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Switch to Forum Live View [GTC-ICD] Boros Keyrune
5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 2:36PM #41
I-rock
Date Joined: Mar 31, 2002
Posts: 1,027

Jan 7, 2013 -- 2:11PM, BiNexus wrote:

Jan 7, 2013 -- 12:49PM, I-rock wrote:

Jan 7, 2013 -- 8:01AM, Darkwolfer2002 wrote:

Still better then Izzet Keyrune




I still don't get this, as although the Izzet Keyrune was weak compared to the others, it's hardly bad in the sense that people give it.  Frankly, the keyrunes are pretty much only useful for Limited play and casual circles.  And the fact is, Izzet keyrun is almost an auto-include if you're in those colors.  Its a decent card, just not as good as the rest.

That said, this one is probably going to be the most ridiculous keyrune in Draft/Sealed, particularly when coupled with bloodrush.  Get around sorcery speed removal, which can be relevant, and will only be subject to instant speed removal if you want it to be. 

That said, Bloodrush can be mono-red.  Which means you may not even have to splash for it.  Doubles the effectiveness of any of them, and you can be almost certain to have a pump spell in hand in sealed/draft. 

Frankly, this thing will have huge blow-outs, and will be first pickable in draft.





Rakdos Keyrune is definitely constructed viable, as it handily deals with things X/<=3 in="" addition="" to="" fixing="" and="" ramping="" for="" you="" i="" see="" dimir="" keyrune="" also="" being="" constructed="" viable="" the="" reason="" why="" people="" dislike="" izzet="" so="" much="" is="" because="" it="" can' t="" really="" attack="" unless="" your="" opponent="" has="" nothing="" play="" block="" favourably="" against="" anything="" who="" s="" gonna="" with="" a="" creature="" that="" hs="" 0="" power="" outside="" of="" em="">maybe Blood Artist ? So it's just an expensive mana rock compared to the other Keyrunes that can block and attack for you.

I don't think this Keyrune will be used in constructed much, if at all, but it's definitely a viable threat in limited.




Alright, granted on the Rakdos keyrune.  It has a niche role, and is constructed playable depending on the meta.  Granted, anyone who attacks into a Rakdos Keyrune with a Thragtusk probably isn't thinking to well, particularly if you haven't Cloudshift ed or Restoration Angel ed it multiple times.  So all this does is cause your opponent to durdle longer, which plays very well into the Strategy of Thragtusk.

As for Dimir Keyrune, I will agree it has potential, particularly if you are going Cipher vs. U/W control running Supreme Verdict.  Still, as Invisible stalker has shown us, being unblockable and an efficient one at that isn't really going to make you viable. So I'm not sure.  If there are good Cipher spells, perhaps U/B control could be a thing in standard.  However as a Damage dealer, its expensive, and as a ramper it's "meh".  So it really needs strong combat triggers to work well.

That said, there are then 4/5 from RTR that really don't have much of a place in standard, and are only good in Limited formats.  Selesnya keyrune is in a color which gets far better ramp for far cheaper, Golgari is in colors that really don't need the ramp currently, and the 2/2 deathtoucher is not necessarily what they want on the slow, Azorius is alright, however in a control deck you pretty much want to draw into answer and utility more than Mana sources/small creatures, and of course Izzet.

In RtR, we currently only have one Keyrune which *might* see play in Standard constructed.  Gruul will most certainly not, as once again it has more efficient ramp for cheaper *and* more efficient/effective creatures in those colors.

The boros Keyrune will be a monster in limited, as its on-color with Bloodrush.  That said, the fact that it won't see much constructed play isn't an issue, as the keyrunes in general don't (At least in standard:  IN casual, I can see all of them being used for the fun of it).

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5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 2:42PM #42
I-rock
Date Joined: Mar 31, 2002
Posts: 1,027

Jan 7, 2013 -- 2:22PM, Manite wrote:

Jan 7, 2013 -- 1:04PM, I-rock wrote:

Lobber crew doesn't target creatures. 



Jan 7, 2013 -- 1:05PM, Harmy52 wrote:

Lobber Crew doesn't hit creatures though? 




*Feeling embarassed*

Right you both are. So that's one less threat Boros Keyrune has to deal with. But my bro just reminded me of Izzet Staticaster , so that's still two accessible threats.




That is very true, particularly once Dragon's Maze comes out and block drafts are in.  The keyrune will definitely be far more vulnerable, both with Electrickery and Staticaster being viable threats against it.

That said, in GTC it will be a monster when played with Bloodrush.  If there is an efficient 1-drop damage spell, or something similar to Staticaster, it will be far less of a threat to certain archetypes.

Of course, this thing will plummet heavily if the opponent has any instant speed removal at all, but it also has the potential to be devastating.

Also, on this subject, am I the only that finds it odd that this seems to function far better with Bloodrush than with Battalion? 

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5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 3:17PM #43
Grumman
Date Joined: Jul 23, 2007
Posts: 889

Jan 7, 2013 -- 2:27PM, BiNexus wrote:

Also, is anyone else having problems editing posts? Every time I try, I get lots of quotation marks and equal signs behind my words and my punctuation is removed. Weird.



Your use of < = is being misinterpreted as html code.

