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Switch to Forum Live View A decent Vampire deck, now that AR is out?
1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 2:53AM #1
Kaden_Shadows
Date Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 115
So, I want to add a few cards from Avacyn Restored to my vamps, but... I can't seem to find a spot for them! Help me out here?

I'd like it if I could run:
Blood Artist
Falkenrath Exterminator
Havengul Vampire

So...any ideas? Are any of those completely useless? And so on.

Here's the current decklist I have:

Creatures 20

2 Olivia Voldaren
2 Bloodline Keeper
4 Stromkirk Captain
4 Stromkirk Noble
2 Bloodlord of Vaasgoth
4 Rakish Heir
2 Markov Blademaster

Noncreature Spells: 18
2 Sphere of the Suns
1 Brimstone Volley
4 Volt Charge
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
2 Furor of the Bitten
4 Tragic Slip
3 Tezzeret's Gambit

Lands 22
4 Clifftop Retreat
9 Swamp
Mountain
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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 3:25AM #2
The_Craft
Date Joined: May 16, 2012
Posts: 3
I wouldn't put in havangul vampire
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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 3:31AM #3
Kaden_Shadows
Date Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 115

May 16, 2012 -- 3:25AM, The_Craft wrote:

I wouldn't put in havangul vampire


Fair enough, any other ideas? The only one I'm really concerned with is Blood Artist, honestly. The other two simply seemed fun, you know?

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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 4:14AM #4
zpikduM
Date Joined: Nov 11, 2009
Posts: 2,052
Fix your curve.

Vampires is meant to be an aggressive to midrange deck.

You probably want:
4 x 1 drop [Stromkirk Noble]
8 x 2 drop [Blood Artist, Falkenrath Exterminator]
8 x 3 drop [Markov Blademaster, Stromkirk Captain]
3 x 4 drop [Olivia Voldaren]

This will make your turns really smooth.

In terms of the burn suite.
you want Pillar of Flame.
Volt Charge is powerful with Exterminator/Blademaster/Noble

In the sideboard I suggest putting Bloodline Keeper for control.
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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 4:18AM #5
Kaden_Shadows
Date Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 115

May 16, 2012 -- 4:14AM, zpikduM wrote:

Fix your curve.

Vampires is meant to be an aggressive to midrange deck.

You probably want:
4 x 1 drop [Stromkirk Noble]
8 x 2 drop [Blood Artist, Falkenrath Exterminator]
8 x 3 drop [Markov Blademaster, Stromkirk Captain]
3 x 4 drop [Olivia Voldaren]

This will make your turns really smooth.

In terms of the burn suite.
you want Pillar of Flame.
Volt Charge is powerful with Exterminator/Blademaster/Noble

In the sideboard I suggest putting Bloodline Keeper for control.


OK, I'm not sure I have 4 Falkenrath, and I know I don't have 3 Olivia. Any ideas for subs?

Also, what to do about Bloodlord? He's great, I thought...?

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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 4:24AM #6
zpikduM
Date Joined: Nov 11, 2009
Posts: 2,052
Look at the other relevant turn 4's in the format:
Wolf Run Ramp : Primeval Titan
Delver : Equip Runechanter's Pike , stab you. alternately, Lingering Souls flash back, Pike.

These are much more powerful plays then your turn 5 play in Bloodlord.
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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 4:36AM #7
Kaden_Shadows
Date Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 115

May 16, 2012 -- 4:24AM, zpikduM wrote:

Look at the other relevant turn 4's in the format:
Wolf Run Ramp : Primeval Titan
Delver : Equip Runechanter's Pike , stab you. alternately, Lingering Souls flash back, Pike.

These are much more powerful plays then your turn 5 play in Bloodlord.


Only problem with the ones you've given (And I know not where to go to research relevant 4's, I'm fairly new) is that they use off color mana. I only have 2 Sphere of the Suns, you think that'll be enough help?

EDIT:

And by enough help, I mean enough off color mana to reliably play those creatures?

Also, here's what I'm thinking now:

4 Noble
4 Blood Artist
4 Exterminator (if I have them.)
4 Blademaster
4 Captain
2 Olivia
1 ?

Drop Brimstone volley for Pillar.

Sound alright so far?

Thanks for all the help, as well.

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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 5:02AM #8
Eonblueapocalypse1
Date Joined: Dec 17, 2010
Posts: 1,713

May 16, 2012 -- 4:36AM, Kaden_Shadows wrote:

May 16, 2012 -- 4:24AM, zpikduM wrote:

Look at the other relevant turn 4's in the format:
Wolf Run Ramp : Primeval Titan
Delver : Equip Runechanter's Pike , stab you. alternately, Lingering Souls flash back, Pike.

These are much more powerful plays then your turn 5 play in Bloodlord.


Only problem with the ones you've given (And I know not where to go to research relevant 4's, I'm fairly new) is that they use off color mana. I only have 2 Sphere of the Suns, you think that'll be enough help?




Mud isnt suggesting you run those cards, he is just using them to give a comparison on the relative power level of 4 and 5 drops in the format.

My suggestion would be.

-2 Furor of the Bitten
-2 Bloodlord of Vaasgoth
-2 Sphere of the Suns
-2 Markov Blademaster
-2 Bloodline Keeper
-2 Swamp
-2 Mountain

+4 Blood Artist
+2 Falkenrath Exterminator
+2 Pillar of Flame
+2 Isolated Chapel
+4 Blackcleave Cliffs

The 2 Bloodline Keeper should be moved to the SB for the Control matchup (as Mud already mentioned).

