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Switch to Forum Live View 05/21/2012 Feature: "Inside Planechase"
1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 7:28AM #21
adeyke
  • Celestial Teapots are broken!
Date Joined: Feb 24, 2007
Posts: 9,452

May 21, 2012 -- 4:32AM, GreenBuster wrote:

I have no issue with cards such as Fractured Powerstone or Command Tower.   I am just fine with a card having an additional effect in a casual format.  

I do agree that Command Tower should have had some effect within the normal game, but as it only goes in EDH decks there really wouldn't be an issue with suddenly having a blank card in the deck.

 Fractured Powerstone, on the other hand, is basically a Mind Stone without the card drawing effect and has additional use if the deck is used with planechase cards.  I see no issue with that.




I view it as the difference between the normal Lego blocks (e.g. 2x4 yellow, 1x1 white) and the more specialized ones (e.g. Gringott's sign).  It's true that the Gringott's sign doesn't harm any Lego creations, since those that aren't Gringott's will just not include the Gringott's sign, but at the same time, those ultra-specialized pieces diminish the modularity of Lego, which is what makes it so great.  If it were taken to the extreme, with each piece special-made for one particular set, those sets could look incredibly detailed and accurate, but they'd be that much less useful for new creations.

As it stands, Magic cards are intercompatible, and the same cards can be used in every variant (though some will not have the same power level everywhere).  Command Tower , however, isn't a Magic card: it's a Commander Magic card.  It's not just that its ability isn't as powerful outside the Commander variant; it's that it's completely meaningless (and of literally no value) there.  Ditto for Fractured Powerstone 's second ability and the Planechase variant.  They're the Gringott's sign of Magic.

I don't think one or two (or four, if you count the multiplayer-specific abilities on [c]such cards are the end of the world, but I don't want them to start a trend.

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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 10:14AM #22
GreenBuster
Date Joined: Oct 7, 2008
Posts: 889

May 21, 2012 -- 7:23AM, gonzoron wrote:

So maybe I missed this somewhere, since I don't care much about Planechase, but what happens if I build a plane deck of 10 Phenomena and 0 planes?  This isn't possible yet, I guess, since there are only 8 phenomena being printed, but one would assume that wouldn't be the limiting factor forever.   Would you get stuck in an infinite loop?  Would the planar deck creation rules forbid it by limiting the number of phenomena in a deck?

As is, I could play one of each phenomenon and just the two planes that I want to play in combo with Spatial Merging, and I'd be guaranteed to always be on one plane or the other, or both, no?

Oh, and one more thing: Phenomena!  Doo-doo-de-doo-doo! 




"901.3. In addition to the normal game materials, each player needs a planar deck of at least ten plane cards and the game needs one planar die. Each card in a planar deck must have a different English name."


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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 10:31AM #23
adeyke
  • Celestial Teapots are broken!
Date Joined: Feb 24, 2007
Posts: 9,452

May 21, 2012 -- 10:14AM, GreenBuster wrote:

"901.3. In addition to the normal game materials, each player needs a planar deck of at least ten plane cards and the game needs one planar die. Each card in a planar deck must have a different English name."




That quote is from the current rules, and we know it'll be different when the rules are updated for Planechase 2012.  We just don't know exactly how yet.

The old planar decks didn't have phenomena, so for backwards compatibility, 10:0 will almost certainly still be legal, and the new planar decks have two phenomena, so 8:2 will also be legal.  If those are both legal, 9:1 will probably also be legal.  And the infinite loop means that 0:10 will almost certainly not be legal.  Aside from that, though, it's guesswork.  It could well be that there need to be at least 10 distinct cards, of which at least 8 are planes, but I don't think we should jump to conclusions either way yet.

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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 2:14PM #24
Dragon_Nut
Date Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 2,136
I feel obliged to point out that since this is in not a format you're going to be seeing at tournaments anywhere, the answer to "What can your Plane deck look like?" is "Whatever you want." If 2:8 Planes:Phenomenon is decided to be against the rules, but your playgroup decides that it's the most fun way to play, there's nothing stopping you from doing that.
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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 3:01PM #25
Qmark
  • vitriol and virtue
Date Joined: May 18, 2002
Posts: 16,748
Call me crazy here, but "at least ten plane cards" could very well remain "at least ten plane cards".
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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 3:52PM #26
chronego
Date Joined: Jul 6, 2011
Posts: 1,290

May 21, 2012 -- 3:01PM, Qmark wrote:

Call me crazy here, but "at least ten plane cards" could very well remain "at least ten plane cards".


Not if the products are shipping with 8 plane cards and 2 phenomena each. They're not going to ship a product that is marketed as "all you need to play this format" and make it illegal in that format...

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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 3:59PM #27
Qmark
  • vitriol and virtue
Date Joined: May 18, 2002
Posts: 16,748

May 21, 2012 -- 3:52PM, chronego wrote:

May 21, 2012 -- 3:01PM, Qmark wrote:

Call me crazy here, but "at least ten plane cards" could very well remain "at least ten plane cards".


Not if the products are shipping with 8 plane cards and 2 phenomena each. They're not going to ship a product that is marketed as "all you need to play this format" and make it illegal in that format...


There's a difference between playing straight out of the box, and 'rolling your own'. 
More than likely, a variant on the War of Attrition Exception will be invoked again.

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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 5:15PM #28
Dragon_Nut
Date Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 2,136

May 21, 2012 -- 3:59PM, Qmark wrote:

May 21, 2012 -- 3:52PM, chronego wrote:

May 21, 2012 -- 3:01PM, Qmark wrote:

Call me crazy here, but "at least ten plane cards" could very well remain "at least ten plane cards".


Not if the products are shipping with 8 plane cards and 2 phenomena each. They're not going to ship a product that is marketed as "all you need to play this format" and make it illegal in that format...


There's a difference between playing straight out of the box, and 'rolling your own'. 
More than likely, a variant on the War of Attrition Exception will be invoked again.



It's still unlikely they'll do that. Planechase is a casual format like Commander. There's a reason the Commander banned list is so short: It's expected that each playgroup will play at a level they're all comfortable with. Since there are no official Planechase tournaments, the concern of having a product that's 'officially legal' even once you've mixed and matched with other out-of-the-box products trumps the concern of possibly unfun situations.

After all, if one player in a playgroup builds a Plane deck that the rest of the players consider unfun, the rest of the players aren't going to keep playing Planechase with him unless he changes it. Self-regulation works when the only goal is 'fun'. 

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1 year ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 12:59AM #29
Evaders99
Date Joined: Jun 4, 2011
Posts: 28
Anyone hoped we'd get our tribal Werewolf commander? guess not...
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1 year ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 3:43AM #30
chucklezdaccc
Date Joined: Feb 27, 2007
Posts: 260
Only one other person had the same question off the bat as me?  When are we getting this on MTGO?  I have limited funds, and Im going with the option thats best for me, and thats online.  I cant split my collection.  (I wish I could though.)  Anyway, We want this on Magic Online. 
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