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Hi Caligula,

Thanks for responding. I'm going to be using the recommended placing in the FR for RHoD, and my query was on what it's actually called. From looking at the most recent map of the Realms, it seems to me like 'The Misty Vale' is just a forest between the Wyrmbones and the Dun Hills. The actual area that is synonymous with Elsir Vale is called variously 'The Shaareach', 'Channath Vale', or on the latest map, nothing. Obviously, if you've decided to call it Misty Vale, that's all cool. Just thought I'd clarify my comment.

I too am going to do the SoG --> RHoD, but I thought it too much of a stretch to have the Red Hand influence go all the way up to Thar when all they're planning (atm) is domination of one little vale, not the whole world. So I'm going to move SoG to Channathgate and have Xul-Jarak be in the Rathgaunt Hills. (Which is not to belittle or criticize your choices.)

Thanks for letting me know about the intended levels (6-12). Are you certain the maps are correct and not the text? It was my understanding that where tables disagree with text, the latter is what you should defer to ... so I just assumed it would be the same with maps.[/quote]
Hi again Pukunui!

Sorry I misunderstood your question! Your choice seems excellent btw!

I just followed the instructions in RHoD and I used the name "Misty Vale" for simplicitys sake. You are correct on the names issue.

It´s also correct that usually the text should be considered just when it differs vs tables or other illustrations. But since the text was faulty regarding PC levels, I decided to go with the maps and it seems to work thus far.

If you really want to make sure you should ofcourse try and get a second and third opinion, since I´m not 100% sure.

Cool that you also decided to hook SoG - RHoD! It works excellent! as you can read in the beginning of my thread (above) I had the Orcs of Thar conspiring with the RHoD to actually try and conquor vast parts of Faerun´s centre. This was only the beginning. If the Orc tribes of Thar had indeed united under the Warlord Thrull, Melvaunt and the whole of the northern Moonsea region would be threatened. As would probably Shaar if RHoD could keep their army together. And that would not make the geographial distance that great anymore. Travelling over sea is much faster than overland.

Anyway, good luck and I hope to see some feedback from your later experiences!

Thanks for responding again, Caligula. I'm glad to hear that the map distances seem to be working out for you. I'll have a good look at the distance inconsistencies when it comes closer to the time that I'll be starting the adventure.

BTW, I can see how your tie-in between SoG and RHoD would work in that respect. I may have already mentioned this, but my other reason for moving SoG to the vale was so that my players will become more familiar with the area and - hopefully! - will gain some affection for the land and its people and will feel more inclined to save it when the opportunity arises. I'm also planning on running some short 'filler' adventures prior to SoG in the area as well.

I hope everything goes well at your next session, and I'm looking forward to reading all about it. Unfortunately my group has only just started, and as there are two noobs, I figured we'd better start from level 1, so it'll probably be many months before we get to SoG, let alone RHoD ... sigh! I am soo looking forward to RHoD. Despite it's little inconsistencies, it looks to be a truly awesome adventure.[/quote]
Well, if its any comfort I can guarantee you that SoG was an excellent experience! I have posted our experinces here at the "adventures" forum under the name "Sons of Gruumsh - Share your experiences!". We had so much fun playing that one!

We have only started RHoD but I have read through the whole thing and it looks awesome! My players are just about to move up to Vraath Keep and deal with Wyrmlord Koth and his squad. That will be one tough encounter!

I'm glad you liked SoG. I've read through it, and I think it makes for a good dungeon crawl / 'rescue' adventure ... but I have to say, there really wasn't much of an orc horde that I could see, despite what the blurb on the back cover says.

Also, how did you get your PCs into SoG? The beginning seems a bit contrived to me -- the PCs are supposed to start already having been contacted by Lord Nasher and they enter the city with passes he sent them ... but the missing scions have only been gone for 5 days, so the PCs must have been close by, and they must have been famous enough that Nasher would send for them when they're outside the city (rather than look for suitable rescuers within the city itself). I'm planning on having them be in the city (in this case, Channathgate) already, and have Lord Nasher hire them as soon as he figures out that his son isn't coming back.

In terms of linking SoG with RHoD, I was planning on replacing the Zhentil Keep emissaries with representatives of the Red Hand Horde. I was contemplating having one of the high wyrmlords from RHoD, but I'm not sure yet if that's a good idea or not.[/quote]
Pukunui, you keep getting back with good questions as you are very perceptive! I will try and answer them.

I had my players staying at an inn just outside of Melvaunt. Lord Woarsten Nanther sent out 2 of his closest men to find a group of seasoned adventurers and ofcourse my guys were chosen! I had the Nanther henchmen acting mysterious, not revealing to much information at first. They were hiding their faces in their hoods, talking of "sensitive matters that be best discussed in private". The PCs were brought to the residence of Lord Nanther and eventually briefed by the Lord himself. After that only a day of detective work took place before my guys set out to the north and Thar.

