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Switch to Forum Live View The Fighter -- What are its flaws?
4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 4:31PM #41
Cheomesh
Date Joined: Dec 3, 2008
Posts: 1,030
Thanks for the links BK. I noticed the magic favoring myself, and my campaign setting was originally going to be a low-magic setting, but I figured that would be un-fun to play, so I cut that idea. Subsequently, it allowed me to have a less "plausable" time line explainable by magic. They even had flight at one point, though the one place who had complete control on that blew up. I'm kind of writing wizards out of my setting, however, so maybe the magic would be less of a problem for my fighters. There are few magic-using enemies, normally just other wizards or sorcs at best, and I think the most "supernatural" enemy in terms of abilities is the imp. (Every creature origne in my campaign is explained, and it's hard to explain random wtfpwn critters)

Anti, I agree that feats are narrow, but they're sort of supposed to be, aren't they? Some are VERY specific though, increasing one or two skills by a few points, while others are more useful. I think the main issue is that we only get ONE every x levels, but I think this is because there simply were not many feats to begin with. I might just get myself a list of all the feats in various books and print them (a mate of mine gave me a bunch of PDF files for 3.0 and some 3.5 books a while back, which ToB is not amongst), and compile them into the ones I want and ones I don't want, and increase the frequency of feat gain. I've been wanting to do feat gain by training over leveling but that's been difficult to do.

M.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 5:11PM #42
navar100
Date Joined: Dec 1, 2006
Posts: 3,437
WOTC erred when making Feats in creating 3E by not having them scale with level. For example, the Weapon Focus/Specialization chain should have just been one feat that tags on a new ability based on your level, leading up to Weapon Mastery, etc. It would take some work, but many feat chains could be consolidated into one feat.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 5:44PM #43
Lycanthromancer
Date Joined: Dec 12, 2004
Posts: 2,085
Well, you could give fighters an initiator level, have the fighter choose all of his own skills (a total of 8 skills, maybe), grant 4+Int skill points, the ability to choose 1 good save, and give a feat every level (which can be any he qualifies for). He can also have the option of trading out heavy and medium armor proficiencies and tower shield proficiency with Weapon Finesse and an additional good save(?).

Voila. It's still a fighter, but has a lot more options (both in and out of battle, depending on what the player wants to pick).
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 6:11PM #44
ciaran
Date Joined: Apr 16, 2005
Posts: 2,892
I'l chime in with Navar as far as feat scaling. Its fine to have some static bonuses from certain feats, but others need to grow. Some feats do, but not so much those a fighter would take.

I think a couple skills useful outside of combat would be nice.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 7:14PM #45
dman11235
Date Joined: Jun 5, 2007
Posts: 2,717
Feats should be nice things that just augment your abilities. Nothing more, nothing less. This is why things like Weapon Finesse are so bad. Narrow? Broad? Maybe, maybe not. Doesn't matter. What matters is that they are useful, but not required, much like items should be. What a good feat does: augments a playstyle without making the play style possible (i.e. it should be possible without the feat, just probably not a good idea), and continues to benefit you throughout your career. Now, there are exceptions as with any rule, but that's a good general guideline. There might be some feats that ddefinitely give you something that you literally could not do before hand, but these things they allow you to do should NOT compose your playstyle.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 8:34PM #46
Cheomesh
Date Joined: Dec 3, 2008
Posts: 1,030
The weapon proficiencies are also a bit weird. It always struck me as very strange that I could suddenly learn the art of a longsword (or a bastard sword as they call it in Dnd 3.5) without ever touching one, or while dungeon crawling magically learn to fight with a buckler...or what DnD 3.5 "pretends" is a buckler.

M.
HEMA and History Student.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 8:54PM #47
Lycanthromancer
Date Joined: Dec 12, 2004
Posts: 2,085
It's assumed you've been practicing in your spare time. Granted, this doesn't always work (such as when you pick up Exotic Weapon Proficiency in the middle of nowhere, then pick up a bastard sword when you reach the next town). Cest la vie.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 9:30PM #48
Cheomesh
Date Joined: Dec 3, 2008
Posts: 1,030
Luckly I haven't had too many people trying to master a new weapon (base clases giving them what they want anyways) I guess. I think my next setting will be a tad stricter on that, maybe. It might also be a bit more weapon oriented, as this current one has had some sort of ability tacked onto many of the weapons I added.

M.

EDIT: One of the class features I thought of is called "Indes". It's derived from a word appearing in Johannes Liechtenauer's fetchbuch meaning "meanwhile". This class ability will be a level 1 ability allowing you to make an opposed (inititive?) check against an opponent attacking in melee. Winning means you can either chose to parry the blow and make an immediate disarm attempt, OR strike right away. Sounds a tad OTT for level 1, though. It would only apply to weapon you're proficient (focusing?) on.
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4 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2008 - 10:18AM #49
Otto_the_Bugbear
Date Joined: Jan 22, 2002
Posts: 839

navar100 wrote:

WOTC erred when making Feats in creating 3E by not having them scale with level. For example, the Weapon Focus/Specialization chain should have just been one feat that tags on a new ability based on your level, leading up to Weapon Mastery, etc. It would take some work, but many feat chains could be consolidated into one feat.


Several people have mentioned this or agreed with this idea.

Time for a little self-promotion. :D

Scaling Combat Feats

Scaling Non-Combat Feats

I can attest that they do indeed work in game. The biggest drawback is the DM having to keep an idea of what all a character is capable of with those feats. Especially when using the Fighter, which gets so many.

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4 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2008 - 11:41AM #50
Otto_the_Bugbear
Date Joined: Jan 22, 2002
Posts: 839
I'd like to see the question in this thread expanded to cover more than just the Fighter.

What are the top three flaws of each of the PH classes?
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