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I have been DM'ing LFR mods for our home group since Sept 2008. I have noticed that the level 7-10 mods do seem to take longer than the 4 hour playing time. Is this just me, or has anyone else noticed this?

We just played CORM 1-4 (All the Kings Men), oon Friday night last, and whoo! We started about 8:30, and by 1:15 I called an end to the last encounter. Now, I know that's only 4.75 hours, but if I hadn't called it over, I think we would've been there another hour.

Compariing my experiences with the lower level mods, it just seems to me I nearly always get done in the 4 hours, but with the 7-10 mods, it has always puished 5 hours. The other table took 5+ hours to even get to the last encounter.

However, thier makeup was much less balanced. (4 strikers & 2 defenders vs. 1 striker, 2 defenders, 2 leaders, & 1 controller) They simply gave up on the last encounter, when the BBEG began to fly past the range of thier attacks.

Truth be told, I even ended the 2nd combat encounter early. Of the 2 enemies in it, 1 was dead, and the other was at %25 of it's HP, and surrounded by the party, flanked 2 ways. I rolled a d6 to determine who would deliver the death blow, if any, ending the combat on his turn. The player decided to spare the enemy. Again, the combat could have taken longer, if I hadn't decided to use some DME.

Just trying to show what happens to us. Does it happen to anyone else? I am complimented by my grouip, on generally being a 'fast' DM. I keep everyone focused on the table, and keep it moving, but not rushing anyone. I announce skill challenges, and will let skills not listed in the challenge be used, if the player can justify it. But these 7-10 mods are rough. I shudder at the possibilities of 11-14 or higher!

I'd like to hear anyone's thoughts on this.

I have noticed this, but the problems are as people have stated.

We had a 7-10 last week that ran to 1.30am from a 7pm start, and we fast-forwarded the skill challenge and the DM called the final encounter in the end. The main reasons, I think, were that we had 6 players, including three leaders and only one striker, and we were playing up from APL7 (unsurprisingly we also had the closest to a death I've yet seen in LFR - two failed death saves, and another save was rolled. Fortunately he passed, and my cleric was able to cure serious wounds to get him up again, our surge-based healing having long since been exhausted. Yes, with three leaders!).

It was one particular fight that ground (the one with the near-death) - taking nearly 3 hours on its own. It was a combination of factors - our one striker was out of action for much of the fight, and the rest of us did low damage, hard to hit monsters, monsters with multiple actions, monsters with a lot of HP, six players all deliberating their moves, a tricky terrain set-up forcing us to consider tactics - all in all the one fight ran to three hours, and since we were so close to PC death, the GM couldn't call it until we won

I believe the mod is a notoriously tough one, but it's not the first time I've seen 7-10 combat run long. Fact is that player damage does not scale so well with monster HP.

That said, I think that it's possibly at its worst with 7th level characters playing up. When I've played 7-10s with 9th and 10th levels, we've torn through them, and there is a massive power bump at paragon which should make things go a bit faster again.

Vamroc wrote:

One of the leaders on the other table should have been playing with this group giving the party a make up of 3 Strikers, 2 Defenders, and 1 leader. Unless nobody was playng a ranged striker they should always be ready to attack when the creature comes within range. A Ranger should have at least a +1 Great Bow with a range of 25/50 by the time he hits 3 or 4 and when he starts hitting 7-10 he should get a +2 Distance (property) Great Bow so he's hitting from 30/60 with his attacks. It doesn't provide extra damage on a crit but the extra range means you can pretty much hit anyone anywhere on a map.

Probably, but, the 2nd table had players who could have played leaders of the appropriate level. They chose not to.

Their makeup:
Artful Dodger Rogue 9
Brutal Scoundrel Rogue 8 (has a leader; Tactical Warlord 7)
Brutal Scoundrel Rogue 9
Beastmaster Ranger 9
Battlerager Fighter 10 (has a leader; Devoted Cleric 7)
Shielding Swordmage 7

My table: Only one player had a different character who could play
Tactical Warlord 8
Protectin Paladin 9 (multi'd into Cleric) (has Tempest Fighter 9)
Devoted Cleric 10
Great Weapon Fighter 9
Orb Wizard 10
Brutal Scoundrel Rogue 7

amysrevenge wrote:

There was a thread on ENworld a few months ago about this very phenomenon (if you have search capability there, try searching for "grind"). A fellow named Stalker0 had some good tips on how to mechanically make fights go faster, while keeping the same level of challenge. Most of it boiled down to decreasing hit points (-20% or maybe more) and increasing damage (extra damage die while bloodied) for elites and solos.

I still find, however, that the single biggest factor in how long an adventure takes is the level of focus provided by the DM. If someone loud and forceful and focused on running speedy but fun combats (like ME) is the DM, he can speed things along without seeming like a jerk. If the loud and forceful people are playing instead, and have something off-topic on their brains, then the table will run long.

And I am one of those as a player, I'm afraid, but it's usually becuase my kids are also there with me. Sometimes as DM too, but I can still usually stay focused, and get it done.

I like the idea of the extra damage die when the critter is bloodied. Might have to try that next time.