten Realms because it opened up a pathway through the multiverse across Prime Material Planes...something which had already been established as possible, if yet undeveloped, in Greyhawk.
Now there is to be only Living Forgotten Realms?
Well, I spent a decade as part of an underground movement to establish Greyhawk as the premier role-playing game, and will continue to do so, but I could have been happier without the feeling of betrayal generated at GenCon.
I grew up on Greyhawk. Some might argue that this game is the reason I'm relatively sane.Living Greyhawk was the realization of a dream that had fallen when TSR screwed up.I never heard of Living City until late in it's career. I didn't care when I
But we (Bissel) are still not rejoining the Empire....
That's the thanks that we get after we just sent 5,000 troops to help you whoop some Kettite butt? Oh, you'll rejoin. We'll send a hundred kegs of Pemlo's Lambic to Thornward. The we'll send no more until you rejoin.
Russ...
Player of Thrak Crunkil from the Bright Lands who is a recipient of the Medal of Thornward for helping in its liberation from Evard.
That's the thanks that we get after we just sent 5,000 troops to help you whoop some Kettite butt? Oh, you'll rejoin. We'll send a hundred kegs of Pemlo's Lambic to Thornward. The we'll send no more until you rejoin.Russ...Player of Thrak Crunkil
Period. Throwing it out is a disservice to its players and all those that have volunteered to contribute so much to it. It says that the RPGA doesn't have any value for the work that has gone into it.
Its removal while it's still very viable destroys for me the greatest draw of the living system.. stability. Home campaigns fold left and right as people migrate for one reason or another causing you to start anew. LG had it's trade offs compared to a home campaign- it had character continuity issues, accounting headaches, and like limitations but what it delivered for all of this was stability. Everything else you could do with simple one-off modules where you could bring your own character into.
It's removal removes that stability from the playing field. If the RPGA removes LG for it's own reasons, then will certainly do so again with whatever they replace it with. Thus whatever the LFR (or however you abbreviate it) is able to deliver it *can't* deliver the main selling point that LG delivered to me...
Now the people I've met traveling across the states I'll continue to value. And some kind of medium for playing with them would be desirable. However I don't see any need for that to have anything to do with the RPGA.
For me that means putting more time into my Blackmoor Characters and spending my volunteering efforts there, rather than with the RPGA's campaign du jour. Personally I like to believe that the players should be appreciated... and this move is a clear statement that they don't mater.
-James
Period. Throwing it out is a disservice to its players and all those that have volunteered to contribute so much to it. It says that the RPGA doesn't have any value for the work that has gone into it.Its removal while it's still very viable destroy
Its removal while it's still very viable destroys for me the greatest draw of the living system.. stability.
Hmm, come to think about a related issue. Living Greyhawk was initially promoted as a campaign where the PCs could guide events with their successes and failures and leave an impact on the world. Well, clearly by terminating the campaign it effectively erases their accomplishments, there was no impact.
This is my biggest disappointment with the cancellation of Living Greyhawk. I have been pretty restrained in my upset and anger over it, even trying to tell others in posts on these forums and LG mailing lists that LFR will be cool. So pardon me a moment to express my bitterness over the matter . . . with Living FR coming I now know what "leaving an impact" on the world means to the RPGA. Its no different than a home campaign. When Living FR ends someday whatever players have done will likewise be erased and "forgotten" (pun not intended). That makes me sad.
That won't stop me from playing LFR, the opportunities through game days and conventions have been my only gaming opportunities for years now thanks to my past gaming groups disintegrating. I foresee RPGA's Living campaign, where ever it is set, being my only outlet so I'm rolling with it and trying to keep a bright outlook. And because I have a non-Intel mac, the DDI game table is off limits to me as well.
Hmm, come to think about a related issue. Living Greyhawk was initially promoted as a campaign where the PCs could guide events with their successes and failures and leave an impact on the world. Well, clearly by terminating the campaign it effective
Its removal while it's still very viable destroys for me the greatest draw of the living system.. stability. Home campaigns fold left and right as people migrate for one reason or another causing you to start anew.
