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Is it possible to "reveal" a card in a public zone? Let's say that I control a Darksteel Colossus that's been turned face-down . If it then gets destroyed, what actually happens? If I reveal it from the battlefield, I'll just reveal a face-down creature, right? If it's still revealed after being shuffled into my library, then I'll reveal the actual card, but does it remain revealed during or after the shuffle?

For that matter, how does Darksteel Colossus even work for this situation? It doesn't have the replacement ability while it's face-down, so will it actually hit the graveyard?

Yes. Cards do it with the exile zone all the time.

When a face-down permanent leaves the battlefield, it gets revealed as it leaves. If it's a colossus, you'll reveal a colossus, then put it into the graveyard (its replacement effect wasn't active as it left).

all face down cards that leave the battlefield have to be turned face up
then the replacement effect kicks in, you reveal it (it's visible already anyway) and shuffle it in the library

/edit: overruled

...so its shuffle-me-into-lib replacement ability won't trigger apply?

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:34PM, Chaikov wrote:

...so its shuffle-me-into-lib ability won't trigger?

it's not a trigger
if it was a trigger it would surely trigger, since it would be an "enter the graveyard trigger"

but since it is a replacement effect ShardFenix disagrees with me

Shard_fenix is correct here.  The card is only revealed, not turned face up.  It won't be a face up card until it's in the graveyard and by that point it will be too late for it's replacement effect to apply.

The only replacement effects that look into the future are "Enter the battlefield" replacement effects. "Leaves the battlefield" and "enters (any other zone)" replacements have to exist before the event happens.

Interesting. Thanks.

If an effect forced you to reveal a face-down permanent (but not turn it face up), would you show what the actual card is?

Wait! Colossus has not been settled yet!
The replacement effect does not exist while it's in the Library; still, it works. Why not from the Field (even when hidden)?

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:39PM, FezzHead wrote:

If an effect forced you to reveal a face-down permanent (but not turn it face up), would you show what the actual card is?

I'm not sure what you mean. Revealing means showing people what the card is.

A face-down creature has no abilities, right? Not even the replacement effect, so by the time it would be a Colossus again, it would have to already be in the graveyard, at which point it's too late to do anything instead. If the Colossus is in the library, it's hidden, but it still has its abilities.

Edit:

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:42PM, Shard_Fenix wrote:

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:39PM, FezzHead wrote:

If an effect forced you to reveal a face-down permanent (but not turn it face up), would you show what the actual card is?

I'm not sure what you mean. Revealing means showing people what the card is.

What I mean is that "face-down" is not the same as "hidden." If you revealed a face-down creature, you'd show exactly what it is: a 2/2 creature with no abilities.

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:41PM, Chaikov wrote:

Wait! Colossus has not been settled yet!
The replacement effect does not exist while it's in the Library; still, it works. Why not from the Field (even when hidden)?

Yes it does. All cards have the abilities printed on them in all zones. Colossus' ability is not a battlefield-exclusive ability, it works in all zones.

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:43PM, FezzHead wrote:

If the Colossus is in the library, it's hidden, but it still has its abilities.

Not according to rule 112.6.


I guess the «from anywhere» text allows Colossus to work under rule 112.6b...

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:43PM, FezzHead wrote:

What I mean is that "face-down" is not the same as "hidden." If you revealed a face-down creature, you'd show exactly what it is: a 2/2 creature with no abilities.

no
you will reveal what it actually is, it will just remain face-down for rules purposes

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:45PM, Chaikov wrote:

Jan 9, 2013 -- 5:43PM, FezzHead wrote:

If the Colossus is in the library, it's hidden, but it still has its abilities.

Not according to rule 112.6.

112.6b. An ability that states which zones it functions in functions only from those zones.

I'm pretty sure this applies, since the colossus says it works "from anywhere."

Yes, I just edited my previous post accordingly!

So, in the end, the collossus will be shuffled in the owner's library or not ?

Jan 9, 2013 -- 11:37PM, Zoidberg wrote:

So, in the end, the collossus will be shuffled in the owner's library or not ?

In this scenario no.  On the battlefield it was a face down creature, which is a 2/2 with no abilities.  It's revealed as it leaves the battlefield, but it's not actually a darksteel colossus again until it's in the graveyard, which by then is too late.  It remains in the graveyard.

Jan 9, 2013 -- 11:55PM, Segoth wrote:

Jan 9, 2013 -- 11:37PM, Zoidberg wrote:

So, in the end, the collossus will be shuffled in the owner's library or not ?

In this scenario no.  On the battlefield it was a face down creature, which is a 2/2 with no abilities.  It's revealed as it leaves the battlefield, but it's not actually a blightsteel colossus again until it's in the graveyard, which by then is too late.  It remains in the graveyard.

Cool.

As opposed to the Lorwyn reincarnations or the legendary Eldrazis ("when put into the graveyard from anywhere") but any creature with "When put into the graveyard from the battlefield" wouldn't trigger indeed.