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4 years ago ::
Nov 24, 2008 - 2:55PM
#31
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Date Joined:
Feb 28, 2008
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How do you get to +9 with the shield?
Strength: +5
Level: +2
...What am I missing?
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4 years ago ::
Nov 24, 2008 - 3:27PM
#32
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Date Joined:
Jun 10, 2004
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I believe the shield attack is strength +2 vs AC.
5 str
2 level
2 base
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4 years ago ::
Nov 24, 2008 - 7:13PM
#33
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2007
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I have seen far more impressive characters.
Let's not make this a character pi$$ing contest. I could easily kill that PC if I wanted to as a DM.
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4 years ago ::
Nov 24, 2008 - 8:01PM
#34
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Date Joined:
Jun 10, 2004
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Of course you could. You could DM empower in ten Balors.
If you could kill said PC with any given mod as presented is another story.
I have seen quite a few characters that could solo most of the 1-4 mods out there.
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4 years ago ::
Nov 24, 2008 - 8:14PM
#35
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2007
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DM empowerment has nothing to do with it. It is not a super PC.
My Level 4 Paladin has:
AC 25
HP: 46
Has +11 to hit
Has: 10 surges and a fair few ways to heal itself
+12 diplomacy (+16 for an encounter with astral speech)
And has taken over 130 damage in ONE fight before. Said Super PC is not exactly special, it just has Str 20 which is +1 to hit at the expense of sucking in a Skill challenge. Also many monsters with decent Flanking will be hitting you nearly 50% of the time.
I have beaten down many 4th level PCs that had similar attributes. A few ShadowHunter bats alone and the odd Hexer and you'd be stuffed.
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4 years ago ::
Nov 24, 2008 - 10:19PM
#36
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Date Joined:
Apr 29, 2008
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I have seen quite a few characters that could solo most of the 1-4 mods out there.
You keep saying these things but the more I hear, the more I have to question the quality of the DMs you play under. It must be really depressing to have the games run by someone with so little tactical imagination. As a DM who has run everything available at the 1-4 level I can honestly say that there is not a single mod where I would be confident of *any* single 4th level character getting through (and I follow the optimization board). There's one or two where they would have a chance if the dice rolled well but that's it. On the other hand, there are at least a half dozen mods where I would happily put money down on the character's demise if run (as written) by a good DM.
It's not a question of the quality of the character or the skills and knowledge of the player playing it. The math simply does not allow for what you are suggesting as log as the game is run properly.
This little signature is my official and insignificant protest to the (not so new now) community redesign.
The layout is lousy. The colour scheme burns the eyes. The wiki is a crippled monstrosity. So many posters have abandoned this site that some major forums are going days without posts. The 4e General Discussion board regularly has posts on the front page from two or even three days ago. This is pathetic.
Since I have to assume Wizards has a vested interest in an active community I wish someone in charge would fix this mess.
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4 years ago ::
Nov 25, 2008 - 1:20AM
#37
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Date Joined:
Oct 19, 2008
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The other day we played Akan1-1 on high tier with a group, I don't think our DM rolled higher than a 6 on an attack for 90% of the game, I got hit a grand total of 4 times the entire game on my rogue, and I know that was just luck because the first two times I did get hit took me down to half my health in the first round of the first fight, now I only have a 21 AC but still, that's not terrible, the other two hits I took were freaking OA's vs my 24 ac vs OAs. I know that surviving a large number of attacks is mostly about luck, you can't claim to have some special way of being that lucky that you can reliable drop an entire encounter worth of critters and take all the attacks they are dishing at you without being hit enough to drop you. I just can't believe it.
on a side note sometimes it sucks to go first before the monsters who in turn go before the rest of your party =) When you take the first one you attack down to 1/4 hp on your first shot his friends tend to think "that guy sure looks threatening!" and it's suddenly concentrate all firepower on that dark skinned elf who threw a dagger in greezle's eye! Or god forbid you actually crit and drop a non-minion on your opener, I think if that happens and there are more of them standing I'll just drop a globe of darkness and move a square.
Blah blah blah
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4 years ago ::
Dec 01, 2008 - 12:46PM
#38
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Date Joined:
Mar 19, 2001
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And have you actually done this or is this all hypothetical?
Its hypothetical, there is a nice long thread on battleragers:
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1115525
To sum it up it consists almost entirely of two types of posts-
1. I think battleragers are SO hypothetically overpowered they shouldn't be allowed to exist.
2. I actually tried out a battlerager and it was decent, but certainly not unkillable.
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4 years ago ::
Dec 01, 2008 - 1:39PM
#39
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Date Joined:
Dec 16, 2005
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Its hypothetical, there is a nice long thread on battleragers:
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1115525
To sum it up it consists almost entirely of two types of posts-
1. I think battleragers are SO hypothetically overpowered they shouldn't be allowed to exist.
2. I actually tried out a battlerager and it was decent, but certainly not unkillable.
You can't say that it's all hypothetical yet. Players have always and will always claim that their pet PCs are decent but not overpowered. (Back in the day, I remember players seriously explaining how their Divine Metamagic Persistent Spell characters with nightsticks were not overpowered with exactly the same kind of testimony. I might have tried to argue that wraithstrike was not broken myself once based on the first few mods I played with the spell (though I did come to the conclusion that the game would be better off without it after a few more games)).
I'll believe that it's hypothetical when I or a judge whose skill I respect runs a tough mod for a skilled player with a well-constructed battlerager and it is demonstrated to not be overpowered. Until then, I'll base expectations off of math and theory in preference to players with a vested interest in their own conclusions. I'll also take with a grain of salt the claims of DMs that any particular character was fine or was overpowered. I know and have played with DMs who couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag with a tarrasque and players who could get pun pun killed in the first round of combat with a softball DM while playing down. Thus play of any one character at any one table is not good evidence of how a character actually works.
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4 years ago ::
Dec 01, 2008 - 2:14PM
#40
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Date Joined:
Mar 19, 2001
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I'll believe that it's hypothetical when I or a judge whose skill I respect runs a tough mod for a skilled player with a well-constructed battlerager and it is demonstrated to not be overpowered.
I consider myself to fall into both your player and judge requirements, as well as others I know that have run and ran for battleragers. I make my judgement having witnessed them in action from both sides of the screen, but I very well understand that you want to see them in action yourself to pass judgement.
1. I believe a few of the LFR mods are very softball and are easy enough for a level 4 to solo the high level version of them. In fact the high level version of some mods seem significantly easier than the low level version of some mods.
2. I believe any player that believes that a character can solo any 1-4 mods has either has bad DMs or hasn't played the right mods.
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