Having played (and organized) for Living Greyhawk has given me a new perspective on my characters in various campaigns. Home campaigns come and go; when I play them I will dabble in creating this or that type of character. My LG characters, on the other hand, are My Characters, and I had expected them to remain my characters until they reached 15th level (the retirement age for LG). WOTC had given me every reason to expect that LG would continue long into the forseeable future.
The core plot arcs, Blight on Bright Sands two years back and Greyhawk Ruins coming out later this year, required or recommended starting new characters.
Campaign cards have been recently released that allow new character creation options.
A new high-level (16+) campaign for previously retired LG characters has begun.
Intro mods (1st-level characters only) continue to be released.
Granted, some of these signals are from the LG volunteer base rather than from the RPGA or WOTC. Still, I feel decieved about the future of LG. Many people have invested countless volunteer hours into organizing, administering, and writing for the Living Greyhawk campaign and now it seems it will all be for naught.
Please, Wizards of the Coast, reconsider the termination of the Living Greyhawk campaign. If we take it as a given that 4.0 rules will make conversion difficult or impossible (I don't see why - give a conversion for xp and gp totals and allow table judges to sign off on whether the new version of the character follows the spirit of the old one), then at the very least we can treat this as a reboot for the campaign.
Support LG in 3.5 until a new Gazeteer and LGCS can be compiled. Take the storylines laid down in modules (especially important BIs) from the past seven years and move them into canon. At a predetermined time, make all of our PCs into NPCs and restart everyone at 0 xp. At least this reboot will allow our actions (both as PCs in the campaign and players and organizers for the campaign) to have some impact on the future.
~Steve Illsley Former President, Greater Gainesville Gaming (G3) WiPoU 2006 Con Coordinator
Having played (and organized) for Living Greyhawk has given me a new perspective on my characters in various campaigns. Home campaigns come and go; when I play them I will dabble in creating this or that type of character. My LG characters, on the ot
Hmm, come to think about a related issue. Living Greyhawk was initially promoted as a campaign where the PCs could guide events with their successes and failures and leave an impact on the world. Well, clearly by terminating the campaign it effectively erases their accomplishments, there was no impact.
This is my biggest disappointment with the cancellation of Living Greyhawk. I have been pretty restrained in my upset and anger over it, even trying to tell others in posts on these forums and LG mailing lists that LFR will be cool. So pardon me a moment to express my bitterness over the matter . . . with Living FR coming I now know what "leaving an impact" on the world means to the RPGA. Its no different than a home campaign. When Living FR ends someday whatever players have done will likewise be erased and "forgotten" (pun not intended). That makes me sad.
That won't stop me from playing LFR, the opportunities through game days and conventions have been my only gaming opportunities for years now thanks to my past gaming groups disintegrating. I foresee RPGA's Living campaign, where ever it is set, being my only outlet so I'm rolling with it and trying to keep a bright outlook. And because I have a non-Intel mac, the DDI game table is off limits to me as well.
Well said. What WotC does not seem to get is that LG is so much more than playing opportunities. LFR will never be able to replace LG with the ability of the players to completely shape the world. LFR will simply be a generic cross between a living campaign and a D&D campaign.
WotC should do right by the tens of thousands of customers who play LG every year and preserve it.
Well said. What WotC does not seem to get is that LG is so much more than playing opportunities. LFR will never be able to replace LG with the ability of the players to completely shape the world. LFR will simply be a generic cross between a livin
Quote from "Inquest Gamer".. And yes, Wizards does recommend you begin new campaigns with Fourth Edition. “It’s not going to be as huge a jump,” as from Second Edition to Third Edition, said Slavicsek, “but there’s enough changing in the core system of how we are doing classes and races and characters that we’re not even gonna attempt it—we’re just telling you it’s better to start over.”
This does not sound good for Living Greyhawk at all. Considering its been far and away the most successful campaign the RPGA has ever run, the seemingly inevitable loss of LG will be a terrible terrible mistake.
And what of Greyhawk as a campaign setting?? I'm still reading through the thousands of posts that have been made in the last 24 hours, but I haven't seen anything definitive yet. I'm pessimistic, while still holding out hope.
I associate Forgotten Realms with bad writing, horrible plot holes, whiny dark-skinned emo elves, stupid Gandalf ripoffs, and everything else that causes people to think D&D players are weird.
That's why I think WotC is making the dumbest mistake they could make trying to kill Greyhawk.