"I have existed from the morning of the world and I shall exist until the last star falls from the night. Although I have taken the form of Gaius Caligula, I am all men as I am no man and therefore I am a God."
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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 5:16AM #9
Kaden_Shadows
Date Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 115

May 16, 2012 -- 5:02AM, Eonblueapocalypse1 wrote:

May 16, 2012 -- 4:36AM, Kaden_Shadows wrote:

May 16, 2012 -- 4:24AM, zpikduM wrote:

Look at the other relevant turn 4's in the format:
Wolf Run Ramp : Primeval Titan
Delver : Equip Runechanter's Pike , stab you. alternately, Lingering Souls flash back, Pike.

These are much more powerful plays then your turn 5 play in Bloodlord.


Only problem with the ones you've given (And I know not where to go to research relevant 4's, I'm fairly new) is that they use off color mana. I only have 2 Sphere of the Suns, you think that'll be enough help?




Mud isnt suggesting you run those cards, he is just using them to give a comparison on the relative power level of 4 and 5 drops in the format.

My suggestion would be.

-2 Furor of the Bitten
-2 Bloodlord of Vaasgoth
-2 Sphere of the Suns
-2 Markov Blademaster
-2 Bloodline Keeper
-2 Swamp
-2 Mountain

+4 Blood Artist
+2 Falkenrath Exterminator
+2 Pillar of Flame
+2 Isolated Chapel
+4 Blackcleave Cliffs

The 2 Bloodline Keeper should be moved to the SB for the Control matchup (as Mud already mentioned).


I see. Well, then, my (not really asked) question stands: where do I find examples of relevant 4 drops? The only vampire 4 drops I know of are Olivia, Falkenrath Aristocrat, and Heirs of Stromkirk, unless I'm missing something...?

Also, why cut all that stuff you mentioned? There's no way in the world I could add the Blackcleave Cliffs or the Chapels, for starters. I know I didn't mention it, but I am on a tight budget. Further suggestion?

Thanks in advance~!

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1 year ago  ::  May 16, 2012 - 5:59AM #10
Eonblueapocalypse1
Date Joined: Dec 17, 2010
Posts: 1,713
Olivia, Bloodline Keeper, and Falkenrath Aristocrat are the only playable 4 mana vampires in the format. The rest are all pretty sub-par.

As I said before, Mud wasn't suggesting you run those cards in your deck, he was using them as a comparison to show you how the vampire 4 drops stack up to the 4 drops being run in other popular archetypes.

As for where to find what cards are relevant in the meta at the moment, my suggestion would be to look into some recent tournament results for as many different archetypes as you can. This should give you some sort of basis for what is being played in the current meta. After awhile of playing, card evaluation skills begin to really develop and you can start to determine what cards are relevant in the meta and which ones aren't by yourself (although one should never stop paying attention to tournament results if one wishes to keep their finger on the pulse of the meta).

As for what I suggested cutting.

Furor of the Bitten is just a terrible card. It is not really that great to begin with, but being an Aura, it tends to set you up to get 2 for 1'd.

Sphere of the Suns isn't really doing much for you in this list outside of mana fixing. It allows you to get out your 4 drops a turn sooner, but in an agressive deck such as this, in most cases you are just better off running more "gas"

Bloodlord of Vaasgoth isn't really worth it for its mana cost. It just doesn't do enough to be worth running.

Markov Blademaster while potentially powerful, is very weak to removal at the moment, and its low toughness means most of the time it is just going to get eaten by most things when you send it into the red zone.

Bloodline Keeper is better suited to the SB. It is a very powerful card, but it is often too slow to do much of anything outside of matchups against Control.

As for inclusions.

Pillar of Flame is one of the best burn spells in the meta at the moment. It has a surprisingly large number of targets in the meta, and effectively shuts off Undying/LTB effects.

Blood Artist is surprisingly good as well. Not as good here as it is in the zombie decks running around, but still a pretty solid 2 drop.

Falkenrath Exterminator honestly isn't really that good of a card, but it helps out your curve(being that it is a 2 drop). The 2 drop vampires are pretty slim pickings. Of the six 2 drop vampires currently legal in Standard, only Blood Artist is actually considered playable. Vampire Interloper may actually be a better option here.

As for the mana, having those extra duals will help quite a bit in fixing your mana. I can understand not wanting to spend the money on them though, and can't blame you there. That being said, duals are one of the few things that are really worth the money, since they can be used in multiple decks easily enough and tend to retain a decent amount of value even after they rotate out of Standard.

Duals or not, you should probably bump the land count up to 24 if you plan on playing 4 drops consistently on turn 4.

Edit: Honestly Rakish Heir really isn't that great of a card either. Much like the 2 drops though, basically all of the 3 drop vampires outside of Captain Kirk are pretty terrible, and even he isn't really that great. Out of all of them though, Rakish Heir is probably the best outside of Stromkirk Captain , at least in terms of a deck running all vamps.
"I have existed from the morning of the world and I shall exist until the last star falls from the night. Although I have taken the form of Gaius Caligula, I am all men as I am no man and therefore I am a God."
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