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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 8:41AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Jul 17, 2011
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My group purchased a ship last night. While writing up the starship sheet, the stats as calculated using the formulas listed in the 'vehicles' section of the core rulebook seemed to fall way short of those listed in the statblock for the ship (threshold, grapple, etc.). At first I wondered if it wasn't the fact that the ship is CL 10, but my group is level 2 (and thus it could be a disparity between my groups' skill level and the superior skill level of the ships' generic crew as represented in the statblock), but one or two of the stats didn't incorporate any player skills and still fell short.
The only other idea I had was to possibly include the stats presented in the ships statblock as a 'misc. bonus' in the calculations for the players' ship. I noticed that our ship sheets have a box for misc. bonuses in each stats formula, but I couldn't find any suggestion to do so in either of the books (CR or SotG).
An example of the problem:
The ships damage threshold as listed in the statblock is 77. Threshold formula is: Fort Defense + Size modifier + Misc bonus. I calculated the fortitude as 26 (10 + strength modifier [which I calculated as being 16 based on a strength score of 4]). So using the threshold formula, I came up with 16 (26 + -10 (colossal size modifier, no miscellaneous bonus applies that I could think of). 77 as listed in the statblock and 16 as calculated is a drastic difference. We ran into a similar problem with grapple, coming up with a huge disparity.
Thanks for any assistance.
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 10:30AM
#2
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- Here be Dragons next 100 km
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Two suggestions:
First, some more specific information, such as a page reference for the ship, would make it easier to check the math and see what's up.
Second, have you taken account of the modifications to the ship's stats based on its existing crew (see SECR page 174)?
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 10:37AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Jul 17, 2011
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The ship in question is the Corellian YT-2400 -- page 156 in SotG. I did look at the crew quality chart and I don't think that's the issue, or at least not exclusively (if I'm incorrectly accounting for the crew quality rules).
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 11:17AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
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Both threshold and grapple get a positive size mod(also the negative size mod only applies for ref, initiative, and pilot). You'll see the size mods when you look up the revelant section.
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 1:11PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Jul 17, 2011
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I'm aware of the size modifiers, though I didn't realize that grapple and threshold would be +10 rather than -10. Even so, that would put their threshold at 36 using the given formula (fort defense [which is 26] + size modifier, which I guess should be +10,). However, if I calculate teh fort defense with the strength score (42) rather than the strength modifier (16) which is what's listed in the formula on the vehicle sheet, that would give us 78 threshold versus the 77 in the statblock which is closer, but again that seems to be against the given formula, unless our vehicle sheets are inaccurate.
To the same end, their grapple would now be 2 (BAB; level 2 using the full BAB rule) + 16 (ship's strength modifier from a score of 42) + 10 for size modifier, for a total of 28 (versus the statblocks 37).
I'm fairly certain that I'm understanding the crew quality rules correctly, and I can't seem to find anything in either the SECR or SotG which accounts for these increases in threshold and grapple (and much lesser discrepancies in the defenses).
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 2:00PM
#6
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- Here be Dragons next 100 km
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Threshold uses different size modifiers than the ones listed on page 166 - those apply only to Reflex Defense, Initiative and Pilot checks.
The size modifiers for damage threshold are at the top of page 169, as part of the Hit Points section.
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 2:19PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Jul 17, 2011
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I see that part now, which clears up the issue with damage threshold. Still unclear as to how they came to +37 grapple though, any ideas?
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 2:36PM
#8
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- Here be Dragons next 100 km
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The Grapple rules on page 153 include the size modifiers for larger creatures, which apply equally to larger vehicles. Colossal gives you +20, then add the +16 bonus resulting from the YT-2400's Strength score of 42. There's still 1 point adrift somewhere, but I'm not going hunting for it right now.
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2 years ago ::
Aug 25, 2011 - 2:41PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Jul 17, 2011
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Alas, that makes sense. Thanks a lot, Mark!
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2 years ago ::
Aug 26, 2011 - 2:01PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Jul 30, 2003
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I'm aware of the size modifiers, though I didn't realize that grapple and threshold would be +10 rather than -10. Even so, that would put their threshold at 36 using the given formula (fort defense [which is 26] + size modifier, which I guess should be +10,). However, if I calculate teh fort defense with the strength score (42) rather than the strength modifier (16) which is what's listed in the formula on the vehicle sheet, that would give us 78 threshold versus the 77 in the statblock which is closer, but again that seems to be against the given formula, unless our vehicle sheets are inaccurate.
To the same end, their grapple would now be 2 (BAB; level 2 using the full BAB rule) + 16 (ship's strength modifier from a score of 42) + 10 for size modifier, for a total of 28 (versus the statblocks 37).
I'm fairly certain that I'm understanding the crew quality rules correctly, and I can't seem to find anything in either the SECR or SotG which accounts for these increases in threshold and grapple (and much lesser discrepancies in the defenses).
if has not been pointed out, Damage Threshold increases faster than grapple modifiers for size.
so a collosal ships DT bonus is +50, not +20. FYI.
My Blog, mostly about D&D. I imagine that Majestic Moose plays a more "A team" type game than most of us. By that I mean he allows his players to make tanks out of a backyard playground set since the players have more "fun" that way.
Actually I much prefer The Losers.Spoiler:
Show
When I and my friends sit down we want a game of heroic fantasy. Rare is the moment when I have cried out in a video game or RPG "that's unrealistic." (Unless there is no jump button. Seriously makes me mad, single handedly ruined the N64 zelda series for me, but that's a digression of a digression.)
I mean, we play games with the force in galaxies far, far away, with supernatural horrors, dragons and demi-gods, alternate cosmologies, etc.
Reality and it's effects hold little sway to what makes a Heroic fantasy game fun IMO.
Just repeat after me:
You are not a beautiful or unique snowflake.
You are not how much you've spent on WotC products.
You are not whatever RPG you play.
You are one of tens of thousands of people that spend money on a hobby.
You will not always get what you want
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