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I just read a judge’s write up that said State-based actions, like the one that destroys creatures with lethal damage marked on them, are never performed while a spell or ability is resolving.

 

Here is where I need some clarifications.  Let me give an example  I have Olivia Voldaren   on the field and a huntmaster.  I ping the huntmaster with Olivia’s first ability in response my opponent searing spears Olivia.

If state based lethal is not checked until the spell resolves then Olivia lives and is a 4/4 creature with 3 damage – or did she die?

Olivia dies.

Searing Spear resolves first, dealing 3 damage to olivia. Imediately after searing spear finishes resolving the game checks state-based actions and kills olivia. Next, each player gets a chance to respond to olivia's ability. Assuming there are no responses, the ability resolves dealing 1 damage to the huntmaster. The ability also attempts to put a +1/+1 counter on olivia but fails because olivia no longer exists. Immediately after olivia's ability resolves, the game checks state-based actions again.

she will be a 3/3 creature with 3 damage marked on it, and her "ping" ability is still waiting to resolve (so she hasn't gotten the +1/+1 counter yet)

she's dead

this has nothing really to do with SBA, it's more "the fault" of the stack and how it works

Jan 31, 2013 -- 5:23PM, Pokerman11 wrote:

I just read a judge’s write up that said State-based actions, like the one that destroys creatures with lethal damage marked on them, are never performed while a spell or ability is resolving.

 

Here is where I need some clarifications.  Let me give an example  I have Olivia Voldaren   on the field and a huntmaster.  I ping the huntmaster with Olivia’s first ability in response my opponent searing spears Olivia.

If state based lethal is not checked until the spell resolves then Olivia lives and is a 4/4 creature with 3 damage – or did she die?

She died. Your ability hasn't begun resolving when the searing spear is cast, and won't resolve until after the spear does.

The moment searing spear finishes resolving, State-Based Actions are checked, and she dies. 

here is an example of how SBA would work to save a creature

imagine Olivia Voldaren has 2 damage marked on her
now, let's assume she can use her "ping" ability on herself (she can't, because it says "another")

if you use her ability on herself for a short moment during the resolution of the ability she will be a 3/3 creature with 3 damage marked on it (because the damage is before the counter)
but when the ability is done and SBA are checked she is a 4/4 with 3 damage marked on her and perfectly fine

A better example is that Maro will not die when you resolve Tolarian Winds , even though it is a 0/0 during the resolution of Tolarian Winds. By the time the spell is done resolving, you have (hopefully) drawn some cards and the game will se Maro with a positive power and toughness.

OK I think I got it - thanks.  SBA are not checked while an individual spell/ability is resolving, but does after each spell resolves. 


Lets say that the huntmaster is an opponents and Olivia has 2 damage marked on her (from combat)  I ping the huntmaster and he response with divine deflection    redirecting the damage to Olivia.  The way it works is the devine deflection resolves, then Olivia's ability starts to resolve - she takes one damage but since state based in not checked she lives - is a 4/4 creature with 3 damage.

for most scenarios you can assume that SBA are checked "all the time"
it's only in corner cases like Grim Affliction or the Maro example above that the actual timing matters

The most recent example I can think of where it was relevant was a Searing Spear on Jace's Phantasm with nine other cards already in your graveyard.

Cheers

Another vampirific example would be this:

Let's say you control Olivia , Captivating Vampire , and Tormented Soul .

You activate Olivia's ping targeting Tormented Soul . It takes one damage, becomes a vampire, and Olivia gets a counter. The next time SBAs are checked, Tormented Soul is a 2/2 vampire spirit with 1 damage marked on it.

? In Pokerman's example of Olivia Voldaren haveing 2 damage then taking damage from divine deflection wouldn't Olivia still die.  Because SBA is checked after divine deflection resolves.  I thought SBA are checked everytime someone gets priority.  And someone would get priority after a spell resolves. the +1/+1 counter are still on the stack and fizzile because she is dead by the time they resolve?

Divine Deflection on its own only sets up the replacement effect, the damage is dealt later when Olivia's ability resolves
at that time she will also get the +1/+1 counter and survive

Tarmagoyf with 2 card types in graveyards, a Lightning Bolt targeted at it and neither is an instant is the typical example.

Bolt is resolving and marks 3 damage on the 2/3 goyf, then is put in the graveyard making the goyf a 3/4 and it survives.