I associate Forgotten Realms with bad writing, horrible plot holes,whiny dark-skinned emo elves, stupid Gandalf ripoffs, and everythingelse that causes people to think D&D players are weird.That's why I think WotC is making the dumbest mistake they c
I associate Forgotten Realms with bad writing, horrible plot holes, whiny dark-skinned emo elves, stupid Gandalf ripoffs, and everything else that causes people to think D&D players are weird.
To be fair, you could go through all of the LG adventures over the past seven years and find all of that and more. Except maybe the emo drow, that thankfully was treated mostly well.
To be fair, you could go through all of the LG adventures over the past seven years and find all of that and more. Except maybe the emo drow, that thankfully was treated mostly well. :)
A few general comments of things which I think need to be 'tightened up' if organised play is to have a more significant role in the 4e era:
1) Correct the various errors/out of date information which the RPGA disseminates. Most notable of this is the reference to rpgahq@wizards.com and rpgagm@wizards.com which no-longer work. The email sent after sanctioning an RPGA event, for instance, needs re-writing and appearing to come from a different, valid, email address. Similarly, the placeholder file for LFR adventures must not be a simple copy of the placeholder for regional LG adventures, which is woefully out of date and refers to non-existent websites.
2) Dramatically improve the communication flow between RPGA HQ and members. The participation of Chris and Ian on the messageboards is a great deal better now than it has been in the past, but there are still a ridiculous number of reports of emails to rpgasanctioning@wizards.com going un-acknowledged. The solution for this is likely to only be possible if the budget for the RPGA extends to employing more staff - a couple of dedicated customer service reps who develop a good working relationship with Chris and Ian is probably the minimum to ensure that the expectation of members is met: Wizards wants organised play to be an important part of 4e and the more that it says that, the more people will expect that if things are reported incorrectly or files are not available for download, or new members can't log in to the members' area that these problems are acknowledged when they are reported and fixed within a considerably faster timeframe than is common at the moment.
(Note that this isn't a criticism of the current RPGA staff - I'd far rather that Chris and Ian get on with their current jobs and not get distracted by replying to emails saying "we got your email, we'll get it fixed tomorrow," or whatever, but there needs to be someone who sends that email back to the RPGA member if people are to feel confident that the RPGA is fit for purpose.)
Two very brief points.
1) I second the motions in the quoted post.
2) The 4e threads are so packed I find it painful to read through all the posts.
Dave
Two very brief points.1) I second the motions in the quoted post.2) The 4e threads are so packed I find it painful to read through all the posts.Dave
2) The 4e threads are so packed I find it painful to read through all the posts.
I agree. I have unsubscribed to almost all of those over 10 pages long. There is no longer any useful information in them. I'm finding much more valuable discussion over on ENWorld's 4e forums.
I agree. I have unsubscribed to almost all of those over 10 pages long. There is no longer any useful information in them. I'm finding much more valuable discussion over on ENWorld's 4e forums.
First of all, I'd like to say I'm fond of this idea but hope it would be a precursor to a D&D MMORPG that isn't so limited and distant from D&D rules as the present Turbine creation.
In other threads along with normative suggestions for the subject matter, I mention that it would be a good idea to have official campaigns run by Wizards with a fee charged (anywhere from five dollars per game to a low graphics MMO charging up to fifteen dollars a month or more). This should be accompanied by character storage (on a secure offline server that only accepts changes visa vis normal txt files or other secure non-virally vulnerable system), and potential for effect on the overall campaign.
Of course I'm not certain of how much Wizards would want to put into such a thing but if fees and patronage are sufficient to merit games that permit influence on the world and sequential play of a non-redundant sort (no same adventures as everyone else), it might become very popular.
First of all, I'd like to say I'm fond of this idea but hope it would be a precursor to a D&D MMORPG that isn't so limited and distant from D&D rules as the present Turbine creation.In other threads along with normative suggestions for the subject ma
I agree. I have unsubscribed to almost all of those over 10 pages long. There is no longer any useful information in them.
