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5 months ago ::
Dec 24, 2012 - 2:18PM
#1
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The printed wording of both of these cards is templated in the same way, but the Oracle text is very different. Why the disparity?
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5 months ago ::
Dec 24, 2012 - 2:36PM
#2
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2005
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The printed wording of both of these cards is templated in the same way, but the Oracle text is very different. Why the disparity?
I assume you're asking about the 4th edition printed wording for the Vise and not the most recent printing?
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5 months ago ::
Dec 24, 2012 - 3:02PM
#3
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Does FtV count as a printing? Likely there are far more copies of 4th being played than FtV, at least.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 24, 2012 - 3:03PM
#4
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2005
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Does FtV count as a printing? Likely there are far more copies of 4th being played than FtV, at least.
I think it does. Even Master's Edition, which is only on MtGO counts as a printing if I remember right.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 24, 2012 - 5:53PM
#5
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Paupers' Cage said "target opponent". That indicates to me that you are supposed to choose a single opponent and only that player is affected. Paupers' Cage should be worded the same as Cursed Rack , Entropic Specter , and Haunting Apparition . New Paupers' Cage wording:As Paupers' Cage enters the battlefield, choose an opponent. At the beginning of the chosen player's upkeep, if that player has two or fewer cards in hand, Paupers' Cage deals 2 damage to him or her.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 25, 2012 - 6:01AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Jul 23, 2007
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Comparing Paupers' Cage to Cursed Rack , Entropic Specter and Haunting Apparition may not be convincing enough, despite their meaning of "target" being similar at the time. It could be argued these three cards have to work this way because their abilities are static and meant to function at all times (with Cursed Rack & Entropic Specter having CDAs and Cursed Rack having a rule-changing ability). So while these abilities have to lock-on to a single player from the start to work properly, Paupers' Cage ability could work either way. It's not just the use of a "target", but also the way the trigger condition is defined by that "target" which is compareable to the fourth edition printing of Black Vise and The Rack *. The printed text of Discordant Spirit and Miser's Cage also define their trigger condition by a "target", so they too are up for consideration. *(which I think had their lock-on oracle even before being reprinted in a modern release, from what I could find on Yawgatog)
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5 months ago ::
Dec 25, 2012 - 5:11PM
#7
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The printed text of Discordant Spirit and Miser's Cage also define their trigger condition by a "target", so they too are up for consideration.
I think those cards should also be changed to affect only a single player.
Here is my list of cards that say target and should affect only a single player.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 25, 2012 - 6:30PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Dec 29, 2010
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The printed text of Discordant Spirit and Miser's Cage also define their trigger condition by a "target", so they too are up for consideration.
I think those cards should also be changed to affect only a single player.
Here is my list of cards that say target and should affect only a single player.
They must changed all of those cards to mean "each" opponent for a reason. When those cards were printed, the concept of grand multiplayer formats like Planechase or Commander didn't exist. What if the intended functionality of "target opponent" in the context of a triggered ability was that any time the trigger would occur for any given opponent, it should?
The comparisons are apples to oranges. These are all triggered abilities, which were errata'd the same way, while things like Entropic Specter and Cursed Rack are static abilities.
Can someone find a card with a triggered ability with "target opponent" in it that was not changed to "each opponent"?
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5 months ago ::
Dec 25, 2012 - 8:18PM
#9
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Can someone find a card with a triggered ability with "target opponent" in it that was not changed to "each opponent"?
I think Cursed Rack 's ability was a triggered ability at the time of its printing. I do not think it was treated any differently than Antagonism 's ability.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 26, 2012 - 2:52AM
#10
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Date Joined:
Jul 23, 2007
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Interestingly, we also have Energy Vortex in Mirage, which says: "When you play Energy Vortex, choose target opponent." This can shows, on one hand, that Mirage was made with the possibility of multiple opponents in mind. But on the other hand, it can also show that this is the remplate for choosing one player from the start, so cards like Paupers' Cage a refering to any opponent and not a specific one, as KyCygni suggested. But then the question goes backwards: Why were Black Vise and The Rack made to choose one opponent and not trigger for each opponent? Also, the use of "target" to refer to an opponent is still puzzling.
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