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11 months ago ::
Aug 20, 2012 - 12:22PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Sep 26, 2011
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I will explain to all of you why Vintage is a bad format and why the other formats outthere are all better.
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- A lot of the core cards are very costly. If you are not able to spare a total of the Large Sum of $7000 on the Power 9 and Mana Crypt and Library of Alexandria and the Original Duals and Mishra's Workshops and Tolarian Academies and Mana Drain then you will be struggling to make a Viable Vintage Deck.
- A lot of over powerful Cards are restricted. Seriously I do not get why this decision was made. It just creates a lot of extra luck when 12 of the Best Cards are inconsistently drawn and putts Vintage on the top of the luck matters spectrum.
- Old-uns are legal. This creatures weird games. Even though they do not see play, expansion matters cards are just silly.
- Many decks win on turn 2-3 Consistently. This means that in 75% of cases the dice roll is what decides who wins where it is about 30% in nearby legacy and just a meager 5% in Standard and Extended with 10% in Modern.
Blocks I liked: (+1) Invasion Onslaught Mirrodin Time Spiral Lorwyn Zendikar Return to Ravnica Blocks I disliked: (-1) Oddesy Champions of Kamigawa Time Echoes Innistrad Any Released Blocks not listed in this Sig Blocks I neutralize: (+/-0) Ravnica City of Guilds Shadowmoor Shards of Alara Scars of Mirrodin http://community.wizards.com/paranoia
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11 months ago ::
Aug 20, 2012 - 6:02PM
#2
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Date Joined:
May 17, 2012
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11 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 9:42AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Dec 10, 2006
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Do you play Vintage Zokorad?
Can you honestly tell me that it does not make sense that black lotus was restricted, along side ancestral recall? Could you imagine 4 of each in a vintage deck? I think it stands to reason why those cards were restricted a long time ago and it has not made sense to un-restrict them since.
Prohibitive cost is about the only argument you have going for you here.
Just playing devil's advocate here.
Cheers,
Malph
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11 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 11:15AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Sep 26, 2011
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Do you play Vintage Zokorad?
Can you honestly tell me that it does not make sense that black lotus was restricted, along side ancestral recall? Could you imagine 4 of each in a vintage deck? I think it stands to reason why those cards were restricted a long time ago and it has not made sense to un-restrict them since.
Prohibitive cost is about the only argument you have going for you here.
Just playing devil's advocate here.
Cheers,
Malph
I makes things more luck based.
Blocks I liked: (+1) Invasion Onslaught Mirrodin Time Spiral Lorwyn Zendikar Return to Ravnica Blocks I disliked: (-1) Oddesy Champions of Kamigawa Time Echoes Innistrad Any Released Blocks not listed in this Sig Blocks I neutralize: (+/-0) Ravnica City of Guilds Shadowmoor Shards of Alara Scars of Mirrodin http://community.wizards.com/paranoia
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11 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 1:43PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Dec 10, 2006
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In an environment where everyone had access to the same cards, luck is equal on most levels and deck construction isn't straight forward. In a perfect world, of course.
I'm sure the vets around here could give you a better idea of the format, as I only own the cards and have not played the format competitively in a long time.
MTGS would probably be a better place to discuss this stuff though, as their vintage community is bigger.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 10:16PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Apr 21, 2010
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As a Vintage veteran, all of your arguments, despite being trolling, are so incorrect that I feel I must respond. Sorry for giving you the response you're trolling for.
Cost is not an issue in Vintage. I went undefeated in a Mox Ruby-prize tournament with a $50 deck. I beat 2 U/B Storm decks, another MUD deck, and the Fish deck that had won the last major event.
Luck is not a factor, either in inconsistencies or turn 2 wins. Vintage games consistently go past turn 6-7. They do. Turn 1 combo decks get stopped by the omnipresent Force of Will, or by Sphere of Resistance, or by Cabal Therapy or Mindbreak Trap or Stifle or Flusterstorm or Thalia or Trinisphere or Lodestone Golem or Chalice of the Void. I know, because I play a turn 2 combo deck and even when I win fast, I have to fight through hate to do it.
As for inconsistencies in the power cards, that isn't a factor at all. I've won games with powerless decks, much less powerless hands in decks that use power. An opening hand of [ESG, Hermit Druid, Bayou, Cabal Therapy, Force, Force, Narcomoeba] is perfectly fine against a hand of [Mox, Mox, Thalia, SoR, Bob, Plains, Marsh Flats]. The fact that I didn't draw my power and he did, means nothing if my deck is well constructed. Not only that, most decks are highly consistent because they run a high saturation of tutors and draw spells.
I do not appreciate your trolling in other forums, but I take it especially unkindly that you are attemtping to move into my home in the Eternal forums, and doing it with the most blasé ignorance you can muster. Please either leave, or stop being a troll.
Etiamnunc sto, etiamsi caelum ruat.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 6:52AM
#7
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Date Joined:
Dec 10, 2006
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Could just report him, I guess.
As well, I had no idea you played so much T1, SC. I've seen your post of that hermit druid / Sutured Ghoul / */* guy who's name I forgot. I like the deck, actually. Do you do your testing on Cockatrice?
I've been trying to make a mud deck recently; just have to finish getting my last workshop. Sadly, vintage tournament scene in Edmonton is terrible. Only a few friends and I actually own the card base.
Something seems odd about his post, like he's pasted from MS Word or something. Someone else's argument.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 5:12PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Apr 21, 2010
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Oh, I'm glad you like it. it's a pretty fun deck. Getting harder to play around with though, now that Thalia Parfait is a thing, Mana Drain is coming back, and Grafdigger's Cage has been printed =/ I have been considering running a different win package from Sutured Ghoul so that I can win on upkeep without swinging.
I do some testing on Cockatrice, but mostly with my group of friends and proxy-filled sleeves.
Sorry to hear about the lack of support in your area; you should consider Proxy tournaments (99% of Vintage events are 10-15 proxies here, hence why money is not an issue). Help your friends who don't have the cards get used to the format with fully- or mostly-proxied decks, then run events where they can skip paying for the 10 most expensive cards. Try to build up interest in several local game shops and maybe get a weekly or monthly thing going.
Etiamnunc sto, etiamsi caelum ruat.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 5:13PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Nov 10, 2009
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I will explain to all of you why Vintage is a bad format and why the other formats outthere are all better.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
- A lot of the core cards are very costly. If you are not able to spare a total of the Large Sum of $7000 on the Power 9 and Mana Crypt and Library of Alexandria and the Original Duals and Mishra's Workshops and Tolarian Academies and Mana Drain then you will be struggling to make a Viable Vintage Deck.
- A lot of over powerful Cards are restricted. Seriously I do not get why this decision was made. It just creates a lot of extra luck when 12 of the Best Cards are inconsistently drawn and putts Vintage on the top of the luck matters spectrum.
- Old-uns are legal. This creatures weird games. Even though they do not see play, expansion matters cards are just silly.
- Many decks win on turn 2-3 Consistently. This means that in 75% of cases the dice roll is what decides who wins where it is about 30% in nearby legacy and just a meager 5% in Standard and Extended with 10% in Modern.
Spoken like someone who has never actually played Vintage! Jealous much.
STEP 1: Find your cousin
STEP 2: Get your cousin in the cannon
STEP: 3 Find another cousin
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10 months ago ::
Sep 03, 2012 - 7:46AM
#10
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Date Joined:
May 17, 2012
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No need to call the OP a troll, Vintage clearly does have some issues, it's not the most popular of formats. On the other hand there are good counterpoints as well.
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