My players are very exoerincd and their PCs are quite tough, so I boosted some of the orcs and ogres in SoG. Added som equipment as potions and weapons. Remember that the entire citadel is surrounded by many orc tribes which probably constitutes hundreds if not thousands of orcs! I had my players sneaking through the area in the dense fog, but still describing all the noices of brawling, swordplay, and orc-feasting. My players also killed a couple of orcs that they bumped into in the fog, just prior to climbing the hill and the citadels walls. Even if my players managed to get up stealtihly they were later discovered and one hell of a battle took off! For more detailed info please see my other thread "Sons of Gruumsh - share your experiences!" here at the "Adventure"-thread!

Your idea of changing the Zhentarim emissaries is a good ide. I doubt Zhentarims would be that far south. However, I would probably recommend against having one of the key Wyrmlords there, as they are integral for the RHoD adventure. Your players might kill him too early you know! Why not leave a letter depicting some of the warplans for the region? That way your players will be ver curious in finding out more about the RHoD organization!

Thanks mate! Just trying to plan ahead and make it as believeable as possible for my troops. :D

Your ideas are pretty good, too. I'll have to go back and re-read the section of SoG where the PCs approach the citadel. I must have missed the thousands of orcs hiding in the mist ... lol.

I agree that I shouldn't use one of the Wyrmlords from RHoD. I was actually contemplating making a new one up -- so if the PCs kill him, it won't matter. But it would be better just to use some upper-echelon hobgoblins as emissaries, I think. They'll be there trying to convince Thrull to combine his army with the Red Hand Horde rather than strike out on his own.

I also just discovered the "Use This Book Tonight" web encounter that's linked on the RHoD product description page. It's just a little encounter with some Red Hand hobgoblins who are trying to convince an ogre to join them. I was thinking of running it around Nimon Gap (it seems to fit best there) as the PCs are heading towards Drellin's Ferry. It'll create one more connection to the Vale for the PCs and hopefully make them want to save it all the more.[/quote]
Well, the text is very abstract only mentioning that "orc tribes have gathered around the citadel to bear witness to Thrulls crowning of Orc Warlord". So you can adjust it to your own needs. However, remember that the Orc Warlord will unite all the orc tribes of Thar, so I should recommend you to make it awesome! I had my players hearing wardrums, loud noises from brawling and fighting orcs, etc.

Myself I´m planning for the Vraath Keep encounter. My players are set on going there next session and either kill or capture Wyrmlord Koth. Since my players killed all of the marauders (actually captured and interrogated one also!) and left none to report back to Koth, I´m actually planning to have Koth reinforcing his headquarters at Vraath Keep. The text describes the units at Vraath Keep as not being watchful, but I find that hard to believe considering the recent events and the situation as a whole. I will have them on alert and perhaps reinforcing with a couple of worgriders and hobgoblin regulars. I will also add a couple of simple magic items and potions. Wyrmlord Koth is after all an army commander and can easily require simple items as that. I will also add 1 Fighter level to Karkilan, the minotaur chief officer. I find it hard to believe that Wyrmlord Koth´s right hand man and an officer in a huge amry doesn´t even have a single level of fighter! I know this will raise the ECL of this encounter, but the first one was ECL 8 (the marauders) so I still think it´s inline with the story and the difficulty level.

Any comments on my propositions?

Those sound like reasonable adjustments, Caligula. Obviously I haven't gotten to the planning stage with RHoD (months away yet!), but I'll have to keep your thoughts in mind when I do, as I like the way you're going with them. It does make sense to have the guys at Vraath Keep more watchful -- after all, they should be full of excitement at the prospect of their impending invasion, not lolligagging about with boredom from being stuck in some remote outpost -- that would make more sense if they were just defending their homeland than if they were part of a gathering army. They should be restless and spoiling for a fight. And yes, Karkilan should be a bit beefer. Hopefully, though, none of your players will do what happened to that other guy who posted his RHoD experiences -- he said the party's rogue snuck in and killed Karkilan in his sleep.[/quote]
Hehe, I can promise you Pukunui that Karkilan will NOT be asleep when my players enter Vraath Keep...

As I see it the writer saw the Vraath Keep encounter as a potential death trap for the PCs so he scaled it down by having the soldiers off guard. I mean, operating like this behind enemy lines and NOT keeping guardposts is just rubbish. It really lowers the in-game reality. So that´s the main reason for me changing things so it seems more logic. Another reason is ofcourse the fact that the marauders who are supposed to cut off the traderoute into Drellins Ferry were completely eliminated by the PCs. Wyrmlord Koth would ofcourse increase his forces at Vraath Keep AND post extra guards after that. Remember that he keeps getting intelligence reports from his marauders and scouts, so he would immediately know that his men were killed when the reports stopped coming in.

I prefer in-game reality to meta-gaming. I will do my adjustments as I see them as logic consequences to my players actions.

Too bad you´re not playing RHoD yet for a couple of months! Must be tough having to wait...But I guess Sons of Gruumsh can still your hunger for now!