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If I use Rakdos's Return for 2 and my opponent has 4 cards in their hand, if they discard Loxodon Smiter will it hit the battlefield?  

If it would not, then if my opponent only had 2 cards in their hand and I hit them with Rakdos's Return for 2, then it would it the battlefield?

The reason I am asking is because Loxodon Smiter says, "causes you to discard Loxodon Smiter".  This may be a stretch but, I would not technically be causing them to discard Loxodon since they have 2 more cards in their hand to choose from in the first example.  In the second example, I am forcing them to discard all them have, so Loxodon Smiter is being forced to discard then.  

Thanks 

Nov 18, 2012 -- 9:38AM, pandawolf56 wrote:

If I use Rakdos's Return for 2 and my opponent has 4 cards in their hand, if they discard Loxodon Smiter will it hit the battlefield?  

Yes, the discarded Loxodon Smiter will be put on the battlefield instead of the graveyard.

It was discarded because of a spell controlled by an opponent.

If it would not, then if my opponent only had 2 cards in their hand and I hit them with Rakdos's Return for 2, then it would it the battlefield?

Yes.

The reason I am asking is because Loxodon Smiter says, "causes you to discard Loxodon Smiter".  This may be a stretch but, I would not technically be causing them to discard Loxodon since they have 2 more cards in their hand to choose from in the first example.  In the second example, I am forcing them to discard all them have, so Loxodon Smiter is being forced to discard then.  

Your spell caused the discard. That's all that matters. Smiter doesn't care who choose which card is discarded, just who controls the spell/ability that asks the player to discard a card.

If the opponent uses an effect that allows you to choose to discard any card, you can choose any card you please.  If that card has an "If an opponent causes you to discard..." effect, that triggers.  It doesn't matter if you could have chosen a different card.  You discarded it, and the cause of the discard was an opponent-controlled effect - enter one free Loxodon Smiter.

That is what I figured.  I knew it would be a stretch.

Thanks 

Nov 18, 2012 -- 9:43AM, thatmarkguy wrote:

If the opponent uses an effect that allows you to choose to discard any card, you can choose any card you please.  If that card has an "If an opponent causes you to discard..." effect, that triggers replacement effect applies.  It doesn't matter if you could have chosen a different card.  You discarded it, and the cause of the discard was an opponent-controlled effect - enter one free Loxodon Smiter.

fixed