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4 years ago ::
Feb 25, 2009 - 8:33AM
#91
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Date Joined:
Dec 25, 2006
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The point I'm making is this: the poster I was referring to said that he'd be ok with the DM excusing himself from that table, and that's a situation that you can't always guarantee is possible. If that DM is going to be hostile to a legal rules item to that extent, it's probably a DM you don't want running games at your con at all.
Agreed, and while I would not object to him stepping aside, I would also not be asking him to DM again if he refused to DM for something that in my opinion is so trivial.
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4 years ago ::
Feb 25, 2009 - 8:35AM
#92
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2007
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It is the responsibility of a good RPGA DM to not allow their personal views to interfere with legal rules options.
As a con organiser, I would personally not want such DMs. If a DM refused to, I wouldn't ask them to DM again. It is that simple.
Being a DM in a living campaign means you have to accept its rules, failure to do so is a very bad sign. My opinions in this thread have been as a Player, but as a DM I would be much more diplomatic. (Contrary to impressions I may otherwise give...)
edit: I just noticed you said the same thing at the same time...
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4 years ago ::
Feb 25, 2009 - 8:41AM
#93
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Date Joined:
Jul 16, 2002
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Agreed. The mark of a good DM is one who will run the game and make it fun for the players regardless of their personal feelings for the players and/or the options they have chosen. Heck, there was a player who once pointed things out to the DM in a special that ended up getting my character killed... ending with "Shoudln't he be makign a massive damage save?" It was annoying. I don't like that player. I ran him and his buddies through a mod at a local con after that and while part of me would have loved to kill his character, burn the body into tiny ashes and teleport them to the far ends of the world so he couldn't be rezzed... I didn't do it. I ran the game and they all said it was one of the most enjoyable mods they played at the con. There are some things I may not like or agree with, but I will do my best to make sure the players have fun regardless and try to allow all the players to shine. Even if they're a Spellscarred Dhampyr Warforged Cleric of Kelemvor. 
Sorry WOTC, you lost me with Essentials. So where I used to buy every book that came out, now I will be very choosy about what I buy. Can we just get back to real 4e? Check out the 4e Conversion Wiki. 1. Wizards fight dirty. They hit their enemies in the NADs. -- Dragon9 2. A barbarian hits people with his axe. A warlord hits people with his barbarian. 3. Boo-freakin'-hoo, ya light-slingin' finger-wigglers. -- MrCelcius in response to the Cleric's Healer's Lore nerf
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4 years ago ::
Feb 25, 2009 - 9:38AM
#94
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2008
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There are some things I may not like or agree with, but I will do my best to make sure the players have fun regardless and try to allow all the players to shine. Even if they're a Spellscarred Dhampyr Warforged Cleric of Kelemvor.
in SPACE!!
:D
Ahh, so THIS is where I can add a sig.
Remember: Killing an ancient God inside of a pyramid IS a Special Occasion, and thus, ladies should be dipping into their Special Occasions underwear drawer.
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4 years ago ::
Feb 25, 2009 - 10:32AM
#95
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Date Joined:
May 28, 2005
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Now I want Dragon to publish Giant Space Hamster as a playable race. Or perhaps I can just roll a beastmaster ranger with a Miniature Giant Space Hamster.
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4 years ago ::
Feb 26, 2009 - 12:34AM
#96
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Date Joined:
May 11, 2005
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Why would the church not look in favor at a dhampyr
Because a dhampyr is associated with undead. The feelings do not have to be rational (they hardly ever are), but a Doomguide may think that a dhampyr is naturally drawn to undeath: all it's powers are potentially corrupting (or so they migtht hink).
Of course, dhampyr's do not automatically get corrupted, but most Kelemvor priests (and there are of course exceptions) are not so quickly to consider that.
In relation to previous posts: such averse feelings (from NPCs) should be use for flavor, not for some form of retaliation. Choices for character race, class, origin, and even gender may color how NPCs react (though not as much as PC behavior). It is, after all, a roleplaying game, and that is more interesting if NPCs do not react to every PC in the same way. But it should be fun.