And seconded again. I have a real job and real responsibilities, and I don't have time to sift through all the garbage. I'm sure there are some worthwhile thoughts in and about someplace, but mostly speculation has led to rabid conjecture which has turned to off-topic babble. Until more info is officially released, I'm reserving judgment. I am willing to play 4E and give it its due shot. I really want to test it out. I am trying to be cautiously optimistic about LFR, though I am saddened to see LG come to what seems a premature end. I never expected it to last forever (or even to have a "lasting impact" on an imaginary world--I can live with other epitaphs to my gravestone), but the way they have operated it the End does now seem abrupt and sudden. At Gencon they (the RPGA) seemed to suggest that they didn't know until the last hour it was going to happen. That suggests one of two things: a) they are lying, or b) there is a gross lack of communication. Neither is very comforting.
And seconded again. I have a real job and real responsibilities, and I don't have time to sift through all the garbage. I'm sure there are some worthwhile thoughts in and about someplace, but mostly speculation has led to rabid conjecture which has t
I agree. I have unsubscribed to almost all of those over 10 pages long. There is no longer any useful information in them. I'm finding much more valuable discussion over on ENWorld's 4e forums.
Pssst! I agree, too. But, please: Don't tell anyone here or they'll drown the ENWorld forums as well.
Pssst! I agree, too. But, please: Don't tell anyone here or they'll drown the ENWorld forums as well. :eek:
2: Sorry if a similar idea has already been posted, I don't have the patience to sift through all these posts.)
What I, personally would like to see, is some sort of "drop down" functionality that ties in the Online Game Table and either paid and published / RPGA modules.
For example, I'm running LFR1-01 "New Beginnings"...or whatever...I just choose it from a list, enter the code authorizing my running it by entering the code for the back of the printed mod or ordering it from the RPGA, and BLAMMO! There are the dungeons already constructed, there's the tray of minis needed for each encounter, and there are the handouts ready to, well, handout.
This could tremendously help speed up online play, although I'm not sure what kind of resources would need to be expended to make it work.
Thoughts?
(1: Cross posted for relevance2: Sorry if a similar idea has already been posted, I don't have the patience to sift through all these posts.)What I, personally would like to see, is some sort of "drop down" functionality that ties in the Online Game
What I, personally would like to see, is some sort of "drop down" functionality that ties in the Online Game Table and either paid and published / RPGA modules.
For example, I'm running LFR1-01 "New Beginnings"...or whatever...I just choose it from a list, enter the code authorizing my running it by entering the code for the back of the printed mod or ordering it from the RPGA, and BLAMMO! There are the dungeons already constructed, there's the tray of minis needed for each encounter, and there are the handouts ready to, well, handout.
This could tremendously help speed up online play, although I'm not sure what kind of resources would need to be expended to make it work.
Thoughts?
An excellent vision. But until the unpaid volunteer authors and administrators of Living campaigs are, well, paid . . . it will never happen. It's barely enough to get folks to devote their free time to cram ideas into a simple Word document and stick to layout style guidelines, write with clear grammar, present balanced challenges (for multiple party levels), offer appropriate treasure awards (for multiple party levels), and create clean stat blocks (for multiple party levels) all within a reasonable amount of time from the concept stage to the public file stage. Then playtest it as well as can be done. Plus, now with Living FR , apparently, there will be coordination with the novels line department. Throw in assembling everything also into the DDI Game Table environment is altogether another time abyss from people who are doing it all for free.
For all I know, WotC may be deciding to compensate RPGA's Living FR administrators financially for their hours of authoring, editing, cartography, etc. I doubt it highly!
An excellent vision. But until the unpaid volunteer authors and administrators of Living campaigs are, well, paid . . . it will never happen. It's barely enough to get folks to devote their free time to cram ideas into a simple Word document and stic
Throw in assembling everything also into the DDI Game Table environment is altogether another time abyss from people who are doing it all for free.
For all I know, WotC may be deciding to compensate RPGA's Living FR administrators financially for their hours of authoring, editing, cartography, etc. I doubt it highly!
Except that part of the functionality that the online tools are supposed to be provided are encounter builders, mapping tools, and other programs designed to make a DM or adventure builder's job easier. If they're doing all the work in the tools in the first place, it could be as simple as clicking "save" and then sending a file or a link over to Wizards of the Coast.
In fact, I could see that being a possible method of rewarding people for submitting adventures to the RPGA-- a credit for DDI.
