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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 7:34AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Feb 22, 2005
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One of my favorite multiplayer cards is Endless Whispers  , but there's an interaction I've never been 100% sure on, so I'd like confirmation. Here's the situation: I'm at 3 life and control Endless Whispers and a Vampire Aristocrat  owned by another player. In response to Lightning Bolt  targetting me, I sacrifice the Aristocrat to itself. Does it come back? My guess is 'yes' since the ability is set up by the death and owned by the creature, which means that my death and the subsequent removal of the Whispers and all of its abilities no longer matters. On a similar note: Is the answer the same if instead of me dying, it's a Naturalize  targetting the Whispers?
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 7:41AM
#2
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2006
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«Dystocracy : A system of government in which corrupt leadership colludes with dishonest bankers and greedy elites in order to ensure that productive members of society –people who actually do useful work- bear the greatest share of taxes while gaining the least benefit possible.»
Sounds familiar?
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 7:44AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Jan 19, 2003
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One of my favorite multiplayer cards is Endless Whispers , but there's an interaction I've never been 100% sure on, so I'd like confirmation. Here's the situation:
I'm at 3 life and control Endless Whispers and a Vampire Aristocrat owned by another player. In response to Lightning Bolt targetting me, I sacrifice the Aristocrat to itself. Does it come back?
No.
You controlled the aristocrat when it died, so you control its triggered ability. As a result, you also will control the delayed trigger which returns the creature to the battlefield at the end of the turn.
603.7e If an activated or triggered ability creates a delayed triggered ability, the source of that delayed triggered ability is the same as the source of that other ability. The controller of that delayed triggered ability is the player who controlled that other ability as it resolved.
When the end of the turn comes around, the delayed trigger tries to get put on the stack, but since its controller (you) has left the game, it isn't put on the stack.
800.4d If an object that would be owned by a player who has left the game would be created in any zone, it isn't created. If a triggered ability that would be controlled by a player who has left the game would be put onto the stack, it isn't put on the stack.
On a similar note: Is the answer the same if instead of me dying, it's a Naturalize targetting the Whispers?
Different answer. The creature will return just fine. At the time the creature died, the creature had the triggered ability and will set up the delayed trigger. Whispers doesn't need to stick around for the delayed trigger to have its effect.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 7:56AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Feb 22, 2005
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Alright. I was thinking about the delayed trigger belonging to the creature and the creature not belonging to me. Didn't think about the fact I still would've controlled the trigger.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 7:57AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2006
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Creatures can't own nor control anything; only players can.
«Dystocracy : A system of government in which corrupt leadership colludes with dishonest bankers and greedy elites in order to ensure that productive members of society –people who actually do useful work- bear the greatest share of taxes while gaining the least benefit possible.»
Sounds familiar?
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 10:28AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Dec 13, 2011
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What if we change the situation slightly? If the controller of the Vampire Aristocrat sacrifices it, but the target opponent leaves the game after the initial trigger resolves but before the next end step, does the delayed trigger even get put onto the stack?
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 10:28AM
#7
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Date Joined:
Jul 28, 2010
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yes
but it will do nothing
this kinda applies:
800.4d If an object that would be owned by a player who has left the game would be created in any zone, it isn’t created.
proud member of the 2011 community team
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 5:56PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2006
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This (also) kinda applies:
800.4b If an object would change to the control of a player who has left the game, it doesn’t. If a token would enter the battlefield under the control of a player who has left the game, no token is created...
Eh! eh! I guess FezzHead found (another) hole in the rules!
«Dystocracy : A system of government in which corrupt leadership colludes with dishonest bankers and greedy elites in order to ensure that productive members of society –people who actually do useful work- bear the greatest share of taxes while gaining the least benefit possible.»
Sounds familiar?
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 5:59PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Dec 13, 2011
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Is that actually a hole? Endless Whispers says that the opponent puts the card onto the battlefield, so if the opponent doesn't exist anymore, I assume the card just stays in the graveyard.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 08, 2013 - 6:04PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2006
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Obviously, the Vampire stays in the Grave, but (I believe) no rule actually says what happens if an effect instructs a dead player to perform some action.
«Dystocracy : A system of government in which corrupt leadership colludes with dishonest bankers and greedy elites in order to ensure that productive members of society –people who actually do useful work- bear the greatest share of taxes while gaining the least benefit possible.»
Sounds familiar?
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