Gomez
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4 years ago ::
Feb 26, 2009 - 1:20AM
#97
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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Because a dhampyr is associated with undead. The feelings do not have to be rational (they hardly ever are), but a Doomguide may think that a dhampyr is naturally drawn to undeath: all it's powers are potentially corrupting (or so they migtht hink).
Of course, dhampyr's do not automatically get corrupted, but most Kelemvor priests (and there are of course exceptions) are not so quickly to consider that.
All necromancers are wizards. Necromancers create undead. Therefore all wizards are suspect.
Doesn't work in either case.
Besides, how would the prriest of Kelemvor even know someone is Dhampyr? Or has been raised from the dead, which it sounds like Kelemvorites hould be even more outraged at...
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4 years ago ::
Feb 26, 2009 - 2:45AM
#98
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2007
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Besides, how would the prriest of Kelemvor even know someone is Dhampyr? Or has been raised from the dead, which it sounds like Kelemvorites hould be even more outraged at...
Did you read my post about fanatics?
Spoiler:
Show
OK you are thinking about it in the wrong way.
Person A hates X. X is something I will not abide, and destroy under any circumstances.
X reproduces and creates Y, which whilst different to X< possess many powers given and propogated by X.
By association, to a FUNDAMENTALIST (which btw, is what Kelemvorites actually are) Y is mistrusted and disliked by virtue of association with X, both as it's offspring and due to it's reminder of the presence therof.
I don't want to bring in real world examples, but there are PLENTY of situations where fundamentalists hate the offspring or those associated with the group they hate, purely because of the association.
That is the inherent problem I see with an organised church of Kelemvor accepting Undead, I am viewing it from a standard psychological analysis of Fanatics.
Also you are getting lore confused with the 'undead keyword'.
Necromancers get power from the Undead. But arent undead. Does Kelemvor like them? What about a good Necromancer? where is the line drawn?
Now whilst I can see individual Damphyr being granted divine powers to fight that which spawned them, I don't take with this argument of yours that the church of Kelemvor (As in the mortal one, with it's traditions and doctrine) would be fine and dandy with the little biters.
Also you seem to be confusing metagame concepts with the game world - death saving throws and so on have nothing to do with this debate.
- Note that I am not saying you can't do it, but would definitely see why it wouldn't be accepted practice amongst the standard clergy.
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4 years ago ::
Feb 26, 2009 - 3:11AM
#99
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Date Joined:
May 11, 2005
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All necromancers are wizards. Necromancers create undead. Therefore all wizards are suspect.
I didn't say it is logical or even rational. Just that this is how they, imo, would think.
Gomez
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4 years ago ::
Feb 26, 2009 - 5:23AM
#100
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Date Joined:
Feb 16, 2008
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I didn't say it is logical or even rational. Just that this is how they, imo, would think.
That is the point. My Kelemvorite Cleric is such a fanatic. They really are the Faerunian equivalent of jihadists. It really is a jihad against the undead. The undead must either be destroyed or moved on, full stop. There is no room for any shades of gray. And that is what the canon Faerun lore demands.
My Kelemvorite cleric will refuse to adventure with anyone shes knows has the Dhampyr template, for IC reasons. IC, ideally, she would attempt to kill the abomination, but since that is verboten without consent for OOC reasons, they will not receive any healing and she will find a way to leave the presence of the Dhampyr as soon as she can. If that means OOC getting up and walking away from the table, then so be it. My Dragonborn barbarian or my dwarven cleric of Sune couldn't care less about Dhampyr as long as they don't hog the food in the former case and don't make a mess in the latter.
OOC the Dhampyr template is yet another example of WOTC deciding to take away what is special about the Realms and turning it into yet another generic fantasy setting in an attempt to appeal to the MMO-market (for Dhampyr read "We've got to get something to appear to WoW Forsaken players").
As for DMing, yes, I was pretty angry at the time, but what do you expect when people have no respect for the setting and deliberately abuse the lore just because they can?
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