Except that part of the functionality that the online tools are supposed to be provided are encounter builders, mapping tools, and other programs designed to make a DM or adventure builder's job easier. If they're doing all the work in the tools in
Except that part of the functionality that the online tools are supposed to be provided are encounter builders, mapping tools, and other programs designed to make a DM or adventure builder's job easier. If they're doing all the work in the tools in the first place, it could be as simple as clicking "save" and then sending a file or a link over to Wizards of the Coast.
If they want to exclude Mac and Linux users from authoring for or administrating the setting. Okay.
But I doubt highly that their online tools will be as robust as Word for collaborative authoring, editing, commenting, and layout. Because the files will need to be available for play to those at home, or convention, or game day play, the files must be available for printing by someone the files must be able to be converted to a downloadable format. I'm pretty sure those DDI tools for DMs are done in a proprietary client app. I don't think the RPGA wants to require members have the Windows-only client to be able to participate.
Balthanon wrote:
In fact, I could see that being a possible method of rewarding people for submitting adventures to the RPGA-- a credit for DDI.
Submitting adventures out of the blue is not something the RPGA wants to have happen and reward. That's why they have writing directors who sculpt and guide overarching stories for regions.
If they want to exclude Mac and Linux users from authoring for or administrating the setting. Okay.But I doubt highly that their online tools will be as robust as Word for collaborative authoring, editing, commenting, and layout. Because the files wi
Could it be that with the new approach to give PCs more to do that Greyhawk wouldn't be the same under the 4E system?
Of all of the Living Greyhawk gamers at Dragon*con this weekend only about 25% plan to go with a 4E Living Campaign. The rest are looking at moving on to Blackmoor. I think this is a significant statement that WotC needs to consider.
4E may be a very hard sell. Any mistakes in getting it released, including bugs with any of the gadgets, could be a problem that takes years to fix. Alienating your largest, most organized group of gamers isn't really getting off on the right foot. For every new gamer you bring in for 4E you could be losing 2-3 more experienced gamers. Keep Living Greyhawk for 3.5 until you can put out a 4E Living Greyhawk Campaign.
Could it be that with the new approach to give PCs more to do that Greyhawk wouldn't be the same under the 4E system?Of all of the Living Greyhawk gamers at Dragon*con this weekend only about 25% plan to go with a 4E Living Campaign. The rest are lo
For all I know, WotC may be deciding to compensate RPGA's Living FR administrators financially for their hours of authoring, editing, cartography, etc. I doubt it highly!
Actually they will HAVE to financially compensate writers, as they will need to fully own the material, not "borrow" it as they have been with LG. Now, will they compensate administrators for non-writing tasks (like editing, POC duties, etc)? That's another matter entirely.
Rob Little
Actually they will HAVE to financially compensate writers, as they will need to fully own the material, not "borrow" it as they have been with LG. Now, will they compensate administrators for non-writing tasks (like editing, POC duties, etc)? That'
Well, I am walking away at this point. I have paid for over 40 books to get into 3rd edition. I did not do so because I loved 3rd edition or felt it was needed, but because I was excited about the living greyhawk system and how it made gameplay somehow more tangible and permanent. No more fickle spats ruining the campaign, no more shallow story lines, no more over-built characters, or at least a minimal amount of them. 4e in my mind rings the death bell for LG as I know it. It will never be the grass roots home run campaign that it has always been. LG lives because of the efforts that we have put into it. From the long hours of triad volunteers to the writers, to the players and meta leaders. I think that honestly if they are to do away with LG, then the RPGA should give up all rights to it and it should become entirely non-copyrighted. The rules for 3.5 where they are necessary to continue on with LG would be free for us to use, and the 21 open sources and 40+ closed ones should be free for us to distribute in pdf format to new players and we will continue running LG as we always have with one notable difference. We, the players construct a website, the triad of each region is given access to it, and they centralize what we organize. This will allow us to maintain the integrity of LG without violating any copyright laws and without losing what we have all worked so hard to build. It doesn't really look as if WOTC is too interested in keeping it together anyway. Just my 2 cents...
Well, I am walking away at this point. I have paid for over 40 books to get into 3rd edition. I did not do so because I loved 3rd edition or felt it was needed, but because I was excited about the living greyhawk system and how it made gameplay someh
