|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:08AM
#91
|
Date Joined:
Jun 14, 2005
|
Worth, have you considered rewarding all of your customers who purchased and played with the IPA stuff (when MTGO hadn't even proved to anyone that it would be around, and in fact there were "official" comments that it could be shut down if it was ever perceived that it was negatively affecting paper)?
Why not give these special customers a special eternal format with only IPA-forward cards allowed, excluding any sets like Mirage, MEDs and so on? After all, those sets were brought in in a rather ad hoc way, never being legal even in online extended. It seems quite fair to me to create such a format after the rotation of online extended - and hosting PEs / queues for that format alongside with PEs / queues for Classic. Depending on which format proves more popular, then you can skew the number of tournaments more towards one than the other, as seems very reasonable.
One of the main purposes of eternal formats seems to be to let people play all of their cards, without forcing them to keep up with new set releases. If you don't create such an IPA-forward format after the online extended rotation, you are undermining that very purpose, as you are "forcing" - retroactively, even - players that were around since the start of MTGO (or otherwise have acquired cards from the very start of MTGO) to acquire cards of sets that never were legal in online standard, or even online extended, and that weren't even good limited formats (I'm evaluating good mainly through the format's popularity). Seems really unfair not to do it.
Ivo.
Yes, I have. A big part of their 'reward' has already been reaped, through the "overpriced" Orims chants that you pointed out. And the 10+ ticket boosters, and loads of other pricey stuff.
These customers' "special format" is Classic. Just because Orims Chant probably isn't good enough to matter in post rotation Classic shouldnt do *that much* to it's price. If the price of Orims Chant drops to 5 tickets or something after the rotation, I'll eat my words. But it's not going to.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:13AM
#92
|
Date Joined:
Jun 14, 2005
|
Truth be told, I think your concerns are valid. I think that the people who bought IPA right off the bat and helped MTGO get off the ground have every right to be frustrated. I just don't see it changing WotC's point of view.
Like I said in my previous post...I'm very glad that the folks who did support us during those days got the windfall they did. But let's be VERY clear. This windfall has been going on for YEARS. Anyone who bought a pack of Invasion for $3.29 in 2002 could have sold it for triple or quadruple that at basically any point in the last 2-3 years.
Am I sad that isn't the case in perpetuity? Honestly...kinda. But I'm not really interested in artificially propping up those values so that Orim's Chant stays at 80 tickets forever.
The market is what the market is. The people who made those choices back in 2002 had a good long time to be very well compensated for doing so, and frankly there is no chance someone who bought virtually (pardon the pun) ANY IPA product for retail/current for 2002 market prices back then will ever lose money on it. Rotation or not.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:18AM
#93
|
Date Joined:
Jun 14, 2005
|
I don't disagree with you, but if this were my format of choice (and I'm really weighing up if I should finish my playset of FoW now, or wait to see what happens) then I'd be a little worried that the people in charge want to create the same situation that holds back the comparable format in paper. Sure, there will always be something that costs more than people would like to pay, but creating such a thing so early in the life of the format, when it is clearly avoidable, doesn't seem like the best thing to do.
Contrary to popular belief, I'm not trying to create anything. I'm simply letting the market dictate what it will.
The only way it is "clearly avoidable" at this point is to reprint FoW, something I will not do mostly because I said at the outset of MED that I wouldn't, and people have since (I'm sure) made purchasing decisions based on that statement. It's not like I'm springing this on people. I've said this stuff from the very beginning.
And as far as forum goers having insider info, there are or have been recently multiple clickable links *within the client itself* that show people the messageboards, annoncements on MED issues, blogs, etc. If folks choose not to click them, I can't force them to come here. Judging by our web traffic on these forums, I'd suspect there are loads of folks who come and read and never post a thing, though.
The real question is, are we going to have this same conversation on January 8th 2009 when I'm taking MED2 off sale and stuff like Underground Sea is going with it?
On a side note, if you guys think that Classic is going to be so popular that FoW is going to be 100 tickets a piece, should you buy a bunch of packs or trade for FoW's right now? 
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:34AM
#94
|
Date Joined:
Oct 15, 2007
|
FoW is going to be 100 tickets a piece, should you buy a bunch of packs or trade for FoW's right now?
DONE!
By the way your dedication to the community is welcome. To have an honest person sticking by their word when so many would have them turn coats is comendable.
As for MED 2 I plan to buy around 2-3 grand so keep it coming.. Thank you for your continued support of classic.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:42AM
#95
|
Date Joined:
Mar 17, 2003
|
How exactly is IPA forward and "eternal format."
