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4 months ago ::
Feb 05, 2013 - 9:38PM
#31
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Date Joined:
Dec 15, 2007
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I think they're all useful, but not game breakers. Flicker effects do allow multiple uses which will get silly, but let's be honest, if left unchecked, flicker effects always get silly. But I don't feel like any of them are massive threats.
My guess is the average EDH game is about 4 players? Look at the green one. It ETBF and blows up 3 things and nets you 3 land. 1 flicker will blow up 3 additional things and ramp 3 more land. That's 3 (or 6 if you count the lands too) times better than any other crature. You don't need to have a flicker engine for it to get out of hand. You just need to cast a flicker card to push it over the edge. It's also a good reanimator card. If it gets out early game you're setting back everyone a land and ramping for each opponent. That's pretty devastating.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 06, 2013 - 12:17PM
#32
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Date Joined:
Feb 11, 2007
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I don't fully understand the hatred/fear of these. Sylvan primordial is pretty sweet, but it's no primeval titan. It doesn't fetch busted nonbasic lands. It doesn't run away with the game all on its own if left unchecked. And it costs more...the difference between 6 and 7 mana is huge. And the 'scales with # of players at the table' mechanic is nothing new either. Remember syphon mind  and blatant thievery  ? Or heck going back further, remember when mind rot  already existed and they printed unnerve  ? I don't think the primordials are bad design, and I don't think they're overpowered. Just more sweet fatties that I can't wait to play with/against.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 06, 2013 - 2:20PM
#33
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Date Joined:
Aug 18, 2007
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I don't fully understand the hatred/fear of these. Sylvan primordial is pretty sweet, but it's no primeval titan. It doesn't fetch busted nonbasic lands. It doesn't run away with the game all on its own if left unchecked. And it costs more...the difference between 6 and 7 mana is huge. And the 'scales with # of players at the table' mechanic is nothing new either. Remember syphon mind and blatant thievery ? Or heck going back further, remember when both unnerve and mind rot were standard legal? I don't think the primordials are bad design, and I don't think they're overpowered. Just more sweet fatties that can't wait to play with/against.
I like your view on this. I enjoy a challenge, and when I end up with a surplus of good cards I give them to my opponents to up their game too. It makes it more interesting to know they could pop out a primordial or just a big vanilla (or otherwise relatively harmless) creature, and I have to hope its the latter. On Sunday a guy was complaining to me that my Obzedat deck ran too many rares and mythics, and he was playing stuff like Force of Nature  and boring vanilla uncommons. He said his deck took skill to play, and while I agree, I said mine does too since I generally play with people using higher powered decks than his. As expected, he lost, and his weak cards didn't help. Power is power, and if we all have it, we all are equals and skill comes back into play. If an opponent won't play power and I will, I will win at least 75% of the time.
The primordials aren't a problem, they are an added aspect of your own skill level in deck design and making the choice to either play them or not, and to have answers for their effects (if not for the cards being cast from the start { Gather Specimens  , Desertion  , Counterspell  , etc.})
If I'm right, I'm right. If I'm wrong, I still believe I'm right. Think of it as religion. dubito ergo sum.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 06, 2013 - 7:40PM
#34
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Date Joined:
Jun 29, 2011
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I don't fully understand the hatred/fear of these.
I don't think it's hatred or fear. It's dull design. I know WotC wants to make even more EDH/casual stuff, but if this is the approach they're going to take, I'm not all that amped about it. I'll say that the Primordials are fine, but I wouldn't want too many more cards like this. Just my opinion though. However, I do think it would be fun to reanimate other Primordials with Sepulchral Primordial  .
The primordials aren't a problem, they are an added aspect of your own skill level in deck design and making the choice to either play them or not, and to have answers for their effects (if not for the cards being cast from the start { Gather Specimens , Desertion , Counterspell , etc.})
I don't think you need even the slightest bit of deckbuilding talent to recognize the value in this cycle. That's kind of the problem, for me anyway. It's like they practically beat me over the head and said "Use these." Of course, the sky isn't falling, but I remain wary.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 15, 2013 - 1:02PM
#35
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got to a 5 player game where the 1st player casted his green primodial on turn 5 , then the 2nd player copies it, and the 1st player reanimated it after it was killed imediately.. what's left of the 3rd/4th 5th player was very little land left and the 1st player was ahead with 15 lands. game was practically over, no one git close to tickle him.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 16, 2013 - 11:51AM
#36
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Date Joined:
Feb 11, 2007
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wouldn't have been any different if he cast blatant thievery, had it forked, and then regrowthed it.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 16, 2013 - 12:49PM
#37
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I just had a turn 4 thran dynamo into worn powerstone. Played turn 5 blatant thievery stealing a cabal coffers, karoo, temple of the false God, and a phyexian arena... they did not recover and I won with arcanis and mind over matter in short order.
Big plays win games... who knew.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 16, 2013 - 7:27PM
#38
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Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2006
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I'm actually fairly excited to use some of these. I just put together a Karador deck...and could conceivably play 3 of them. I think, however, that I will only pick 1...possibly 2. So far I like the black one the best. I'm already playing Sun Titan and Elesh Norn so I'd like to go for something that's not white...
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