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Switch to Forum Live View 07/02/2012 MM: "Old Timers"
12 months ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 2:22PM #21
prophet666
Date Joined: Oct 16, 2008
Posts: 53
Cascade as a mechanic can be "fixed" by increasing the mana cost of the spell with the mechanic, because it makes the value of the "free" spell considerably more variable.  Cascade-into-Hypergenesis/LivingEnd/RestoreBalance is brutal because it's deterministic *and* you can build a reasonable deck around 3-cost cascade spells.  If the minimal cost for a cascade spell were 4, it would be a lot harder to make that deck work; you could be dead before you got to play it, since you can't do anything but play lands until then.

Bloodbraid Elf is broken because it's a 3/2 with haste and a rider (which could be a discard-two-cards-take-3-damage optimally), not because the rider mechanic is broken itself.
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12 months ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 3:25PM #22
davidhuman
Date Joined: Oct 14, 2008
Posts: 72
was the free mechanic ever tried as 'Add mana equal to this cards casting cost to your mana pool' or some variation of?  i feel like if it was done that way, and kept mostly to reactive cards it might still be fun, but not too good.
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12 months ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 3:30PM #23
TimeBecomes
Date Joined: Apr 10, 2007
Posts: 16
Deconstruct coexisted with Mind's Desire and Chrome Mox in Standard and completely failed to break anything, so yes.
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12 months ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 4:20PM #24
SadisticMystic
Date Joined: Aug 6, 2003
Posts: 1,085

Jul 2, 2012 -- 3:25PM, davidhuman wrote:

was the free mechanic ever tried as 'Add mana equal to this cards casting cost to your mana pool' or some variation of?  i feel like if it was done that way, and kept mostly to reactive cards it might still be fun, but not too good.



Blue had the free spells as you know them in Urza block, but Black also got a one-off in that block, Priest of Gix (later shifted to Red as Priest of Urabrask ) which saw minor play as a combo piece. They tried giving Green some of that treatment in Mirrodin ( Deconstruct and Turn to Dust ), which never went anywhere.

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12 months ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 6:04PM #25
Alias402
Date Joined: Jun 26, 2012
Posts: 775
Stupid core set, id imagen t2 is going to have even less turnouts now.

Nothing fun to play with other than "Pick me and build around this guy" type crap.
Stop deleting my posts you jackwagon!
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MTGS, for all your nazi loving needs.
Thank you SO much for turning Magic standard into Yugioh.
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Legacy TezzFinity
Modern Burn
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EDH - Heartless Hidetsugu
T2-dead

Jul 9, 2012 -- 7:22PM, CadaverousBl00m wrote:


Yes, but DOES HE PEE COLOURLESS MANA?



Modern is not an eternal format!
https://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=judge/resources/banned

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12 months ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 7:19PM #26
Qilong
Date Joined: Nov 18, 2004
Posts: 2,226

Jul 2, 2012 -- 7:39AM, TobyornotToby wrote:

Jul 2, 2012 -- 5:23AM, SadisticMystic wrote:

Probably because to truly make it a cycle, you would end up needing a blue card that said "Destroy target planeswalker", and no way in hell R&D would print that on anything with a Magic card-back.




Because of the text or because it's blue? 2 cards in that 'cycle' are red, and green doesn't have a card either. I'm sure one day we'll get "destroy target planeswalker", as either a green card (which can destroy noncreature permanents) or a black card (which can destroy creatures (flavor) and can remove counters (function).




I'm thinking that there isa  very simple way to do this:

White - destroy target enchantment. White gets Demystify for this at baseline.
Blue - counter target spell. Blue gets that catch-all Cancel , a preemptive "destroy" effect.
Black - destroy target creature. " Murder , Marge: A group of crows is a murder ."
Red - destroy target land. Craterize seems a neat way to avoid the issue of Stone Rain being too good at 3 mana (if you're on the play, you can cripple your opponent in limited with a shot at two or three of SRs, but at 4, Craterizes gives the opponent the ability to Cancel it).
Green - destroy target artifact. Green has Verdigris , but it is strictly worse than Oxidize on two levels.

If each of the colors got MERELY "destroy target [permanent type]," without overlap, to set new baselines this is what they'd be (excepting Blue, which would have to settle for something like Essence Scatter ). However, if each color got at baseline a method to deal with a given permanent type but not just destroy it, Erase comes closer to being more useful than Demystify , if more unwieldy.

I do not think any ONE color should get "destroy target planeswalker" as a basic spell; if anything, that as a basic spell should be three mana, and be two-colored (say, ). That this card would be limited even in Limited should mean the spell should be uncommon, if not rare, given the narrowness of its application (i.e., a sideboard card).

"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count."

"Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969)

"Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)
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12 months ago  ::  Jul 03, 2012 - 12:55AM #27
Nyktos
Date Joined: Oct 11, 2007
Posts: 3,343

Jul 2, 2012 -- 12:29AM, Rekmar wrote:

Would love to hear the reason as to why Birds of Paradise and Llanowar Elves got the chop in the same set rather than the history lesson behind Rancor.



Elves got swapped out for Arbor Elf . This was, of course, just for a change of pace and not at all because Forests that do things other than tap for are going to be in Standard soon.

Birds, as mentioned, is possibly in Return to Ravnica, just like it was in the original Ravnica. Perhaps they thought it was necessary for Block Constructed purposes.

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12 months ago  ::  Jul 03, 2012 - 1:55AM #28
TobyornotToby
Date Joined: Mar 7, 2006
Posts: 2,313
What would be possible is a card like Befoul but for planeswalkers. "Destroy target creature or planeswalker" makes sense as a black kill spell. 

I agree green should have a colorshifted Smelt as well. 
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12 months ago  ::  Jul 03, 2012 - 2:06AM #29
Qmark
  • vitriol and virtue
Date Joined: May 18, 2002
Posts: 16,540

Jul 2, 2012 -- 7:19PM, Qilong wrote:

I do not think any ONE color should get "destroy target planeswalker" as a basic spell; if anything, that as a basic spell should be three mana, and be two-colored (say, ).


Yeah... they actually made that card quite a while ago.

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12 months ago  ::  Jul 03, 2012 - 2:26AM #30
Qilong
Date Joined: Nov 18, 2004
Posts: 2,226

Jul 3, 2012 -- 2:06AM, Qmark wrote:

Jul 2, 2012 -- 7:19PM, Qilong wrote:

I do not think any ONE color should get "destroy target planeswalker" as a basic spell; if anything, that as a basic spell should be three mana, and be two-colored (say, ).


Yeah... they actually made that card quite a while ago.


I am talking about a narrow, not overpowered card, to establish baseline, in the core set. The existence of Counterspell does not preclude that of Cancel , and the same reasoning should apply to "baseline" costs, types, and cards.

"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count."

"Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969)

"Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)
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