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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 2:02PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Jun 27, 2012
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I read so many threads here where people go back and forth trying to one up each other and always there are the claims of being better than everyone else thrown about.
Someone correct me if I am wrong, but my logic tells me that there is a limit as to how good you can play this game during any match. Logic is the key word here. I've never played Magic in any form before but now that I am playing I have realized its a game well suited to how my brain works, which is I like to think, logically. A lot of people tell me they assume Ive been playing for a long time, but I haven't, my brain is just good at analysing a situation and deciding what the most logical choice would be. I use a good deck, I play the deck the best way possible and people think Im good. I don't think Im good at Magic. I just think I use logic well.
Pre expansion I used Pack Instinct till I learned better, then I used Peacekeepers until I started playing 2HG which is all I play now and I use the most logically usefull 2HG deck, Crosswinds. I do enjoy using other decks including some of the expansion decks, but nothing aggravates me more than using another deck while my opponent uses CW against me, I feel so damn defenseless!
Now don't get me wrong, I believe there are various levels of skill in different players. But I believe that skill level has a finite range. Once you have reached a skill level that allows you to have a 100% understanding of the game, your ability to use that understanding is down to your ability to always make the most logical, "best" choice on what to play and when.
What I mean by 100% understanding is specifically how each and every card in every deck works and how much it costs to play. If you are a serious player like I consider myself now, then you will have unlocked all the decks by playing all the required matches. Combine that with the 100's of matches a serious player is likely to play and you should have a good grasp of every card in the game. There are a lot, but again its a finite number and no where near an impossible task to achieve.
I'll pass lightly over the "skill" of deck building to say: logically speaking there is a "best" deck to be built to suit your playing style and objectives. The forum is filled with deck strategy discussions, and in the end, for any particular playing style the question always comes down to the inclusion or exclusion of 1-3 cards. This means its simply not possible for any player to build a deck that is "always" going to be better than any deck its going to face.
So you have the best deck for your playstyle and a random drawing of 7 cards, from that point on you can only play what you are given. If logic dictates there is always a best card to play and you do that, how can you do any better?
I make this point because of a match last night. I was playing with my regular partner and we lost to a couple of guys who beat us pretty well because we both had pretty bad draws. We stuck it out and took our loss. In the next game we had much better draws and were well on our way to winning when one of them quit. I sent a text message to the guy whose named popped up as having quit, saying "lol quitter" and got back a voice message saying how good the guy was and how high ranked he was and how he put it on us the first round and the second round we got lucky and his random partner was terrible, bla bla bla.
It got me thinking, what makes him think hes so much better than me? I get my cards and I play the best card possible every time. Usually I (we) win and sometimes we don't. As long as I feel I played every card correctly (and my partner does the same) the losses dont bother me. You are not always going to get the cards you need to win the game no matter how good you are.
Its just like the challenges. They all have a solution and if you play your cards right you beat the challenge. Does being better at the game enable you to beat those challenges in some other way? No. You're given some cards and you either make the right choices or you dont.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 2:14PM
#2
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Date Joined:
Oct 21, 2012
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This game as in Duels 2013 or Magic the Gathering as a whole?
Duels has a very low skill cap because of the lack of deck customization so yeah I agree with ya there.
Really like to see the ability to create our own decks in future DLC.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 2:26PM
#3
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What platform do you play on?
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 2:32PM
#4
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Date Joined:
Aug 26, 2012
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I don't think that a highly logical and intelligent player would also be the type to send a message saying "lol quitter".
I detect a flaw in your reasoning, sir.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 2:52PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Mar 30, 2010
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Once you have the gameplay down and make the best plays based on your current information, it all comes down to your draw. The only way to increase the chance for the right cards to show up is good deck building. That's why most of the discussions are about the deck building and not how to play the decks.
Your gameplay skills will eventually reach a limit. Proper deckbuilding is a little more complex imo, but with such a limited selection of cards, the difference between a good deck and a superb one isn't as big as it would be in other formats with thousands of cards to choose from. This results in a higher chance to get screwed against scrubs than I would like.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 3:11PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Jun 27, 2012
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This game as in Duels 2013 or Magic the Gathering as a whole?
Duels 2013 because of the built in restrictions.
What platform do you play on?
Xbox360
I don't think that a highly logical and intelligent player would also be the type to send a message saying "lol quitter".
I detect a flaw in your reasoning, sir.
The flaw in your hypothesis is that I never claimed to be intelligent, only logical. The dumb side of me enjoys sending a two word message to a guy when those two words alone provoke three ranting voice message replys. Highly illogical behaviour, the voice message rant.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 4:49PM
#7
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tl;dr
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 4:57PM
#8
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Actually, it's a parabole. You CAN become better, but it only worsens your play. When you're too skilled, you're thinking too much "I just know he has X card in his hand, so I better do this!", with this "this" always being a not fully optimal play. Do this too much, and you lose if your opponent is also skilled, but not to the point he's worrying about what might be in your hand.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 5:26PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Jun 27, 2012
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Actually, it's a parabole. You CAN become better, but it only worsens your play. When you're too skilled, you're thinking too much "I just know he has X card in his hand, so I better do this!", with this "this" always being a not fully optimal play. Do this too much, and you lose if your opponent is also skilled, but not to the point he's worrying about what might be in your hand.
As convoluted as that sounds I see what you are saying, but again thats where the logic comes in.
Case in point, I have 5 lands played and 2 cards, a Time Warp and a Mirror. My opponent playing Crosswinds has 5 cards in his hand and three untapped lands. I say to myself, "logically speaking I have to assume he has a Cancel in his hand." That makes the Mirror the logical choice since without the Mirror you can still cast Time Warp, and now you know your opponent has at least one less Cancel. Not worrying about what my opponent has and casting the Time Warp and having it not get canceled may have put me in a better position to win but I dont feel it would be the logical choice.
In this particular instance the guy did cancel my Mirror. On his next turn he used all but two of his land to play his Archeomancer, which he used to get his Cancel back. On my turn I made the logical decision that since he didnt use a Mana Leak to cancel the Mirror and since he got a Cancel from the graveyard I could freely play my Time Warp, which I did. It went through, and we went on to win the match.
If my opponent is not worrying about what I have in my hand then he is not playing logically.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 21, 2012 - 9:56PM
#10
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Meh, it's like being good at poker. There is always an optimal play based on what you know, and an actual optimal play. Sometimes the one you know is the best, sometimes it isn't. The great players know what the optimal play is based on what you know. The best players are the great players that get lucky and guess what the actual right play is too.
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