If you wanted a second option to Classic I think you should push for choose your own standard, and you could just choose not to use anything but cards from IPA forward.
That's pretty simple, I'm amazed you don't see it.
It's eternal because cards don't rotate out of it.
Or is the question "Why IPA forward instead of OTJ forward?"
Ivo.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:51AM
#96
|
Date Joined:
Mar 17, 2003
|
Like I said in my previous post...I'm very glad that the folks who did support us during those days got the windfall they did. But let's be VERY clear. This windfall has been going on for YEARS. Anyone who bought a pack of Invasion for $3.29 in 2002 could have sold it for triple or quadruple that at basically any point in the last 2-3 years.
Maybe I'm not getting across very well here.
Unlike others, I don't think I deserve anything just because I was an early adopter. I think regardless of having joined on day one (which I actually did) or having purchased IPA singles the very day before Mirage was announced, the people are entitled to the same thing - and that thing is not any windfall.
I never got that windfall, because I never wanted it. My overpriced cards stayed on the same place where they were when they weren't overpriced (and yes, they were overpriced - to see how much I care, I don't even know if they still are - I hear Mage is still, but I never checked). They stayed in my collection for me to play with them, not to play in a stock market with them (but hey, whoever wanted to do that with theirs, go ahead). I'm a player, not a collector or an investor, and frankly, WotC makes good games, not good collectibles or good stock markets.
What I want is a format to PLAY the cards I have without being forced to acquire cards from sets that were never standard legal, or even extended legal, and perhaps as a consequence of that (or just from being cruddy limited sets) were never drafted much, leading to very low numbers in circulation (on top of never being useful for other formats). I personally don't care much (if at all) for the effect such a format will have on the value of the cards (in fact, I honestly always supported the few measures that WotC put in to lower the prices of those overpriced IPA cards I had myself, and was always sad they didn't do more than what they did). And that format to PLAY is what I think I'm entitled to (regardless of getting it or not). I don't think at ALL I am entitled to have my Chant's artificially propped to continue overpriced.
The only way it is "clearly avoidable" at this point is to reprint FoW, something I will not do mostly because I said at the outset of MED that I wouldn't, and people have since (I'm sure) made purchasing decisions based on that statement. It's not like I'm springing this on people. I've said this stuff from the very beginning.
Because I wasn't always paying attention (and I'm somewhat of a forum regular, perhaps), I'm going to give the benefit of doubt (but it still serves to show that the forums is NOT the right place for info like this, as Worth says people base their purchasing decisions based on such statements)...
I'd like to have someone show me where exactly did Worth said, right at the outset of MED, that he wasn't going to reprint FoW beyond MED.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 11:59AM
#97
|
Date Joined:
Oct 15, 2007
|
That's pretty simple, I'm amazed you don't see it.
It's eternal because cards don't rotate out of it.
Or is the question "Why IPA forward instead of OTJ forward?"
Ivo.
I am still confused why is something like this needed. Honestly Classic is enough. If you want play your scepter chant again you can alway do it in casual but in classic its too slow. Sets rotate and i think WOTC and worth have done a great job in providing us with an eternal format to fit the needs of the masses. I personally dont own any ipa with exeption of fire ice and a few other commons. It was the reason extended was not my format of choice how ever the rotation will bring many players that missed the band wagon into ext.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 12:03PM
#98
|
Date Joined:
Oct 15, 2007
|
I'd like to have someone show me where exactly did Worth said, right at the outset of MED, that he wasn't going to reprint FoW beyond MED.
Que Hamtastic . . . . . .or Iceage4life
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 12:11PM
#99
|
Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2004
|
The real question is, are we going to have this same conversation on January 8th 2009 when I'm taking MED2 off sale and stuff like Underground Sea is going with it?
Nah... not unless you are very, very cruel and make Underground Sea the only dual land an playable staple in MED II.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Jan 04, 2008 - 12:21PM
#100
|
|
|
Well, I disagree with Worth on this issue. No, $50 Force of Will isn't an insurmountable problem for the format, but it's certainly not a good thing. And more importantly, there's no reason to believe it'll stop there. Moxes were about 30 bucks when I started playing and they sure don't cost 50 now (or ten years ago for that matter). If v3 is a success at all, then I fully expect the price of FoW to get quite high. The fact that the currently miniscule Classic player base can support a price of 26-30 tickets is worrying.
|
|
|