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5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 3:19PM #44
BiNexus
Date Joined: Apr 20, 2012
Posts: 295
Ahh, ok. Thanks!
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5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 6:41PM #45
phaseshifter
Date Joined: Jul 19, 2001
Posts: 4,551
Dimir Key is a lot better in limited. You need to play 3 colors to have access to this and bloodrush, and you need a board position that allows you to sacrifice a threat in exchange of a pump effect.

Plus, you need a board position where your opponent would not block a 1/1 double strike (probably because they're unable to. Who'S going to let a double striker unblocked when their opponent has 5+ mana open?). And I doubt bloodrush will be costed agressively outside of rares. Common gruul creatures would have way too much value otherwise. So it's going to cost you a lof of mana.

I don't see it happening. I'll gladly pass this in draft.
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5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 7:09PM #46
I-rock
Date Joined: Mar 31, 2002
Posts: 1,027

Jan 7, 2013 -- 6:41PM, phaseshifter wrote:

Dimir Key is a lot better in limited. You need to play 3 colors to have access to this and bloodrush, and you need a board position that allows you to sacrifice a threat in exchange of a pump effect.

Plus, you need a board position where your opponent would not block a 1/1 double strike (probably because they're unable to. Who'S going to let a double striker unblocked when their opponent has 5+ mana open?). And I doubt bloodrush will be costed agressively outside of rares. Common gruul creatures would have way too much value otherwise. So it's going to cost you a lof of mana.

I don't see it happening. I'll gladly pass this in draft.




You don't necessarily need 3 colors to play bloodrush in limited.  There currently is at least one mono-red bloodrusher, and there'll likely be a couple more.  We already know that some of the bloodrushers are aggressively costed enough as is, such as the Swine.  Unless a +5/+4 for 3 cmc isn't "aggressive" on a 5 cmc *common* creature.  It's not Giant Growth aggressive, but it is aggressive enough.  It seems that bloodrush on common is at least manageable (Leaving 3 open to bloodrush the Swine isn't hard, and it's a great bluff if you don't have it in your hand).  Even if they don't let it through, it should do enough on its own to wipe the board continuosly with any much of buff at all.  Given that W/R is known for +X/+0 and +X/+X at instant speed, I'm willing to bet there will be some decent common and uncommon level buffs on it. 

As for Dimir Keyrune, I absolutely agree it is better in limited.  Far better, in fact.  I'm merely talking about Boros being able to make some huge swings.  Which it will, and I think it's perfectly fine as is.  1 extra toughness would not do anything for it, really, and 1 extra power would probably be a bit much on a double striker of this nature.

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5 months ago  ::  Jan 07, 2013 - 7:43PM #47
phaseshifter
Date Joined: Jul 19, 2001
Posts: 4,551

Jan 7, 2013 -- 7:09PM, I-rock wrote:

Jan 7, 2013 -- 6:41PM, phaseshifter wrote:

Dimir Key is a lot better in limited. You need to play 3 colors to have access to this and bloodrush, and you need a board position that allows you to sacrifice a threat in exchange of a pump effect.

Plus, you need a board position where your opponent would not block a 1/1 double strike (probably because they're unable to. Who'S going to let a double striker unblocked when their opponent has 5+ mana open?). And I doubt bloodrush will be costed agressively outside of rares. Common gruul creatures would have way too much value otherwise. So it's going to cost you a lof of mana.

I don't see it happening. I'll gladly pass this in draft.




You don't necessarily need 3 colors to play bloodrush in limited.  There currently is at least one mono-red bloodrusher, and there'll likely be a couple more.  We already know that some of the bloodrushers are aggressively costed enough as is, such as the Swine.  Unless a +5/+4 for 3 cmc isn't "aggressive" on a 5 cmc *common* creature.  It's not Giant Growth aggressive, but it is aggressive enough.  It seems that bloodrush on common is at least manageable (Leaving 3 open to bloodrush the Swine isn't hard, and it's a great bluff if you don't have it in your hand).  Even if they don't let it through, it should do enough on its own to wipe the board continuosly with any much of buff at all.  Given that W/R is known for +X/+0 and +X/+X at instant speed, I'm willing to bet there will be some decent common and uncommon level buffs on it. 

As for Dimir Keyrune, I absolutely agree it is better in limited.  Far better, in fact.  I'm merely talking about Boros being able to make some huge swings.  Which it will, and I think it's perfectly fine as is.  1 extra toughness would not do anything for it, really, and 1 extra power would probably be a bit much on a double striker of this nature.




I personally would never double block it. Unles I have 2 huge creatures untapped. If I control anything bigger than 2/2 i'll block withit, and my opponent can chose to save it with a combat trick or not. 

If you use the swine, then you'll need 3 colors. And using the bloodrush on it is not an easy decision. A 5 mana 5/4 body is extremely useful in limited. Turning it into a combat trick is a significant sacrifice, escpesially if the target has been blocked.  I think I'd probably hardacst it in most games where I'm not mana screwed and can't reach 5 mana.

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5 months ago  ::  Jan 08, 2013 - 1:31PM #48
blood77
  • UnCon Prizewinner 2008
Date Joined: Dec 19, 2006
Posts: 2,778

Jan 6, 2013 -- 9:06PM, Pontiac wrote:

a bit weak




Well yeah, considering that this would be some you might want to stick an enchantment on. But then again, it does kill all but 3 keyrunes aat the moment.

A keyrune, is a keyrune, is a keyrune.  


   
   
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